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Grex > Language > #108: The seven letter word game, 2nd edition |  |
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| 25 new of 1124 responses total. |
blaise
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response 900 of 1124:
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Dec 3 20:39 UTC 2001 |
tympani
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aruba
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response 901 of 1124:
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Dec 3 21:10 UTC 2001 |
brained 0 (gelinas)
skyways 0 (brighn)
tympani 2 (blaise)
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brighn
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response 902 of 1124:
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Dec 3 21:25 UTC 2001 |
replank
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gelinas
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response 903 of 1124:
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Dec 3 21:58 UTC 2001 |
envault
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blaise
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response 904 of 1124:
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Dec 3 22:43 UTC 2001 |
syzygal
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aruba
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response 905 of 1124:
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Dec 4 07:03 UTC 2001 |
All right, none of those words are in m-w, so I need some definitions and
references.
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blaise
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response 906 of 1124:
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Dec 4 14:14 UTC 2001 |
I withdraw my word; I found it in a few online "dictionaries" that are just
lists of words, and thought it was the adjectival form of "syzygy". However,
according to the American Heritage Dictionary, the correct adjectival form
is "syzygial".
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brighn
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response 907 of 1124:
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Dec 4 17:32 UTC 2001 |
"replank" is obvious enough, "to plank again." It's true that it doesn't come
up on onelook.com, but re- is a productive prefix in English, and plank is
listed as a transitive verb at http://www.bartleby.com/61/8/P0350800.html
Used in a sentence: "We got the loan to open up that abandoned shop, so we
took the 2x4s of the door and windows, but we got a notice that it would be
a few months before we got the supplies we needed, and that's a dangerous
neighborhood, so we had to replank."
"envault" is "en-" + "vault":
http://www.dictionary.com/cgi-bin/dict.pl?term=envault
(I'll retract if people want me to; it's not important, but I do think some
degree of lenience should be given for productive affixes.)
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gelinas
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response 908 of 1124:
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Dec 4 19:49 UTC 2001 |
} coll% dict envault
} 1 definition found
}
} From Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary (1913) [web1913]:
}
} Envault \En*vault"\, v. t.
} To inclose in a vault; to entomb. [R.] --Swift.
} coll%
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aruba
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response 909 of 1124:
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Dec 5 00:41 UTC 2001 |
envault 2 (gelinas)
I'm going to turn down replank, Paul, unless you can find a dictionary
entry or rally extensive public opinion to your cause. I understand the
process of making new words, but we have to draw the line somewhere, and
I'm drawing it at what's in some (respectable) dictionary.
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brighn
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response 910 of 1124:
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Dec 5 01:18 UTC 2001 |
replant
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gelinas
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response 911 of 1124:
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Dec 5 01:33 UTC 2001 |
tadpole
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brighn
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response 912 of 1124:
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Dec 5 01:37 UTC 2001 |
Incidentally, a search of Yahoo! and Google, while not revealing any
dictionary definitions, does show that "replank" has minor currency (20 hits
on Yahoo!, 35 on Google), mostly as a technical term for repairing the hull
of a ship: "Out of the last harvest, 62 trees were sent to replank USS
Constitution, some of which came from an area designated
"Constitution Grove." The trees required for the Navy's flagship
are white oaks, worth 2,000 to 4,000 dollars each on the open
market." http://www.chinfo.navy.mil/navpalib/news/navnews/nns93/nns93033.tx
t
But also as a term for fixing ones wooden deck, walkways, or anything else
made from planks: "He will now be standing trial for allegedly
misappropriating $30,000 in advertising and other revenues to buy wood to
replank his summer home, Sergei Afanasiyev, Rozh dest vensky's lawyer said."
http://www.sptimesrussia.com/secur/592/news/n_russkoe.htm
"Items on the agenda for 1998 and the future:
- replank the wraparound porch (work-in-progress)."
http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Plains/9205/house.html
I mean, the word was just thrown out fairly randomly anyway, and it's clearly
wrong (otherwise you'd've said ding! ding! ding! ;} ), but there are lots of
word forms that aren't in dictionaries because they follow patterns so obvious
that lexicographers don't bother, and the re+verb pattern is fully productive
in English. This is what Webster's New Universal (Dorset and Baber, 1983) has
to say: "A prefix meaning again, anew, over again... The following list
contains some of the more common words in which re- means simply again or
anew. Words with special meanings are entered in the proper alphabetical
places in the vocabulary." (p. 1499) *Some of the more common words* is the
key: It's an acknowledgement that re+verb DOES create words that aren't listed
either on the list or separately, but that the dictionary doesn't have room
to list them all (and this is an unabridged dictionary, 2129 pages.
In my opinion, if we're going to rule out "replank," we also have to rule
out any plural that's not explicitly in the dictionary, as well as any
past tense, and so on.
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kentn
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response 913 of 1124:
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Dec 5 04:05 UTC 2001 |
http://www.dictionary.com/cgi-bin/dict.pl?term=plank
gives the verb definition for plank (most dictionaries just
give noun definitions). I don't know if that helps your case
in re adding "re", though.
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aruba
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response 914 of 1124:
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Dec 5 04:26 UTC 2001 |
replant 0 (brighn)
tadpole 3 (gelinas)
That quote from Webster's New Universal does make it clear that there are
verbs that aren't listed, but it doesn't say that you can add re to *any*
verb and make a new verb. So it leaves us in the dark about just what re-
verbs *are* legal.
If you don't like my dictionary rule, Paul, what rule would you like to
suggest?
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brighn
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response 915 of 1124:
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Dec 5 06:48 UTC 2001 |
I thought I'd made as much clear: Any word in the dictionary, plus any
justifiable word made from adding productive affixes to those words. There
aren't *that many* productive affixes in English (re-, -ing, -s, -ed, in-,
others).
Joe was before me, so I can't have another go until someone else does.
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rcurl
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response 916 of 1124:
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Dec 5 07:16 UTC 2001 |
"1485 Rec. St. Mary at Hill 29 In the Stable a Racke & a mawnger, and it is
new planked" (from OED). "new planked" is what they said then instead
of re-planked.
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brighn
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response 917 of 1124:
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Dec 5 07:18 UTC 2001 |
In 1485, when they also spelled "manger" with a "w."
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brighn
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response 918 of 1124:
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Dec 5 07:35 UTC 2001 |
Speaking of the OED: "re- prefix of Latin origion, with the general sense of
"back" or "again", occurring in a large number of words directly or indirectly
adopted from Latin, or of later Romance origin, and on the model of these
**freely employed in English as a prefix to verbs** and to substantives or
adjectives derived from these." ... "In English formations, whether on native
or Latin bases, re- is almost exclusviely employed in the sense of "again";
the few exceptions to this have been directly suggested by existing Latin
compounds, as recall after L. revocare. In one or other application of this
sense, **re- may be prefix to any English verb or verbal derivative.**"
(Emphasis mine, from OED1st (Compact Edition).)
origion>origin; other typos are als mine, it's late and I'm typing while
reading the little teeny print.
Since I've already listed plank as a verb, the OED permits "replank" as a
valid construction.
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rcurl
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response 919 of 1124:
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Dec 5 07:41 UTC 2001 |
(1885 G. B. Shaw Let. 14 Dec. (1965) I. 146, I re-return the cheque, and if
you re-re-return it I will re-re-re-return it again.)
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gelinas
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response 920 of 1124:
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Dec 5 14:03 UTC 2001 |
Re #915: No, I wasn't. Take a look at #910 and #911. Yours is the former,
entered fifteen minutes before mine, the latter.
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brighn
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response 921 of 1124:
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Dec 5 15:38 UTC 2001 |
oh, sorry, you slipped in unnoticed by me. my mistake =}
ummmmm...
entropy
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aruba
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response 922 of 1124:
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Dec 5 16:31 UTC 2001 |
OK, that quote from the OED does say you can stick re on any verb, so I will
accept replank if you reguess it. It does beg the question, though, about
whether "redie", "reimplode", and "rego" are words. Not to mention
"rewent", "rerego", "rererego", etc. Would you accept those words if
someone made them playing Scrabble?
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aruba
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response 923 of 1124:
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Dec 5 16:33 UTC 2001 |
entropy 0 (brighn)
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brighn
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response 924 of 1124:
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Dec 5 17:28 UTC 2001 |
#922> No. I was hesitant to post that OED info, since, IMO, re- only adds to
transitive verbs or verbs in the frame V + NP (e.g., "Yesterday, I ran the
course, and today I reran it." sounds ok to me, but "Yesterday, I ran for
three hours, and today I reran." sounds weird, even though I don't think "run"
is transitive in "run the course"). The way this would have been expressed
in my linguistics classes: re- adds to any verb which assigns case (other than
nominative, which is assigned by the verb phrase, not the verb); I imagine
there are probably academic articles on re- and like prefixes, but I'm not
familiar with them off-hand.
But you wanted a dictionary reference, and my MA in linguistics wasn't good
enough, so I provided a dictionary reference. ;} Really, I understand your
point... if I try to claim "replank," then others might try to justify, say,
"childs" on the grounds that "-s" is fully productive.
At any rate, "replank"'s score should be 0; I'm not sure what the word is,
but I'm fairly confident it doesn't end in -k, and so replank should have the
same score as replant. ;}
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