Here is some discussion from the happy item, moved here so as not to 
further disrupt the happy item:

#635 of 661 by Sindi Keesan (keesan) on Mon May 20 19:28:50 2002: 

There are three large loud dogs in adjacent properties that bark 
whenever we or two other sets of neighbors go into our yards (or walk 
by on the street), for 20 minutes at a time.  We were out near the back 
fence yesterday getting barked at, and the neighbor attached his hose 
and we sprayed it up and over the 6' wooden fence and the barking went 
away and did not come back.  Maybe the dogs will associate that corner 
with sudden storms?  Anyway, the good news is that the owner is moving 
away any day now (but the bad news it will probably be rented out and 
is in bad shape and may attract more people who only like it for the 
huge fenced yard suitable for dogs).  The pit bull on the leash in the 
other yard is staying, but may bark less on its own.

Jim thinks the land might be worth more without that house as it will be
difficult or impossible to get the floors level.



#637 of 661 by S. Lynne Fremont (slynne) on Tue May 21 09:31:09 2002: 

There arent enough barking dogs in the world, imho. I have decided that 
as a landlord, I am going to *require* any tenents/roommates to have a 
least one dog. 


#638 of 661 by Sindi Keesan (keesan) on Tue May 21 09:38:13 2002: 

Maybe that would work better than my landlord's written no-pets policy, 
which allowed a crazy person with two barking dogs to move into one 
apartment, and someone else with a dog that barked all night into 
another one, and someone else to tie up two Chihuahas on the porch all 
day.  He is getting better now at spotting dog owners BEFORE they move 
in.  The barking dogs in back of my place have nearly succeeded in 
knocking down one sectionof wooden fence but luckily that is the one 
installed against my 8' chainlink fence so I am safe.



#639 of 661 by Reverend Salvador Dali Parton (happyboy) on Tue May 21 
10:07:38 2002: 

you should live in a nunnery.



#641 of 661 by Anne or something (mooncat) on Tue May 21 12:32:31 2002: 

re #638- Sindi- I really really hope that you don't think all dog 
owners are that irresponsible. 

Yeah, there are a lot of irresponsible pet owners out there who don't 
take proper care of their pets- but all this does is make it a lot 
harder for those people who do have pets (like my roommate and myself) 
to find places to live.

Dogs will bark from time to time- they're rather territorial creatures- 
however a responsible owner won't let it go on and on and on.

Sounds pretty much like you've just had really bad luck with dog 
owners. It's too bad.

re #637- so uh... when you renting next? ;) <would like to get a dog, 
but since she and roomie have between them a dog and cat the apartment 
people say they can't have anymore pets>



#643 of 661 by S. Lynne Fremont (slynne) on Tue May 21 13:59:18 2002: 

If my dogs are in my yard and it is during daytime hours, I will let 
them go on and on and I dont consider that irresponsible. But then, I 
didnt start that until I bought a house. When I lived in an apartment, 
I never let them be outside unsupervised. 

If my neighbor wanted to squirt them with the hose, I wouldnt get mad 
but would think it was kind of funny because the dogs would learn that 
the mean neighbor turns the hose on them which would make them bark 
more. 

Heh, My current roommate is planning on moving out in December of 2003 
but might stay longer (she isnt sure)


#644 of 661 by Sindi Keesan (keesan) on Tue May 21 15:20:53 2002: 

There are city laws against dogs barking for long periods or in the 
middle of the night and I do consider it irresponsible to inflict that 
much noise on the neighbors even in the daytime. If your dogs keep 
barking, train them not to do so, or keep them inside.  One of my 
neighbors used to put a chair in front of the high window so his dog 
could watch people go by and bark whenever it saw anyone, at all hours, 
for 10 minutes or longer.  When we complained he told us we should take 
his hidden key any time the dog barked, go into his apartment, and 
close the curtain.  I did this a few times at 3 am and was glad when he 
moved.  He cared a lot more about the dog's entertainment than the 
neighbors' sleep.  I put up with it. The only time I ever reported a 
barking dog was the crazy neighbor who kept running up parking fines 
for all the other neighbors if they happened to park within 4' of the 
driveway that she was not using (under 2' of snow).


#645 of 661 by John Ellis Perry Jr. (jep) on Tue May 21 15:27:48 2002: 

I'm not sure how much it has to do with being happy, but one night 
before I moved at the start of this year, the neighbor's dog was 
barking constantly all night.  This is in the country more or less, but 
I couldn't sleep.  I went down the hill and banged on his door at 2:30 
a.m. to ask him to shut his dogs up.  After that we didn't have too 
warm of a relationship, but I had to be able to sleep.

I could have called the police; the previous tenants in that house had 
done so.  Unfortunately he didn't see the advantage of that, but I did 
think I was being nicer than I had to be.


#646 of 661 by Anne or something (mooncat) on Tue May 21 16:00:50 2002: 

Sylvia and I currently live in an apartment, and while her dog does 
bark at people who walk by (she's of the opinion that the courtyard is 
also part of her territory), but she doesn't bark and bark and bark... 

In any case, IHB I live with a great cat and dog (not to mention 
roomie) AND all the siblings' wedding plans are coming along 
swimmingly. :)


#649 of 661 by Insert name here (bhelliom) on Tue May 21 17:04:45 2002: 

Re# 638 It is rather unfortunate that you've had bad pet owners as 
neighbors.  However I do not believe that responsible pet owner should 
share in the censure.  Fewer apartments complexes and landlords of 
single family homes are allowing tenents with pets to rent, often 
because of those horrid and irresponsible pet owners out there.  At 
this point, you pretty much have to own your own home in order to have 
a pet.  Much of this is hardly necessary if folks would actually 
refrain from lumping all pet owners into one group, and take them on a 
case by case basis.  I can certainly understand the desire to restrict 
certain breeds and the desire to live in a quiet place without 
irresponsible pet owners and their ill-trained pets, but the current 
state of affairs borders on the ridiculous.



#655 of 661 by S. Lynne Fremont (slynne) on Wed May 22 09:22:25 2002: 

Train my dogs NOT to bark? I like to hear them barking. They dont bark 
at night and as far as I know, there are no ordinances about barking 
during the daytime. 



#656 of 661 by Sindi Keesan (keesan) on Wed May 22 09:51:21 2002: 

There are indeed ordinances, at least in Ann Arbor, about noise, and a 
special dog person to enforce them.  Do you like to have dogs barking 
five feet from your ears the whole time you are in your back yard?  My 
neighbors on both sides told me that theyno longer use their back yards 
because of the dog noise.  You may be the only person who likes to hear 
your dogs barking. I have never heard these neighbors complain about 
ANYTHING else and one of them feeds stray cats and birds and the other 
one has a dog (that does not bark even when left outside).  And a cat.  
I said nothing to imply that all dogs bark, it is just a few that are 
problems.
        
Landlords don't like to rent to pets because of the risk that the pet
will urinate all over the rugs and walls, and scratch up the woodwork 
and doors.  Some landlords accept pets with an extra security deposit 
and an extra $15/month rent sort of as insurance.  I removed all the 
rugs from my apartment when I moved in after a pet owner (but could not 
repair the door which had 1/2" of wood scratched off the edge of it).  
Pets also have fleas, to whichI am allergic (only the outdoor pets 
usually have them).  
        I like most cats and dogs but would not rent to them.



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#657 of 661 by Insert name here (bhelliom) on Wed May 22 10:19:53 2002: 

I don't think any of us with pets need a patronizing reminder of why 
landlords shy away from renting to pet owners.  Refer to my last 
posting about irresponsible pet owners and you see my reply to this.  I 
won't repeat myself. I get sick of being punished because of 
irresponsible pet owners and the biases of those that don't own any 
pets at all.

I am also allergic to fleas.  But, since I am one of those responsible 
pet owners of which I speak, my dog has never had them.  Dogs that are 
kept outside can be more vulnerable to fleas unless the pet own takes 
the proper precautions.

Keep in mind, Keesan, in mind that your back yard is next to that dog's 
territory.  The fact that he is ill-trained and does not stop barking 
is unfortunate.  However, you're not going to get them to stop barking 
altogether for that very reason.  Some dogs are not as laid-back.  My 
dog barks more when I am home than she does when I am away, which I 
believe is because she is trying to alert me to something.  She's just 
really starting to do this, so she doesn't yet know what is kosher and 
what is not.  Because my dog is well trained, she listens when I tell 
her to stop barking. However, I'm not going to tell her to stop barking 
until after I've ascertained that she doesn't need to.  The last thing 
I want her to do is not bark when she *should*.



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#658 of 661 by Brooke Edmunds (edina) on Wed May 22 10:21:27 2002: 

Five feet from your ears?  Are you standing on top of the dog or 
something? Look - dogs bark - if it's an issue, call the cops.

#659 of 664 by S. Lynne Fremont (slynne) on Wed May 22 10:39:04 2002: 

I am pretty sure that even in Ann Arbor, the dog barking ordinance (if 
there even is one rather than a general noise ordinance) does not apply 
to the day time hours. But, since I live in Ypsilanti where folks are a 
bit more laid back, I dont worry about it. I doubt there is such an 
ordinance in Ypsi but even if there is one, it obviously isnt enforced. 

I have a command I give my dogs when I want them to stop barking. But 
mostly I encourage the barking because I want to know if someone is 
walking by my house or if someone is out back or whatever. Part of the 
whole reason I got a dog is because of the barking. 

Sometimes, they just have fun barking and that makes me smile. I put up 
with all kinds of crap from my neighbors and in return, they put up 
with my crap. That is how it works sometimes. I guess if my neighbor 
got pissy about the dogs, I would make an effort to keep them quiet. 
But then I probably would complain about all the old cars he has. Then, 
he might complain that I never finished painting my fence. Which might 
inspire me to complain that he hasnt mowed his front lawn in a while.  
And then someday when he wants to string up phone wire and hang blinds 
on the *outside* of his windows for some crazy reason, I might go ahead 
and complain to the city. 

Geez, relax already. If a dog is outside barking all night, that is one 
thing but a dog barking for a few hours in the afternoon doesnt seem 
like that big of a deal to me. 






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#660 of 664 by Sindi Keesan (keesan) on Wed May 22 10:43:06 2002: 

The dog in question was jumping repeatedly against the 6' solid wood 
fence
and had nearly succeeded in knocking down a section of it.  We were 
attempting
to do some gardening near the fence.  We don't need to call the dog 
person
(the cops do not handle this) because the dogs will be leaving any day 
now.
Any time we go in the yard and the dogs are on the other side of the 
fence
they bark continuously.  Most of the time their owner is not home.  
When she
was showing the house (for sale) the dogs were not there.  They are in 
the
yard most of the time, including all night.  Does anyone want to start a
barking dogs and rental to pets item?
        Any dog that goes outside is liable to picking up fleas from 
grass
where another dog has been.  How would you prevent this?



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#661 of 664 by Sindi Keesan (keesan) on Wed May 22 10:46:46 2002: 

Would it seem like a big deal to you if, any time you went in your 
yard, two
large dogs barked continuously at you the whole time you were there?
The two dogs are behind a fence.  THe third, a pit bull, is on a long 
leash
and goes into my other neighbors' yard and digs up their perennials.  
They
are afraid to use their yard in case it gets loose.  They have small 
kids.
When one dog starts barking, the others start barking and it goes on 
for half
an hour, at all hours.  The dog person in Ann Arbor said that there are 
no
hours when barking (for long periods) is permitted.



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#662 of 664 by Brooke Edmunds (edina) on Wed May 22 11:00:24 2002: 

I think you are talking about a multitude of things, but what it boils 
down to is you aren't a dog person.

Fleas?  Easy - the new flea meds are awesome.  My cats have become
indoor/outdoor and they totally alleviate the flea issues.

People have a pitbull?  That's a bit different than a barking dog - 
that's a safety issue.

All I see now is you pitching a fit *after* the fact.  For as strident 
as you are on pizza flyers, I really don't see how you have let 
something that seems to annoy you so much slide.



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#663 of 664 by Mark A. Conger (aruba) on Wed May 22 11:04:35 2002: 

Sindi, maybe you could make friends with the dog.  If you fed it dog
biscuits when you were in the yard, it might like you better.



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#664 of 664 by Brooke Edmunds (edina) on Wed May 22 11:08:17 2002: 

Provided you can find a vegan, gluten free dog biscuit to feed it.

33 responses total.

I do have neighbors who have barking dogs. They are two houses down. My 
dogs and their dogs bark at each other. Anyhow, to answer your 
question, no it would not seem like a big deal to me if everytime I 
went out in my yard, the neighbors dog barked at me. 

If there was a danger that the dogs might damage my fence, I probably 
would go over and talk to the neighbor about it. They probably would 
want to know that their dogs might escape. If the neighbors were jerks 
and did nothing about the fence damage, I would probably either just 
try to fix the fence or else I would let them break it down and escape. 

None of my neighbors leaves their dogs outside all night so I dont have 
that issue. If I did, I have to say, it probably wouldnt bother me 
except that I think it is mean to the dogs to leave them outside all 
night. 

Yeah, I put Frontline(tm) flea stuff on my dogs and they never have 
fleas. It works great!

I'm not convinced its really about the barking, as much as its about these
being big, rather dangerous dogs that attempt to get at Sindi from behind a
fence the entire time she is in the yard.  That seems like a much bigger
issue, and a much different one, from a barking dog.

My parents have a dog that barks incessantly at people who walk by the house.
She stops barking when they are a house or two away.  This makes my parents
feel better.

Benjie is also the most harmless dog on the planet, as anyone who has ever
met her will say.

However, the giving her a biscuit to make her like you thing doesn't work on
her at all.  She just takes it, chews it, and keeps barking at you because
you are a stranger on her property.

My parents live in a neighborhood where there are no fences and almost 
everyone lets their dogs roam. My dog Crissy got it into her head to 
bark at this one particular neighbor for some reason. Everytime I heard 
her barking I would go over there and talk to the neighbor so she would 
see that he belonged there. Then he started giving her treats... One 
time I was curious about where she goes when she goes on her 
neighborhood "rounds" so I followed her. She walked over to this guy's 
house and stood by the back door. She barked once...waited about 30 
seconds...barked again...then he opens the back door, hands her a dog 
biscuit, pats her on the head and closes the door. As if *that* wasnt 
enough, she repeated the same thing at the house next door! Anyhow, she 
doesnt bark at that neighbor anymore. 

A reverse Pavlov!!!  How nice!

Sindi wrote this in another item but it is relevant to the discussion 
in this item:

Ypsilanti has a public nuisance ordinance that also pertains to 
animals.  They do not allow 'continued or repeated howling or barking' 
which is excessive or annoying to neighbors or 'unreasonably annoys 
persons or interferes with their rights'.  He says most complaints are 
about dogs making noise in the middle of the night, but any excessive 
barking can be prosecuted.  Basically, they only act if someone 
complains.  So if you are going to have a noisy dog you had better be 
nice to your neighbors.  The only noisy dog I ever reported was owned 
by someone who was refusing to talk to anyone in five apartments, had 
very loud parties and blew all the fuses in the house, reported three 
other people for parking within 4' of 'her' driveway, etc. The same 
neighbor came home drunk one night having lost her key and broke into 
what she thought was her window but happened to be in another 
apartment.  Two people told me she was a drug dealer.  The point of 
calling the city was to induce her to move away - if you want to modify 
someone's behavior you start by discussing it with them but she was 
past that point.

Right, there is no specific dog barking ordinance but rather a very 
broad and general ordinance. Perhaps one that would be difficult to 
enforce. At most, if a neighbor complained, they would send someone 
over to say "hey, the dog barking is bugging the neighbor" You see most 
of those ordinances are written very subjectively. What is "continued 
barking and howling?" Is it 24/7 or 10 minutes?


Anyhow, I am nice to my neighbors and they are nice to me. No one seems 
bothered by my dogs or the other dogs in the neighborhood. There are 
some guys on the next block who get bent out of shape by my next door 
neighbors cars (he collects junkers and parks them on the street). But 
they dont bug me so I never rat him out to the cops. Well ok, they *do* 
bug me but he is so nice about every other thing including my barking 
dogs that I would never rat him out to the cops about the cars. He did 
have a problem with my dogs before I built the fence and he talked to 
me about it and is happy with the solution (the fence)



Anyhow, if any neighbor ever calls the cops on me about my dogs, I will 
probably deal with it in an obnoxious manner at least at first. 

My parents used to have a neighbor with a dog that would bark any time we
went into our back yard.  It was terrible -- we couldn't get any peace and
quiet in our own back yard.  Another neighbor liked to take their dog onto
our lawn to go to the bathroom.

I think dogs are poor animals to keep in a city.  There's no room for them
to run, they get bored being tethered all the time, and they get territorial
about neighbors' property.  It's not fair to the animal or to the neighbors.

The only dogs I've really felt any affection for were "free-range" ones that
my grandfather owned on his ten-acre spread in the middle of nowhere north
of Toronto.  An ideal setting, particularly for the dogs, who got fed and
reasonably taken care of but never actually went inside and had a playground
as large as they could possibly want.

This wasn't all farmland or anything.  There was a tall-grass field, a large
grove of trees, a pair of large hills... I'm surprised they ever came home
at all.  I'm not a dog person, so this colors my viewpoint a bit, but I
wouldn't consider owning a dog unless I lived on a place like that.  No
neighbors to bother, after all. :)

The Ann Arbor dog law requires the dogs to have some shelter if they are left
outdoors.  These three don't have shelter and they are out all night.
Jim says he did not spray water at the dogs but rather straight up at the weed
trees on the near side of the fence and; the water dripped down onto the dogs.
They had been barking at us continually for about half an hour besides trying
to knock the fence over and it was difficult to have a conversation and we
expected another hour of this.  It would have been difficult to pass a dog
biscuit through the 6' solid fence (the part they have nearly broken is on
the other side of my chain link fence, luckily).  The person who put up the
fence moved out - his ex-wife and little kid still live there.  He was not
willing to talk when he put the fence up and I asked him to keep it a little
ways off the ground so he could remove weed trees growing between our two
fences.  His fence was not necessary for keeping in the dogs in that section
as mine is a tall strong one and they run parallel at 6".
The previous wire fence had to be replaced when it got full of weed trees.

I find it extremely annoying to have dogs barking loudly at me when I walk
by a house, the more so if they are in the front yard without even a fence
other than an 'electric' type (that gives them a faint shock).  Previous next
door neighbors kept two large loud dogs in their front yard this way, that
would scare all the kids going by.  The yard is 10' deep.  They bought the
house to fix it up and make money off it and did not talk to neighbors.  The
dogs would lunge at all passersby.  At least these three dogs are in the back
yards so the barking is not as loud at the street.  Is there some way to
easily train dogs not to bark at adjacent neighbors?

I was out trying to remove weeds growing between the fences (sticking my hard
through the chain links) when the dogs started.

Wow, I hope your neighbors don't measure the property lines and discover
you've been picking *THEIR* weeds!

i don't generally mind dogs barking, but there's this one in the yard behind
me that will bark non-stop for hours in the day. it's rather irritating,
small-dog yelp. 

when i was at my brother's, i'd have a tea and cigarette in the mornong on
his front porch and the dog around the corner would stop by and hang out for
a while. he was cool.

When I used to deliver papers, I saw a dog break a window in an attempt to
get at me.

re#7 - While I disagree with you about dogs in urban areas, we really 
are talking about a suburban area. Ann Arbor and Ypsilanti have lots 
and lots of suburban type areas. My yard is plenty large enough for the 
dogs to run plus I take them for walks and stuff. I even let them run 
off leash with a bunch of other dogs at the park. 

re#9 - Dogs really should have shelter if they are left outside. If 
your neighbors really are the sort who have a dog in the yard that they 
just leave out there day and night then I agree that they are terrible 
dog owners and shouldnt own a dog. My concern is for the dog though. 

Sindi, I get that you are annoyed by barking dogs but I am sure there 
are things that you do that annoy your neighbors. There are lots of 
things that annoy me when neighbors do them. Like, they are remodeling 
the house next door and often get an early start (like 6am) which kind 
of bugs me but I can live with it. I have other neighbors who have semi-
loud parties on their deck at night. I have a neighbor who uses loud 
power tools to work on cars. I used to live in an apartment where the 
family next door would argue and yell a lot. Plus they had a baby that 
would dare to cry when I was trying to sleep. Can't people train their 
babies not to cry? I have had neighbors who have let their cats out to 
poop in my flowers. I have had neighbors who use loud power lawn powers 
at 9am on a sat morning when I have a hangover. ETC ETC ETC. People 
make noise just living their daily lives and the dogs that people own 
make noise. 

I appreciate that no one wants to live next to excessive noise but what 
is "excessive" My dogs bark anytime someone goes into the neighbor's 
backyard if they happen to be outside. 

It is possible to train a dog not to bark at all or not to bark at 
neighbors. When I eventually get real neighbors next door, I will 
probably try to work with the dogs to get them to recognize the people 
who belong there. 


re#11 I have a big dog with a irritating small dog yelp. It drives my 
roommate nuts. It is funny because it totally doesnt bother me. *shrug*
I love it when dogs just come and hang out. It is cool. 


re#12 That sounds like a dangerous dog. I support really strict owner 
liability laws, btw. I think that if a person's dog should damage 
another persons property or hurt them, they should be totally 
responsible even to the point of being convicted on a murder charge if 
their dog kills anyone. 

Regarding weeds and property lines, we surveyed my property before putting
up my fence exactly on the property line (the previous owner was claiming to
own two feet of my property) and yes, the weeds are on the other side of the
property line and technically are the neighbor's responsibility but since they
put a solid fence down to ground level they cannot get at them. I don't feel
like reporting them to the city for not keeping a 6" strip of weeds mowed.
They also put their fence 3' inside another property line and left the weed
trees and other weeds for the neighbor on the other side to take care of. 
We are a ten minute walk from downtown.  In my experience, people who move
into that area with two large dogs and put up a high fence, do not stay long,
they are headed for the country not a central neighborhood.

I feel sorry for the pitbull, it looks lonely, which does not mean people
should have to put up with its being left out there barking.  It was not there
today, nor were the two other dogs, which I hope have moved by now (to a
smaller house in the same neighborhood).  

Ah yes, the weeds and mowing issue. I pretty much let a good section of 
my backyard go wild. I dont mow it at all. I have planted a lot of 
wildflowers and stuff. I think it looks better that way plus it is MUCH 
easier than mowing and weeding and such. I talked to the city about it. 
They do have a mowing ordinance and one that forbids weeds. The first 
thing they told me was that they dont even try to enforce the ordinance 
unless someone complains. I asked them how they could tell the 
difference between a "weed" and a "flower" The said, "If you call it a 
flower, it is a flower." So, I think I am safe from the city as far as 
my backyard goes. 

Re #14: I thought fences had to be set in from the property line a
certain distance?


It amazes me how far noise pollution from dogs will carry.  It carries
farther than traffic noise into the woods.

I thought Sindi had mentioned using the party line (pulse) for modem
connections to ISPs and Grex.  If that is true, the line is carrying tones
accurately, and the "tone" attributes of phone service are being used on a
line that is supposed only to be used for pulse and voice.  

Certain noises do carry further than other noises. I think the traffic 
noise near my house is worse than the dog barking noises, especially 
when people honk their horns. But I think dog barking is more 
noticeable partly because traffic usually becomes kind of a white 
noise. The noise of people yelling carries pretty far. The noise baby 
crying carries a long way. The noise of fire crackers carries a 
*really* long way. 

But, since I like the sound of barking dogs, I dont consider 
it "pollution" 

Re #17: Uhm, "pulse" service refers to the method of dialing --
hookswitch pulses instead of DTMF tones.  It has nothing to do with
whether you're carrying data or voice on the line.  Computer modems can
dial using pulse mode.  (You just use ATDP instead of ATDT.)

I suppose I would be showing my age if I mentioned that I can remember 
trying to attack dial Mnet with a 300 baud modem on a pulse line (my 
parents were too cheap to get tone service). hahaha. 

        I like my wall of green out at my back fence.  A small green
belt that has finally grown back from the last construction devastation.
Plenty of weeds, the weed trees, some flowers, a little bit of 
blackberry bush and my dirt farm (grass clipping compost pile) and 
wood to get burnt cue.

Not that pulse phones belong in this item, but Jim says they no longer charge
extra for tone service (as promised) - instead they will, if you are in the
know, let you have pulse service with about a $2.50/month discount.  First
they sign you up for basic service.  They talked our Belarusan friends into
$100/month basic service and they then had to remove all the extras.
I cannot imagine Ameritech trying to keep people from using their pulse phones
to dial menus with tones - if so, you would never be able to reach Ameritech
as they have one of the longest menu systems I have encountered and it took
me several minutes to reach a person.  Answering machines used to come with
little beepers that would generate the correct tone on a pulse line.

I also like growing things in my yard that flower.  The problem with letting
things grow between two fences (when the second one was installed parallel
to and 6" from the first) is that eventually they can get to be 40' high and
will move the fence with them.  We had to cut down a row of these before
putting in the new fence.  

My first wife would whine about barking dogs all the time.  It would 
eventually get to the point where she was spending way too much time 
thinking -- and talking, to me -- about how to make them stop, like 
Elaine on Seinfeld.  How do you find out stuff like that about people 
before you marry them?  Because I'll tell you, nice tits don't make up 
for it.

You could ask them their opinion on barking dogs? Of course, even if they
passed the dog test, there might be something else about them that drives you
nuts. I have a friend who married a guy who puts the little spoons in the
place where the big spoons go! Now, if they were my neighbors I might have
to say something about it because that is something that really bugs me but
luckily they live thousands of miles away so the spoon thing isnt a big issue
for me. 

you could also try and get to know them before rushing off to the elvis
chapel.

Some things you just can't know until you try living with someone.  Unless
your religion forbids it, living in the same house with someone you plan to
marry for a while might be a good idea.

Still, I don't think I'd pass up someone I otherwise loved just because they
complained a lot about barking dogs, or put spoons in the wrong places, or
hung the toilet paper roll with the loose end hanging off the back instead
of the front.

Uh.  There is a separate place for big spoons and little spoons?
Really?  (We eat with chop sticks so what do we know....)

You must really be good with chopsticks, to not need spoons for your soup.

We keep all our spoons in the dish drainer along with a few forks and spatulas
and chopsticks and most of the dishes.

You should stop doing that, Sindi, because it *really* bugs me. ;)

HAHAHAHA

our big and little spoons go in the same compartment so there'll be a place
for the chopsticks, which we don't use for soup.

You people are impossible!

We have a few of those porcelain spoons for soup that we keep in the drawer
in the table together with extra chopsticks and the knife sharpener.

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