No Next Item No Next Conference Can't Favor Can't Forget Item List Conference Home Entrance    Help
View Responses


Grex Agora41 Item 144: First second-hand smoke, now second-hand cellphone?
Entered by gull on Thu May 2 14:06:24 UTC 2002:

A Japanese researcher got curious about the electromagnetic radiation caused
by cell phone users inside commuter train cars, and has calculated that it
could exceed safe exposure guidelines.  Interesting theory, but I'd like to
see it backed up with some actual field strength measurements.  It may
actualy vary quite a bit from moment to moment, since a cell phone adjusts
its power output based on signal strength.

http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99992238

38 responses total.



#1 of 38 by rcurl on Thu May 2 15:22:46 2002:

Based on *received* signal strength? Then it would boost its power up
to high in a metal train car, which partially shields the phone from
the tower. It would also not be as simple as the article tends to make
it, as there would be radio "hot" and "cold" spots in the car.


#2 of 38 by gull on Thu May 2 16:15:45 2002:

Not necessarily.  I get higher signal strength inside my metal car than I do
in the middle of the concrete office building I work in.


#3 of 38 by rcurl on Thu May 2 18:01:58 2002:

Concrete buildings are reinforced with steel rods/mesh. Pretty good
Faraday shield. But my statement in #1 applies to #2 as it depends
where you are in both a car or a building. 


#4 of 38 by bdh3 on Sat May 4 07:36:09 2002:

re#3: Its called 'rebar'.


#5 of 38 by rcurl on Sat May 4 15:45:16 2002:

If you want to play contractor....


#6 of 38 by bdh3 on Mon May 6 06:23:06 2002:

Its called 'rebar' in the Home Depot insert in the newspaper - hardly
targeted towards contractors.


#7 of 38 by brighn on Mon May 6 13:59:57 2002:

Larson used the word "rebar" in a Far Side cartoon. (Two cavemen standing next
to a smoldering chicken-wire frame of a cave, one saying: "Boy, you wiped out,
Kumba...Nothing left but rebar.")


#8 of 38 by rcurl on Mon May 6 16:06:52 2002:

It started as a contractor term, adopted by everyone as it sounds sexy. 
A lot of words come into our vocabulary that way. People like to swing
the lingo as it makes them (they think) sound knowledgeable. Ask them
to describe the types and uses of the many varieties of "rebar" and
they will be struck dumb. 

Take a look at what it's called on a professional site
(http://www.asf-rebar.com/charts_specs.htm): "ASTM Standard Reinforcing
Bars".


#9 of 38 by scg on Mon May 6 18:26:12 2002:

If the purpose of communication is to be understood, using the commonly
understood terminology is helpful.  If somebody says rebar maybe it sounds
sexy to you, but to most of us it sounds like metal bars used to reinforce
concrete.  If somebody starts talking about ASTM Standard Reinforcing Bars,
chances are the average listener won't have a clue what they're talking about.


#10 of 38 by brighn on Mon May 6 18:39:10 2002:

#8> Just because a word starts out as professional lingo doesn't mean it needs
to stay that way forever and always.
,


#11 of 38 by gull on Mon May 6 19:01:10 2002:

Speaking of which, I got to wondering something yesterday.  Those swivel
joints on the drive axles of front-wheel-drive cars....why are they called
"constant velocity joints"?  What's constant about their velocity?


#12 of 38 by rcurl on Tue May 7 00:32:17 2002:

They the drive and driven shafts turn at the same velocity (rpm),
independent of the angle between them (within allowable limits). 


#13 of 38 by mdw on Tue May 7 00:35:21 2002:

They used to call them "Universal Joints".


#14 of 38 by rcurl on Tue May 7 00:45:37 2002:

One still should get it right, then. I referred to "reinforced with steel
rods/mesh". Welded wire mesh is not "rebar", and those in the industry
know that "rerod" is equibalent to "rebar". So what I said was correct
but avoids "jargon". (I've been wondering why I care... 8^} I think
it was because #4 was an ignorant attempt at correction. Oh well....
who cares anyway? It still forms an electromagnetic shield in concrete
buildings.)


#15 of 38 by rcurl on Tue May 7 00:49:17 2002:

Re #13: a universal joint is NOT a constant velocity joint. See, for example,
http://www.4wdonline.com/A.hints/Universal.html.


#16 of 38 by mdw on Tue May 7 00:53:44 2002:

Ah - so they're slightly more complicated are they?  Interesting...


#17 of 38 by rcurl on Tue May 7 01:14:01 2002:

It was a little harder finding a diagram of a CV joint. There is a rather
poor one at
http://www.hewett.norfolk.sch.uk/curric/techweb/epscweb/mech1.htm#coupling
The limit would be using a piece of hose as a flexible coupling, but that
is not a very rigid coupling, which is needed for power and force
transmission. 



#18 of 38 by gull on Tue May 7 13:11:42 2002:

Ah, okay, that site clears it up.  I hadn't realized that a universal
joint's speed varied through its rotation when it was at an angle.

Universal joints sure are more durable than CVs, though.  I found a torn CV
boot on my car recently and my mechanic told me I might as well get the
whole driveaxle replaced, because once the boot is torn the CV is usually
damaged almost immediately from the grease being contaminated.  Universal
joints on rear wheel drive cars seem to last the life of the vehicle with no
grease boots at all.


#19 of 38 by jp2 on Tue May 7 13:15:38 2002:

This response has been erased.



#20 of 38 by gelinas on Tue May 7 14:43:15 2002:

"Old World", "New World", "Third World".  "First World" is a back-formation
from "Third World", so there is NO "Second World".


#21 of 38 by jp2 on Tue May 7 14:51:40 2002:

This response has been erased.



#22 of 38 by jp2 on Tue May 7 14:53:40 2002:

This response has been erased.



#23 of 38 by flem on Tue May 7 16:45:52 2002:

I don't have handy the references, but it's my understanding that #21 is
mostly wrong.  In particular, Switzerland would not be considered third world.


#24 of 38 by jp2 on Tue May 7 16:50:58 2002:

This response has been erased.



#25 of 38 by brighn on Tue May 7 16:51:56 2002:

#24> Heh.


#26 of 38 by void on Tue May 7 17:23:05 2002:

Hmmm.  The term "third world" was first used by the French writer Alfred
Sauvy in 1952.  He compared the third world of non-industrialized,
mostly poor countries to the third estate of the peasantry in
pre-revolution France, and implied that more industrialized nations were
comparable to the first and second estates.


#27 of 38 by jp2 on Tue May 7 17:28:12 2002:

This response has been erased.



#28 of 38 by void on Tue May 7 19:43:01 2002:

Um, no.  The book _Le Tiers-Monde_, inspired by earlier writings by
Sauvy (who was a demographer), was published in 1956.  A periodical with
same title begin publication in 1959.  In fact, Sauvy first used the
term "third world" ("tiers-monde," because it was in French) in an
article titled "Trois mondes, Une plančte" in the August, 1952 issue of
"L' Observateur."  The magazine was a socialist rag, and the article had
more to do with which side in the Cold War would dominate the
underdeveloped countries of the third world.  It made no mention of
third world countries simply being non-aligned ones, since the analogy
was being drawn between underdeveloped nations and 18th-century French
peasants.


#29 of 38 by flem on Tue May 7 19:50:35 2002:

Right.  It was a post-colonial thing, the idea being that all these new
nations in Africa, South America, and Asia that had, until the middle of the
20th century, been dominated by European nations, but now had their
independence and were going to form new, enlightened governments based on
modern political theories.  


#30 of 38 by jp2 on Tue May 7 20:58:38 2002:

This response has been erased.



#31 of 38 by gelinas on Wed May 8 03:08:09 2002:

Actually, when I last looked this up, the earliest reference I could find was
a meeting in 1945 or so.  It's been a decade or more since I cared enough to
research it, though.  And I realised even then that some folks just don't care
to be told that they are wrong.  No matter how wrong they are.


#32 of 38 by slynne on Wed May 8 13:56:33 2002:

you might be wrong about that, Joe.

 ;)


#33 of 38 by janc on Tue May 14 20:10:18 2002:

Re: rebar, universal joints, third world:  Is everyone trying to prove 
that they are smarter than everyone else, or just that they are better 
at looking stuff up?


#34 of 38 by rcurl on Tue May 14 22:53:39 2002:

Do people ask questions about how others discuss stuff to show that
they are above such exchanges of trivial informaation?


#35 of 38 by bdh3 on Wed May 15 05:28:44 2002:

yes


#36 of 38 by senna on Wed May 15 22:32:49 2002:

#34:  Sure, the same way they ask questions to show that they are above such
exchanges of trivial theology.


#37 of 38 by janc on Sun May 19 04:59:17 2002:

Actually, when I do look a fact up, I usually do try to phrase my
response to say so.  But that's because I have a lousy memory and I've
long since given up trying to impress people with my breadth of factual
knowledge.


#38 of 38 by senna on Sun May 19 07:27:40 2002:

#36 is a bit more mean-spirited than is really appropriate.  I 
apologize.

Response not possible - You must register and login before posting.

No Next Item No Next Conference Can't Favor Can't Forget Item List Conference Home Entrance    Help

- Backtalk version 1.3.30 - Copyright 1996-2006, Jan Wolter and Steve Weiss