From http://wtvt.com/investreptr/jihad.html (link to report with photos)

======
It's a show that won't make the Saturday morning lineup on any American
network. But it has had a prominent slot on Palestinian TV. The program
lacks the same slick production value of an American children's show, but
it's just as influential. It's called The Children's Club. 

It comes complete with puppet shows, games, songs and a very chilling
message about becoming a suicide bomber. A little girl sings in Arabic
about her ultimate ambition in life. 

(Song Translation) "Oh sing my sister constantly about my life as a
suicide warrior."

Another girl screams about preparing to die. 

Teaching to hate

(Song Translation) "I foresee my death, but I march quickly. Am I afraid?
Life has little value because I'm returning to my lord and my people will
know I am a hero."

That message is repeated again and again in song and verse. 

(Song Translation) "I will come at the time of drought with my best
efforts bring a machine gun, violence anger, anger, anger..."

The children, most of them elementary school age, shout a message of
violence. 

"I will return with the dawn of tomorrow. It is my conviction of launch a
 jihad."

Girl shouting a message of violence

(Song Translation) "When I wander into Jerusalem, I'll turn into a suicide
warrior in battle dress, in battle dress, in battle dress." 

A teacher cheers them on, "Bravo, bravo, bravo."

If you're like most Americans, you had no idea that the show existed, but
the Children's Club is no secret to Israelis. 

"I am still shocked every time I see it," says Hela Crown-Tamir who lived
in Israel for 19 years. 

?Imagine a teacher telling them bravo, "Crown-Tamir says, "because they're
going to grow up to be a militant Islamic suicide bomber.? 

Hela Crown-Tamir

Crown-Tamir moved back to The Tampa Bay area to escape the violence that
ruined her travel business. She says Americans are just now waking up to
the realities Israelis have been facing for years, that children are
trained as suicide bombers. Because it's so dramatic, some Israeli groups
have used excerpts from The Children's Club to produce a campaign against
Palestinian leader Yassir Arafat. 

But are Palestinian children really educated this way? Or is this just an
Israeli propaganda tool? We contacted several Islamic groups in the Tampa
Bay area, but no one from any of those organizations would even agree to
watch the tape. 

Professor Abdelwahab Hachiche

But University of South Florida professor Abdelwahab Hachiche did agree to
watch it. 

"I always keep a reasonable degree of skepticism about anything I see or
 anything I read."

Hachiche is an internationally recognized expert on Mideast terrorism.
He's also an Arab and a Moslem. Until we gave him the tape, he'd never
heard of the show. And while he says he has no idea who produced it, he
says the translations are accurate and the problem is real. 

"And the indoctrination and the danger of indoctrination is very, very
 serious.?"

Dr. Hachiche calls this kind of teaching nothing short of infanticide. But
he hopes children growing up in today's Islamic world will ultimately
reject these messages of hatred. 

"On both sides the younger generation are looking for true leaders who
 will have the courage to overcome this passion that is leading to mutual
 destruction."

Still, in the mid-east the violence continues. And now even in America
we're looking terrorism right in the face-- listening and wondering if
this is the voice of the future. 

Give us some feedback! What's your opinion? Click here to send an e-mail
to FOX13 Investigates. http://wtvt.com/investreptr/mail2.html
======

269 responses total.

Ahad Ha'am, a spiritual Zionist spoke of a Jewish "supernation": "The nation
of Israel as a supernation - the modern version of the chosen people - can
in this way be expanded into a true system". 24 

Moses Hess maintained that "Every Jew has the makings of a Messiah, every
Jewess that of a Mater Dolorosa." Ahad Ha'am stated that "we feel ourselves
to be the aristocracy of history." Herzl declared that "our race is more
efficient in everything than most other peoples of the earth." In 1957 Ben
Gurion asserted the same notion. "I believe in our moral and intellectual
superiority to serve as a model for the redemption of the human race."25 

This concept was then drilled into the minds of Israeli school children. One
of these pupils wrote in 1968: 

I am a pupil in a college in Be'er Sheva. I don't want trouble. The director
of the office of education will not like my letter; therefore I am not signing
my full name. 
The problem: KHUZARI BOOK, which is approved by the office of education. In
the introduction to the book Dr. Tzifroni writes: 
"The nation of Israel is a chosen nation because of its race, its education
and the climate of the land in which it was brought up. The race of the
Israeli people is the most superior of all races." I think that these
sentences require no explanation. 
Mira, Be'er Sheva 
(Published in "Haolam Haze", an Israeli newspaper, (issue 1954) and quoted
in "Israel Imperial News", October 1968.26)
Thus, the concept of a "chosen race" in Zionism differs from that in Nazism,
only in the identity of that race being the "Jewish" rather than the "Aryan"
race.27 

From the very beginning of their settlement in Palestine, the Zionists pursued
policies based on the denial of the Palestinian people or their presence in
Palestine. Golda Meir quoted in the Sunday Times, 15 June 1969: 

"There was no such thing as Palestinians. They did not exist."28
This de-humanising concept of Zionist ideology seemed make it possible for
the Zionists to expel, dispossess and oppress the Palestinians with ease.
Herzl spoke of expelling the Palestinians rather casually: 

"We shall try to spirit the penniless population across the border by
procuring employment for it in the transit countries, while denying it any
employment in our own country."29
Zionism preached and Israel implemented the policies of expulsion and
oppression of non-Jews (Muslim and Christian Palestinians). It is these
practices that brought about the passage on November 10,1975, by an
overwhelming majority by the U.N. General Assembly, of the resolution
designating "Zionism as a form of racism." This brought about the hysterical
outcry from U.N. and other Western politicians and media who spoke of
revulsion and obscenity and protestations by Zionists that Zionism is Judaism.
As we heard earlier many dedicated Jewish scholars reject, as blasphemous,
the notion that equates Judaism with Zionism. Other Zionists brought up the
novel idea that "Zionism is the national liberation movement of Jews". Be that
as it may, we should set aside all emotionalism and look objectively not at
the theoretical definition, regardless whether it is true or false, but at
Zionism in PRACTICE. 

ROTFLMAO!

Ironically, a great many of the non-Zionists who stayed in Eurpoe were
eliminated in the  Holocaust. So now, Zionism and Judaism may be more closely
linkied than they were in the past.  I think a global thromonuclear war would
cure a lot of these problems. 

What is peculiar about #0 is the inherent admission that it is not
established that this is Palestinian and  not Israeli propaganda. It
is said:

"But are Palestinian children really educated this way? Or is this just an
 Israeli propaganda tool? We contacted several Islamic groups in the Tampa
 Bay area, but no one from any of those organizations would even agree to
 watch the tape."

How can there be any questiona about this? The source of the broadcasts
can be easily established with direction finding equipment. If it is being
produced by anti-Isreali Arabs, then they would be claiming they are doing
so. It has all the symptoms of being propaganda.

I'm not sure that means anything.  I think that the Palestinians are 
aware that knowledge of this would cause a public outcry all over the 
world.  Maybe they just don't want to admit it?

Maybe it isn't true.  I don't think I'd count mvpel as any kind of accurate
or unbiased source.

Re #5: how can anyone not have knowledge of it if it is true? And why
is one of the title shots in English - so Americans can understand
it - and who would want America to understand it?  

        I knew there was something sinister and wrong about the Flintstones
commercials.

re: "#4  What is peculiar about #0 is the inherent admission that it is not
established that this is Palestinian and  not Israeli propaganda.."

Yes, we know, curlie.  And the Sept 11 attacks were masterminded by the
Mossad.

#0 itself leaves the question uncertain. If they don't know, who does?

So Carrie equates self-promotion (which apparently is no longer going
on) with indoctrination to murder in the here-and-now?  I don't see
them as being anything close to moral equivalents, so I don't understand
why she's juxtaposing #1 against #0.

Re #7:  I regularly encounter people who are surprised at truths I
consider common knowledge.  Just the other day I found that someone
I've known for many years had no idea that certain cancers are
associated with AIDS.

If there is a conspiracy of Bavarian Illiterati, it's damn big. ;-)

resp #3: Certainly with the entire population of the entire planet 
extinct, all problems would cease.  But we couldn't rejoice in it, 
being dead and all.

russ i think you're old enough to know that people schooled in israel in the
50's-60's are probably still alive and running the country.

It is a shame some children are raised to hate.
http://www.nimn.org/images/woman_being_kicked.jpg

re #4: Israel is not always refined in its propaganda, as evidenced by
       Ariel Sharon's "terrorism" mantra, but this type of thing is far
       more likely either the genuine product of a group like Islamic
       Jihad, or the product of an anti-Palestinian hate group like
       Kahane Chai.

       The fact that the broadcast of the tape cannot be confirmed
       indicates, if nothing else, that it was given to the news station
       as part of an anti-Palestinian propaganda effort. When Israeli
       troops broadcast pornography to the towns they captured in their
       recent incursions, it took no more than a day for the reports to
       be confirmed. And there are propaganda organizations which actively
       monitor Arab language media for anything that will look bad in
       translation. There simply is no chance that this could have been
       broadcast, let alone regularly broadcast, without that claim being
       easily confirmed.

Personally, I think that both groups have gone overboard, but that's 
just me.

re15:  beautiful link!

This response has been erased.

Re #14:  And people schooled in the 50's and 60's have had plenty of
experience to modify any part of said teaching which doesn't correspond
to reality.  If someone graduated from high school in 1969 at the age
of 18, they are now about 51 years old.  If they *haven't* changed
plenty of their views in that time, they aren't smart enough to be
running anything more complicated than a taxi or sewing machine.

How much experience does a 10-yr-old get between his last lesson in
martyrdom and the time he straps on his explosive vest?  Carrie, you
cannot possibly be as dense as #14 makes you look.  Or so I hope.

I graduated in 1968 at the age of 18 and am 51.  Your example would have
graduated at age 19, I think.

Re #19:  Even years of experience won't change some people's minds.  There
are still a fair number of 50-60 year old people around who are worried about
Communists, for instance.

I hate to say this Russ, but you really don't seem to understand people.

This response has been erased.

russ you obviously have changed your mind much since the thwarted education
you got way back when..


a lot of people are racist or ignorant becuase they were brought up to be that
way by parents or educators. and yes they ARE (apparently) smart enough to
hold office. don't make start citing.

Re #23:  I didn't say they *had* to have changed their views, I said
they'd had plenty of opportunity (and almost certainly had on at least
some issues - maybe just not the ones you or I would like).

But you keep dodging the question, Carrie:  How much experience does
a 10-yr-old Palestinian martyr-trainee get between the last video
praising those who kill Israelis and strapping on his bomb?  How much
opportunity does he have to reconsider?

It is unfortunate that oval didn't provide the source of her anti-Semitic
tirade in #1, or the references embedded in the text.

The concept of the "Super Jew" was not Ahad Ha'am's (a pseudonym meaning,
literally and figuratively, "one of the people") but Jabotinsky's. But
the concept is delivered out of context. The "super Jew" wasn't superior
to the rest of the world, but to the "yid", the old-world Jew.

http://www.nytimes.com/books/first/r/rubinstein-herzl.html

Then we have a reference to The Khurazi, written in Spain in 1080.

http://judaism.about.com/library/glossary/bldef-p_judahhalevi.htm

So according to a letter published in a magazine that was referenced
in another journal, an introduction to it spoke of Jews as "chosen" and
"superior". I've never heard of "Israel Imperial News" (being a news whore,
that says a lot) and the only web hit was for a fraudulent story about
Arabs not being allowed to bathe in Israel's beaches, a story I can refute
from personal experience -- and since Matt thought it was funny that devout
Muslim women would bathe in their "dress", I have photos to prove this if
it must really come down to that.)

So in any event, building upon a common misconception of the "Chosen People"
(See agora36 item 121), and based on a handful of quotes (some wrong,
some highly suspect) spanning many years, out comes the conclusion that
Jews think of themselves as a superior race -- just like nazi concepts of
the superior Aryan race.

Even if all the references were true, accurate and in context, the conclusion
would be false. For one counter example, consider that every year, during
Passover, Jews methodically preach that they are the descendents of slaves.

Grexers readily let this pass, condoning it with their silence, but are
quick to ponder if the story in #0 is real or propaganda. It's actually an
old story (I referenced it on Grex over a year ago), dating from 1998 and
it is true. The local FOX station carried the report along with commentary
from local Arabs. None questioned the source -- and with good reason.

While Grexers might find the existence of such programs shocking and thus
defensively question the credibility of such reports, those more familiar
with the region (the Arab professor in Florida, local Arabs in Detroit)
realize that it's par for the course.

The Saudi religious police did force girls back into a burning building,
to their death, lest their uncovered face be seen in public.

A Saudi professor, writing in a government controlled Saudi paper, wrote
of Jews using Muslim blood for holiday food. Egyptian TV broadcast a
"documentary" about this, too.

The NY Times wrote that a PA newspaper opined that those who speak against
the use of children at violent demonstrations are "collaborators" and
should be dealt with accordingly (murdered).

But we shouldn't believe that a program such as the Children Club would be
aired by Palestinian TV -- the same TV that runs commercials of "martyred"
children calling for other children to come join them in paradise?

For confirmation of the story and more examples of such stories, see:

http://www.matckh.org/articles/Jihad_for_kids_on_PLO-TV.htm
http://www.nclci.org/Issues/palestinian_tv_and_radio_teach.htm
http://www.wikipedia.com/wiki/Arab_anti-semitism
http://www.jcpa.org/jl/vp441.htm

i wasn't aware that any 10-year olds had blown themselves up.

None have - but when have Russ or Leeron ever cared about the facts?

Fancy that. Oval can't defend #1 and instead she and Aaron (what a
couple!) zoom in on one detail. Unfortunately for them, one of the
suicide bombers/murderers in Jenin was a 10-year old boy, so even
their nit-picking is factually incorrect.

So let's get back to more sources documenting the "Children's Club"
and similar hateful incitement and child abuse:

http://www.operationsick.com/reports/20001218_mediawatch.htm

http://www.operationsick.com/articles/20010626_usatodaysuicideterrorists.as
p

        The Sickening World of Suicide Terrorists
        By Jack Kelley, USA TODAY, Tuesday, June 26, 2001

        In the Palestinian Authority, an entire generation of children is
        being raised for death--with official government endorsement. A
        chilling look into a world that manipulates children to become killers.

        ...

        At an Islamic school in Gaza City run by Hamas, 11-year-old
        Palestinian student Ahmed's small frame and boyish smile are
        deceiving. They mask a determination to kill at any cost. "I will
        make my body a bomb that will blast the flesh of Zionists, the sons
        of pigs and monkeys," Ahmed says. "I will tear their bodies into
        little pieces and cause them more pain than they will ever know." 

        "Allahu Akbar," his classmates shout in response: "God is great." 

        "May the virgins give you pleasure," his teacher yells, referring
        to one of the rewards awaiting martyrs in paradise. Even the
        principal smiles and nods his approval. 

        ...

        While flirting with one of the girls, [Tel Aviv's Dolphinarium disco
        bomber] Hotari triggered the explosives. The blast was so intense
        that it tore limbs from the victims' bodies, scattered their flesh
        up to six blocks away and vaporized Hotari and the girl next to him. 

        It killed 21 people, in addition to Hotari, and injured nearly 100. 

        Now, nearly 30 days later, his parents are preparing to mark the
        anniversary of his death, as devout Muslims often do. 

        "My prayer is that Saeed's brothers, friends and fellow Palestinians
        will sacrifice their lives, too," Hotari's father says. "There is no
        better way to show God you love him."

****big red shiny button on leeron****

**POOOOOSH**

"wind him up and watch him *squeal*"

Are you suggesting that oval wasn't serious in #1?
Sorry, but I doubt it.

The subject of this item is "Jihad for Children".

Does anyone still doubt #0?
Any comments about #25 or #28?

I still doubt #0 and I have no comments about #25 or #28.

I never doubted it.  Children are by far the most easily manipulated.  
If you want an army of raving maniacs, raid a nursery school and feed 
the children a lot of stuff about how glorious suicide bombings are 
and how hideous and evil the people you want them to hate are.  They 
will carry this with them all their lives.

I dont doubt that such a tape exists and that it was produced with the 
intent of having lots of Palestinian children see it. I do doubt that 
it was broadcast as part of the Palestinian main stream media. 

i think watching israeli tanks bulldoze your family's house and destroy your
neighborhood in general is quite effective in brewing hatred in people of all
ages. tv shows not neccessary.

How would you know, oval? Have you ever had *YOUR* house bulldozed???

yes! AND I AM *PISSED*!!!!!!

i'm also hungry. very hungry. and since the electricity's gone i can;t even
watch my jihad jew-hater tv show! if they'd just let the UN in i could stop
living off toe cheese and my own sweat, since the rain water i've collected
has run out.

I think it may be inciteful (er, insightful) to look at history, Lynne.
Do you know what caused the 1929 riots in Hebron in which the Jewish
population was massacred?

Was it Arab complaints that Jews were stealing the land?  No.
As various commissions of inquiry concluded that Jews were purchasing
uncultivated land and that it was the increase in the Arab population
(drawn from surrounding country by Jewish development) that was causing
a squeeze.

In 1929, the "grand" mufti of Jerusalem created forged photographs of
the Al Aqsa mosque, pictures that showed it being destroyed by Jews.
The doctored photos were then distributed and, voila, instant riot.

The same motif continues today. The wave of terrorism that began anew
in 1994 wasn't the result of "occupation" or "brutal oppression".
Surely, after 27 years the timing seems wrong -- just after the signing
of the Oslo Accords and in a period of new hope.

Nor could it possibly explain terrorism prior to 1967.

Nor can it explain terrorism in 2000, following the dismantling of
Israel's rule in the territories (I noticed an interesting thing on
the ICRC's web site: they do not consider the areas under PA Authority
to be "occupied" -- recall that 98% of the Arabs of the territories
already live under PA rule).

So while western apologists rush to provide different explanations and
excuses for Arab terrorism, seemingly pushed into irrelevance is the
terrorists' own stated reasons -- clearly outlined in the PLO Convenant,
the PNC's Two-Phase plan, the Hamas Covenant -- and reiterated by Arab
leaders in Arabic on a daily basis.

The painfully simple truth is that the terrorists oppose compromise
and peace with Israel. They strike at Israel because it exists.
As they themselves say, they don't need any other reason, excuse,
rationalization or justification.

- Backtalk version 1.3.30 - Copyright 1996-2006, Jan Wolter and Steve Weiss