|
|
| Author |
Message |
| 25 new of 823 responses total. |
aruba
|
|
response 675 of 823:
| 
Jun 7 15:44 UTC 2002 |
Re #673: See, that's the point. I saw nothing to suspect anything odd about
Bruce's interview, but Richard found a spin he could put on it that (I
think) he hoped would rile people up.
I guess it's a testament to how good Richard is, that even after reading his
posts for all these years, people can disagree on his real nature.
So, bravo, Richard, keep up the good work. Fight the good fight, and all
that. Other people find your posts helpful and infirmative (Freudian
slip!), so don't mind me.
|
richard
|
|
response 676 of 823:
|
Jun 7 19:18 UTC 2002 |
aruba you just dont understand the context of my post. It was a
followup to a conversation Bru and I had in Party not long ago. Bru
has been discussing his frustration with his job search in Party the
past few weeks. And one of the things that he has to deal with, as we
all have to deal with as we get older, is age-ism in the work place.
If Bru and another applicant who is twenty years younger have the same
job skills, and both have acceptable levels of experience, ask yourself
who this employer is going to hire? Most likely the younger person who
will work for less money and be less of an insurance risk. In
addition, Bru was saying he wanted to apply for office manager or
administrative assistant jobs. Jobs some employers, including old
farts like my previous boss, would insist on having a female doing.
Thats sexism. That happens too.
I think when people get discriminated against in job searches they
shouldnt just take it. They should complain. Its supposed to be
illegal to do so, but the fact is it DOES happen. A lot. I mean you
cant change who you are. You cant wave a magic wand and make yourself
whatever a prospective employer VISUALIZES as the ideal employee for a
job. Obviously, as follow up messages indicate, in this particular
case, the other employee had a slightly different set of job skills
(mac skills as opposed to pc skills) If that is the only reason this
guy got hired right away and Bru didnt, thats fine.
But the point of my earlier post was that if Bru (or anyone looking for
a job) thinks even for a minute that he wasnt treated fairly in the
hiring process, that if he suspects the reason he gets passed over was
some superficial judgement (like his age or gender), then he should
complain. It is naive to think employers dont discriminate, all the
laws do is cause it to happen a little more quietly.
And Aruba, is just my own personal view. Not mean spirited or
malicious. Isnt exchanging views what this place is supposed to be
about?
|
rcurl
|
|
response 677 of 823:
|
Jun 7 19:34 UTC 2002 |
Speaking to a point Richard makes above - I recently had some medical
repair work done. On a doctor's visit he commented "You are in excellent
health for your age." I wonder at what age that cliche is turned on?
|
eskarina
|
|
response 678 of 823:
|
Jun 7 21:28 UTC 2002 |
I don't see what's wrong with the comment "you're in good health for your
age". As though we pretend that age isn't a health risk much as anything else
is. I've been told before, by different people, that I'm in rather good
health considering how much steroid therapy I've been on (especially when I
was disappointed that my bone density was below the mean for my age. I'm
actually quite lucky it isn't dangerously low).
If you don't view your circumstances in light of your circumstances, you don't
have a very realistic view of your life.
|
bru
|
|
response 679 of 823:
|
Jun 7 22:32 UTC 2002 |
I have been discriminated against by both the U of M and the CIty of Ann
Arbor. The problem Is I cannot prove it.
WEll, how do I know, you may ask. Because people associated with their hiring
process have told me so. One person told me the only way I would get hired
at UM hospital was to know someone who worked there and get them to get me
in contact with the person doing the hiring and take them to lunch. The
exception being nurses. If you are a nurse and you are breathing, they will
hire you.
|
mary
|
|
response 680 of 823:
|
Jun 8 01:39 UTC 2002 |
So get yourself a nurse's cap and stop whining already.
Now, where do you get a nurse's cap these days? We were all
discussing that just the other day and about the only place
we suspect carries them is porn shops.
|
jep
|
|
response 681 of 823:
|
Jun 8 03:25 UTC 2002 |
I don't think it's reasonable to accuse Bruce of whining about his job
woes, at least not from what I've seen in this item or the other items
in which he's discussed his situation. It's extremely hard to have
been raised as Bruce was, and I was, and no doubt Tim Ryan was, to draw
much of your self-esteem from being able to take care of yourself and
your family through doing well at your job, but not to have a job.
Bruce is out there trying his best, and it can't be easy to be sure he
hasn't had a chance to get some of the jobs he could do and do well.
He's still out there trying. I wish my company had an opening for
him. I'd recommend hiring him any time.
|
rcurl
|
|
response 682 of 823:
|
Jun 8 04:55 UTC 2002 |
Re #678: I did not suggest in #677 that there was anything WRONG with the
comment "you're in good health for your age". I only asked at what age
they start using that expression. It seems inconceivable that it would be
said (to a person in excellent health) at ages up to at least 40, while it
seems inevitable at age 80 plus. So, where is the dividing line (or zone)?
This reflects upon some implicit expectations of people concerning the
health of others, related to age, which is a form of "ageism", but what
are those expectations in regard to "good health"?
|
mary
|
|
response 683 of 823:
|
Jun 8 11:35 UTC 2002 |
Check out, "My Turn", Rane, in the most recent Newsweek.
I think you'll like it.
|
keesan
|
|
response 684 of 823:
|
Jun 8 12:36 UTC 2002 |
It seems to be a particularly bad job market right now for computer-related
jobs. Someone I know who was a really superb tech support person took one
year to find a job, and my brother is still looking after 16 months out of
work and 25 years experience.
|
scott
|
|
response 685 of 823:
|
Jun 8 13:19 UTC 2002 |
My cat Dave's aging is starting to speed up. Worse, career changes may make
it much more difficult for me to own cats.
|
rcurl
|
|
response 686 of 823:
|
Jun 8 15:26 UTC 2002 |
Thanks, Mary. Very appropriate. The article is at
http://www.msnbc.com/news/760480.asp#BODY
Scott, tell your cat to read the article too.
|
tpryan
|
|
response 687 of 823:
|
Jun 8 18:28 UTC 2002 |
I got a letter from them today, saying I don't meet their
requirements. At least the real company sent something out.
|
keesan
|
|
response 688 of 823:
|
Jun 8 20:12 UTC 2002 |
I asked too soon (; . Any other leads?
|
beeswing
|
|
response 689 of 823:
|
Jun 8 21:00 UTC 2002 |
IBB the Tyson/Lewis slugfest has made downtown a teeming mob, to where
I must stay away the entire weekend. Pfffft.
The interviews I've been on have not materialized into jobs.
|
vidar
|
|
response 690 of 823:
|
Jun 10 12:30 UTC 2002 |
I've had a couple minor setbacks:
Once again, a sucky attempt to certify in rapier. And learning only 2
practices before trying to certify that my partner and I were missing
parts of the coregraphy.
|
bhelliom
|
|
response 691 of 823:
|
Jun 10 14:15 UTC 2002 |
Actually, Mark, I was rather taken aback at the offhand suggestion of
discrimination as well, as the first idea to come from someone's head
when analyzing why someone [else] didn't get a job. I'm not saying
that it's impossible for that to have been the case if the candidate
where of a different gender, age or ethnicity, or was the best friend
of the head of HR, but to automatically jump to that conclusion is
juvenile, and to lay that out on the table without thinking is rather
irresponsible, whether one is trying to stir up the waters or wants to
be helpful. Anyone who thinks I'm talking out of my ass can feel free
to say so.
|
rcurl
|
|
response 692 of 823:
|
Jun 10 15:01 UTC 2002 |
What was said was
"bru, was this co-worker who got hired on the spot by any chance younger
than you, or of a different sex or minority? unless he was overwhelmingly
more qualified than you, it could be you were discriminated against"
This was NOT a "jump to that conclusion". It was a question. In fact,
a question worth considering, as such does happen. It is also NOT an
analysis of "why someone [else] didn't get a job". It isn't an analysis
of anything, but just a question. You also agree that it could have
been true.
Therefore, I tend to agree with your suggestion.
|
oval
|
|
response 693 of 823:
|
Jun 10 15:07 UTC 2002 |
well it could have been that bru had a huge booger hanging out of his nose
throught the whole interview and when he walked out they all laughed at him
and still laugh about over lunch and at the water cooler.
that's just a suggestion too, that could or could not have been true - still
it's not very nice, now is it.
|
aruba
|
|
response 694 of 823:
|
Jun 10 15:12 UTC 2002 |
Well, I don't. I think it was a deliberately nasty and inflammatory
question. But I've given Richard too much negative attention already, and
I know that's what he craves. So I'm not going to go on about it.
|
bhelliom
|
|
response 695 of 823:
|
Jun 10 15:32 UTC 2002 |
RCurl, you make it sound as if this is a debate worthy of my time.
First of all it was *not* a question. Secondly I didn't agree it could
have been true, I said there are circumstances in which it was possible
that it can happen. Now, I'm *not* going to argue about this, and I
never intended to start a ridiculous excuse for a discussion. If you
want to start picking apart people's words, Leeron's got a few items
around here somewhere.
|
oval
|
|
response 696 of 823:
|
Jun 10 15:38 UTC 2002 |
somehow my cat managed to get a claw stabbed right between my cuticle and my
nail a couple of mm and hurts like a bitch. i'm trying to comb out the big
dread locks sh'es somehow managed to cultivate in the last weeks all over her
body. i think i've been giving her too much catnip and she's gone all rasta
on me.
|
bhelliom
|
|
response 697 of 823:
|
Jun 10 15:55 UTC 2002 |
Oval . . . hope you feel better. You're not allergic, are you?
|
mooncat
|
|
response 698 of 823:
|
Jun 10 16:15 UTC 2002 |
re #696- My cat has a habit of going all 'rasta' on me too... this is
why I'm taking her to her vets to get a 'lion cut.' <grins> I can't
wait to see that...
Well, IBB- it finally happened, my home computer's hard drive finally
passed on. So my online activity will be highly curtailed. Recently
work has been much too busy for me to check grex often- and now it
looks like I'll be checking even less s I have no idea when I will have
a working hard drive. Ah well.
|
eskarina
|
|
response 699 of 823:
|
Jun 10 17:07 UTC 2002 |
What's a 'lion cut'? My parents cut Benjie's hair a couple of weeks ago...
she looks like a different dog with her hair cut, especially since that means
it changes color.
|