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| 25 new of 163 responses total. |
krj
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response 53 of 163:
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Jan 22 03:02 UTC 2003 |
In one of the music industry's biggest legal wins to date, a federal
judge has ruled that copyright holders can use the expedited subpoena
powers of the Digital Millenium Copyright Act to compel ISPs to
disclose the subscriber ID associated with a given IP address when
the copyright holder has observed that IP address
offering copyrighted files on a peer-to-peer service, such as Kazaa.
No judicial review is required of such expedited subpoenas.
The DMCA procedures clearly applied in cases where the suspected
copyright infringement resided on a web server at the ISP's office;
The case turned on whether the DMCA applies to ISPs in their role
passing through files which resided on subscribers' own computers.
It would appear that, at a minimum, many thousands of P2P users will
shortly be getting direct communications from the RIAA.
This was the "RIAA vs. Verizon" case.
http://www.wired.com/news/digiwood/0,1412,57330,00.html
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gull
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response 54 of 163:
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Jan 22 14:37 UTC 2003 |
The prosecution in the Norwegian DeCSS case has decided to seek an
appeal of Jon Johansen's aquittal.
http://online.securityfocus.com/news/2102
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krj
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response 55 of 163:
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Jan 23 15:36 UTC 2003 |
resp:53 :: I want to paste in two quotes about the privacy implications
of the RIAA/Verizon ruling. The first is from a Washington Post
online dicussion with intellectual property attorney Megan Gray, who
filed friend-of-the-court briefs in the case on behalf of the
Electronic Frontier Foundation and similar groups. She describes the
mechanism the court has upheld:
"The burden of proof ((to get a DMCA subpoena)) is zero.
All RIAA or any purported copyright holder needs to do is submit
a signed letter saying (1) I am a copyright owner in [insert name
of copyrighted work]; (2) The material at [insert description]
infringes my copyright; (3) I swear under penalty of perjury
that the purpose that I am submitting this paper is to get the
identity of an alleged infringer and I will use that information
only to protect my copyrights. The purported copyright holder
submits this signed letter to a court clerk -- no judge or lawyer
at the court reviews this document, ever. Under the DMCA, the court
clerk is *required* to approve the letter and issue a subpoena."
http://discuss.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/zforum/03/sp_technews_gray012203.h
tm
Salon runs an AP story which quotes Verizon's counsel Sarah Deutsch:
"The case clearly allows anyone who claims to be a copyright holder
to make an allegation of copyright infringement to gain complete
access to private subscriber information without protections
afforded by the courts."
http://www.salon.com/tech/wire/2003/01/21/verizon/index.html
http://www.cdfreaks.com/news2.php3?ID=5565
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Recall that this case was not about whether Verizon could be forced to
disclose the subscriber information; rather it was about whether Verizon
could be forced to disclose it without judicial review. In the matter
of uncovering the identity of Internet users, Congress and courts have
now delegated the subpoena power to any private party who wishes to grab it
and is willing to run the trivial legal risk of signing a false statement.
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russ
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response 56 of 163:
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Jan 24 01:29 UTC 2003 |
Re #55: Interesting. If your records are turned over pursuant to
a subpoena, do you at least get informed so that you can sue?
I can see a new application: the VPN-tunnel between computers
so that a person can act as an anonymizing proxy for others.
The proxy works for http, P2P services, and a bunch of other
things. This way, neither the ISP nor the RIAA can know who
the requests are coming from, or where the data are actually
stored; neither a subpoena nor a search following it yields
anything useful, especially if the proxy keeps no logs.
Slashdot today has a story about the imminent collapse of the
record labels.
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gull
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response 57 of 163:
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Jan 24 14:06 UTC 2003 |
Re #56: I know there were various groups working on anonymous file
sharing software of some sort, but I haven't heard anything about them
lately. In the one I vaguely recall hearing about, the design was
distributed in the extreme -- files were spread across systems, and
connections were forwarded around the network so that you couldn't know
where the various chunks had come from. The on-disk storage was also
encrypted so that any particular user had no way of knowing what files
were stored on thier system. (Plausible deniability, of a sort.)
Interesting stuff.
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mcnally
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response 58 of 163:
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Jan 24 15:58 UTC 2003 |
Sounds great from a technical standpoint, but given the current reality
that mere possession of certain kinds of information (specifically child
pornography) is a felony with jail time and ruin-your-life potential,
I'm not so sure that I want to participate in a system where I've got
"no way of knowing what files [are] stored on [my] system," plausible
deniability or no..
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hash
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response 59 of 163:
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Jan 24 19:35 UTC 2003 |
this may have been mentioned, but I think it's funny that Disney is trying
so hard to keep pushing out the length of copyright, when they've made
billions off of things in the public domain.
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remmers
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response 60 of 163:
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Jan 24 21:45 UTC 2003 |
(I mentioned it in resp:43. The adjective I used was "disgusting".)
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krj
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response 61 of 163:
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Jan 25 01:47 UTC 2003 |
Russ's resp:56 refers to the polemic from Charles C. Mann, who has been
writing about copyright issues & the music industry at least since
Napster appeared. It's the cover story on the dead-tree issue of Wired
for February, and you can now read it at:
http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/11.02/
Mann frames his piece with an account of his last chat with Timothy
White, the editor of Billboard Magazine who died suddenly last year.
According to Mann, White was predicting the collapse of the whole
music biz. The article does make the observation that the recording
industry needs friends, lots of them, to tackle each of its big problems,
and it doesn't have many friends -- it is resented by its talent, its
its customers, its retailers and its co-business people in the hardware
industry in a way that might be unique.
Two amusing quotes:
"Why, when most industries are using technology to slash costs, is
Michael Jackson running up $30 million in studio bills? Or, rather,
why is Sony Music letting him?"
"Ultimately, Timothy ((White)) suggested to me that night, the
industry as we know it could vanish not so much because of technology
but because few people over the age of 30 would care if it did."
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Might as well stick in some more dark gloom pieces. The Boston Herald
runs a piece with a local focus where the music biz complains more about
CD burners than about online file sharing -- oops, that piece from
last Friday has gone into the for-pay archive. Two quotes:
After discussing the widely shared view that most current releases
aren't very good: "Or as one major label executive said in a recent
issue of Billboard, 'The storm might pass more quickly if someone
would make a decent record.'
Also: "One other cultural factor that must be pointed out is the
decreasing importance of music as the generation-defining cultural
touchstone," followed up with a couple of retailers and students
offering quotes suggesting that music is not the all-consuming
passion that it was for many of us 15-25 years ago.
---------
And for doom, you can't get much better than Norman Lebrecht, author of
"Who Killed Classical Music?" In a November column, Lebrecht kicks
around the rubble of the classical music recording industry which
he already thinks is dead.
http://www.scena.org/columns/lebrecht/021127-NL-dilemma.html
Lebrecht points out that in two of the remaining "success" stories
in classical music, the recording artists aren't getting much more
than beer money. Naxos, the very successful budget label, pays its
artists a flat $1000 with no further royalties.
And, for the widely reported venture where the London Symphony started
releasing its own discs: the orchestra divvied up the profits among
the musicians, and each musician made only about 100 UK Pounds ($150)
for all the dozen albums the LSO issued -- that's just a little more
than US $10 per album recorded.
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mcnally
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response 62 of 163:
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Jan 25 06:40 UTC 2003 |
Ironically, the US $10 / album each musician earned wouldn't even pay
for them to buy a retail copy of the music they'd performed.
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keesan
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response 63 of 163:
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Jan 25 19:56 UTC 2003 |
Couldn't they borrow a copy from a friend and burn a CD from it?
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anderyn
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response 64 of 163:
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Jan 25 22:40 UTC 2003 |
Errr, Sindi, that's not the point -- the musicians should have been able to
be paid more for that much work.
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tonster
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response 65 of 163:
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Jan 26 01:06 UTC 2003 |
they can be. the studios and record labels need to be paid much less,
and the RIAA needs to be paid nothing.
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gull
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response 66 of 163:
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Jan 26 01:18 UTC 2003 |
Re #58: True. I wonder, if the file were striped RAID-style across a
bunch of systems, so no one person actually had a useful file by
themselves, if that'd still be prosecutable.
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krj
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response 67 of 163:
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Jan 26 07:13 UTC 2003 |
I think Sindi is making a joke in resp:63.
Twila and Tony in resp:64 and resp:65 :: Lebrecht's argument is that
it is unclear how the artists *can* get paid any more in "serious" classical
music recording. The major labels can no longer make money off of their
classical artists; the major labels are cancelling the contracts of almost all
their classical artists, except for a handful of stars like Cecilia Bartoli.
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anderyn
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response 68 of 163:
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Jan 27 01:11 UTC 2003 |
I simply wonder if there's a way for musicians (particularly classical ones)
to be paid what their art is worth without dealing with labels making money.
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russ
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response 69 of 163:
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Jan 27 03:19 UTC 2003 |
Re #58: That would be a reason to run either a proxy node or
a storage node, but not both. Helping other people hide without
any knowledge of what you're hiding or transferring is unlikely
to do more than make the authorities terribly grumpy; what could
they do?
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mcnally
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response 70 of 163:
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Jan 27 08:58 UTC 2003 |
re #69:
> Helping other people hide without any knowledge of what you're
> hiding or transferring is unlikely to do more than make the
> authorities terribly grumpy; what could they do?
So long as the answer to that question remains unknown and the worst-case
scenario is sufficiently fearful, I suspect there will be few takers to
participate in such a scheme -- that's the nefarious nature of a chilling
effect.
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cmcgee
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response 71 of 163:
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Jan 27 12:38 UTC 2003 |
Accessory after the fact. You can be tried for murder in Texas if you
simply start a riot in which someone is killed. Conspiracy.
What can they do? Lots.
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scott
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response 72 of 163:
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Jan 27 14:05 UTC 2003 |
They can already take your computer on fairly loose charges, and if the info
is "encrypted" that's more incentive to pretty much destroy your data (and
deprive you of your computer for months) while deciding if they want to press
charges or not.
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russ
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response 73 of 163:
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Jan 28 05:23 UTC 2003 |
Re #72: You're using an incorrect premise. People running
proxy nodes *would not have any data*; all they would do is
decrypt and forward requests, and encrypt and forward responses.
The purpose of the proxies is to anonymize the traffic. There
might be more than one level of indirection. People trying to
find the data would have to follow proxy connections which
change from day to day, or even minute to minute.
AFAIK, there is no law, regulation or precedent which says that
you're committing a crime for refusing to leave your name and
address everywhere you go, or helping someone else to do the
same. This is more or less analogous.
And on the funny side:
http://www.chron.com/content/chronicle/comics/archive/showComic.hts?date=20
03/1/27&name=Fox_Trot&quality=g
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scott
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response 74 of 163:
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Jan 28 14:05 UTC 2003 |
Re 73: You're assuming we have sufficiently intelligent law enforcement which
will not just go on periodic witchhunts.
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gull
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response 75 of 163:
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Jan 28 15:03 UTC 2003 |
I wonder if an open, anonymous proxy could be considered an "attractive
nuisance" for legal purposes? At very least I suspect anyone running such a
thing would quickly find themselves forwarding vast quantities of spam.
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mcnally
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response 76 of 163:
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Jan 28 17:07 UTC 2003 |
re #75:
> At very least I suspect anyone running such a thing would quickly
> find themselves forwarding vast quantities of spam.
This isn't a mail proxy we're talking about, it's a file service proxy.
I suppose it could still be used to inflict spam on people, but not in
the same way.
My guess is that if this sort of service became popular enough to be
useful it would be quickly be outlawed on the pretext of protecting us
from child pornography and no lawmaker would dare to vote against the
legislation..
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russ
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response 77 of 163:
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Jan 29 02:58 UTC 2003 |
Re #74: No, I'm assuming that a siezure without probable cause will
be struck down by the courts, and police agencies won't do that more
than once in a given milieu.
Re #75: Anonymous remailers stayed up for some time after spam
became a problem. So have many anonymizing http proxies. One
could always require "hash cash" or the like to prevent abuses.
Re #76: Since such proxies have many lawful uses (such as merely
being able to research privately, without leaving traces in the
http logs of competitors), I doubt the courts would uphold a ban.
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