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| Author |
Message |
| 22 new of 96 responses total. |
hematite
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response 75 of 96:
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Dec 29 23:23 UTC 1994 |
Well, I think I'll add my little thing after all. I'm sorry all this had to
happen. I'm also sorry that if grex DOES shut down I will be dissapointed, as
will others. I've come to call grex my second home, a place where i can talk
to my frineds, and meet other people. I know this may be small and off the
subject, I jsut thought I'd share my small point of view.
Wendy
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gerund
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response 76 of 96:
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Dec 29 23:44 UTC 1994 |
Although Marc draws you right to the worst parts of the post, he has
a point I think. This would have died if we would have let it.
Sun, Sylvia and I could have kept it in private from then on.
As it was all three of us are emotional people and the fire was fueled.
It's brought up some deeper issues for Grex, concerning slander vs
censorship, and that issue is being debated now in the coop conference.
As for me, the people I call friends know me well enough to know
what the truth is. As for those who don't know me, I can only
hope that they will not believe everything they read and would get
to know ME before they make a judgement about me. If they can't well
frankly I don't care. *I* know who I am.
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bhelliom
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response 77 of 96:
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Dec 30 00:33 UTC 1994 |
I suppose I should say one more thing. First of all, this item shouldn't
have been put here in the first place, because it was clearly meant to
totally disrupt more than one person's life and ruin a reputation.
But since it is here, we really have to deal with it.
Of course I'M going to reply, because it is my reputation as a mature
and frankly healthy (mentally) member of of the grex community.
I have defended myself, and I have put the surrounding circumstances
behind me, for all that they were worth.
As for killing the item, of course nothing would please me more, but
we all must remember seraph's 1st amendment rights have been exercised.
The sooner the item loses interest, the sooner it will
go away. I don't know whether it was he that diod this all by himself, or if
someone though he or she could pose as me, but all of that is over and done wit
with.
Of course my sex life is no one business, and I of all people ought to know
that I do not and never will tell secrets such as those on any party
channel. And I haven't done this in chat either. I know that I didn't do
this, and I have a feeling who did. That said, I think if all of you
are appalled at this, then make it known, and go on with
your lives. I am not emotionally scared, but just a tad bit angry, and a littl
wounded. I'll heal from that, and I hope all involved will as well.
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bhelliom
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response 78 of 96:
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Dec 30 00:35 UTC 1994 |
Bad line breaking? I think so.
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anne
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response 79 of 96:
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Dec 30 00:39 UTC 1994 |
My whole desire to have this removed was mostly because I thought that for
one thing, it is no one's business but those mentioned by name. And I
thought some people here might care about the emotions of the said people.
Forgive me for thinking of their emotions over the 'no censoring' rule.
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andyv
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response 80 of 96:
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Dec 30 00:44 UTC 1994 |
Gerund, you can bet that everyone (I think) will not believe everything they
read and will get to know you before they make a judgement about you. Besides
the beginning sisn't make much sense except it sounded like a shouting match
outside a bar. The responses have help me get to know lots more people on
Grex than anything I had read before.
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gerund
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response 81 of 96:
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Dec 30 00:58 UTC 1994 |
ug... something good is coming out of this? oh i've heard all
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popcorn
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response 82 of 96:
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Dec 30 01:01 UTC 1994 |
I was out of town when this item was entered. Katie (the fair witness
of Agora) hasn't logged on since well before it was entered. It's not
my place to be messing with Katie's conference, and I expect to be royally
flamed for doing this, but I'm going to retire this item so that Katie
can deal with it when she gets back.
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sun
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response 83 of 96:
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Dec 30 01:47 UTC 1994 |
Thanks valerie
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seraph
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response 84 of 96:
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Dec 30 08:19 UTC 1994 |
There are many lies going on here....judgement of any party involved should be
reserved ..... Keep in mind "not everything is as it is seen"...as I will from
now on!
Please Kill this item!!!!
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sidhe
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response 85 of 96:
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Dec 30 19:15 UTC 1994 |
kevin, kevin, kevin.... Decided to return after your odiferous "farewell"?
f, at least, you had stayed away, as you said you would do,
perhaps your words would hold some small ring of veracity.. as it is, now,
there will never be any way that I will ever trust you on anythind again..
You couldn't even keep your word that you'd leave!
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remmers
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response 86 of 96:
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Dec 30 20:23 UTC 1994 |
Hmmm. The author of #84 is the person who entered this item, no?
Well, he can't object too much to its being retired then...
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drahcir
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response 87 of 96:
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Dec 30 21:14 UTC 1994 |
It is obvious that this whole thing has gotten blown out of proportion. You
have to accept that on a computer net, reality is not a given. You can know
who people are without REALLY knowing who people are..... I dont even know
Bhelliom, but from reading the msg, it is obvious that it either wasnt her or
the whole thing was a joke. So I doubt that anyone outside of those involved
really took it seriously. This is a computer board, not real life and anyone
who's ego is so fragile that it can be shattered by some idiot posting a
message, needs to get a grip. The people who know and care for the people
involved(bhelliom, gerund, sun) will be able to know the truth and the rest of
the people on here dont matter anyway. All of this screaming about having this
item deleted is akin to when right wing zealots try to get a book or movie
banned...it makes everyone want to read or see it. There is no excuse for the
idiot who sent the log or the other idiot who impersonated bhelliom, but this
could have been discussed in private and bhelliom, Sun and Gerund must know
that They will have to share the blame if anything else comes out of this. As
Rodney King said out in LA during the riots..."CANT WE ALL JUST GET
ALONG....CANT WE ALL JUST GET ALONG...."
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drahcir
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response 88 of 96:
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Dec 30 21:27 UTC 1994 |
Oh and one other thing.....when someone writes a book full of slander and
gossip, the person victimized can write his /her own book in response... But
that person cannot order all copies of the other book burned, even if it was
physically possible to do so..... It is called freedom of speech. Bhelliom,
sue Seraph if you want, haul his ass into court, but the message shouldnt be
removed or rcensorship. Or if not Seraph whoever was involved.
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kerouac
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response 89 of 96:
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Dec 30 21:42 UTC 1994 |
OOOps.....should have mentioned that 87 and 88 were from me, using the acct
that has my actual name on it. Drahcir is no newbie just Richard (kerouac)
backwads.....if this item is retired, why can we still post?
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brighn
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response 90 of 96:
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Dec 30 21:51 UTC 1994 |
This item should, ethically, be dead but, in deference to the 1st Amendment
and the Grex Staff, I can understand why it isn't.
Has anybody other than Seraph been able to find this chunk of party log?
Avi, who apparently did quite a bit of legwork to find bhell's log in
times, said he couldn't.
Might I make a suggestion that I haven't heard yet.
Could Seraph have made it all up?
He includes the writing of his responses along with the appearance of
the same responses in the log which means:
(1) He took the log file from his OWN session, not from Party records.
(2) OR He made it all up.
In the case of (1), he could have staged the conversation with ANYONE
and pasted Bhelliom's name in. This is not a party log -- it simply
CAN'T be. Bhell doesn't talk like that, even when she's upset. She
got upset in Inferno about drift and it was Eeyore who was doing the
shouting, not Bhell.
Avi, I think, breached the question, but let me state it directly:
Could Seraph have made it all up?
If BHELLIOM doesn't appear on the log-in for the time, how could
she have been in Party, even if somebody else was using her id?
Why would Seraph make it all up? I dunno.
The other question: Why would Bhelliom say those things? No reason,
none at all. She might have negative feelings, but she would NEVER
express herself like that. I've talked to Seraph once; it was brief,
but enough to show me a glimpse of his immaturity.
J'accuse... Seraph, defend yourself with PROOF.
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seraph
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response 91 of 96:
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Dec 31 01:30 UTC 1994 |
Do you know how to make them blink?
If i recall correctly Avi said that she was on at the time but it was a direct
line not from the telnet site...... I dont know who exactly callled in
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seraph
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response 92 of 96:
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Dec 31 01:36 UTC 1994 |
maybe i missed it, but where did it actually say the time that we had this
conversation? Could you please tell me the time, then I could show you that she
was logged in!
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brighn
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response 93 of 96:
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Dec 31 01:42 UTC 1994 |
Seraph, darling, I though you said goodbye.
You're an awful loud corpse.
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brighn
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response 94 of 96:
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Dec 31 01:46 UTC 1994 |
The conversation ended Dec 27 at 20:11. The text implies, though, that
it was a private channel -- not being logged.
But the fact remains that you could easily have
tampered with the text.
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deco
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response 95 of 96:
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Dec 31 02:06 UTC 1994 |
look, I'm a newby on grex so I haven't exactly had time to make any
character judgements about people yet. But then, this is the net, so how
well do you ever know anyone on here...
anyhoo... to play the role of the devil's advocate for a moment, just
assume that seraph is *not* making this up... maybe someone hacked into
bhelliom's account and said all of that. But, also being a newby here,
seraph doesn't know that, and after getting thoroughly chewed out by "her"
all these other ppl he doesn't know come up and tell him what an asshole
he is and call him a liar everytime he tries to explain himself.
If that happened to me I'd be pretty pissed and I'd probly do the same thing.
*shrugs*
I just felt that someone needed to take his side. I mean, have any of you
people actually tried to talk *rationally* about this with him and listen
to what he has to say? You might be surprised if you give him a chance to
speak.
All I know is that *someone* here is lying and if they have even a hint of
dignity than they owe a lot of people some serious apologies.
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aaron
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response 96 of 96:
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Dec 31 02:07 UTC 1994 |
1. The First Amendment is not implicated unless there is a state actor.
Grex can censor whatever it wants without implicating the First
Amendment.
2. mju stated the law pretty well, although I would add that if the
restaurant owner is aware that slanders are being posted a duty to
monitor the walls might arise. Passing on a slander is generally
as culpable as initiating a slander.
3. There is a huge element of "assumption of risk" in giving out one's
password.
I did not read #0, and don't care to.
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