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| Author |
Message |
| 25 new of 104 responses total. |
selena
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response 50 of 104:
| 
Jul 26 12:01 UTC 1996 |
Lemme restate-
*I* do!
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pfv
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response 51 of 104:
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Jul 26 16:28 UTC 1996 |
selena - you made your point - perhaps you should repeat it 12 mor times,
eh?
And, such an eloquent argument/point, too
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brighn
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response 52 of 104:
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Jul 26 21:25 UTC 1996 |
Pete, you're hardly one for stating a point once and letting it be.
Honestly, it sounds like everyone except Selena is willing to at least give
it a go... and if it's a wash, she can tell us all she old us so. =}
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pfv
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response 53 of 104:
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Jul 26 22:12 UTC 1996 |
Actually, when I enter an item I tend to express a reason why (not) -
there is a world of difference, even if my viewpoint differs from some
other persons...
Big difference - which should be obvious..
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sidhe
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response 54 of 104:
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Jul 27 00:16 UTC 1996 |
Well, I feel it should have never been, and as it was put in as a noise
when it was specifically disallowed should earn it the honor of never
being allowed again. If you want to emote in party, get your own channel,
or use another system's party program. Grex's party is good because it is
different. Leave it different.
Perhaps it will serve as a lesson not to go screwing around with decisions
made in the opposite direction, as this was. If it were put to a *proper
discussion*, as it was about a year ago, I'd be as against it then as I
was a year ago, when this was PROPERLY discussed, not jury-rigged by
nephi. I applaud scott's actions, and reccomend that emote never be
allowed again, to remind certain meddlesome partyadmins not to so
wholeheartedly disregard the previously stated views of the members of
grex. Nephi seems to forget his function in the role- JANITOR. He is
supposed to install noises as they are requested, so long as they are not
emote or worse. Of course he wants emote- it lessens the amount of new
noise requests he has to ignore!
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scott
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response 55 of 104:
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Jul 27 01:28 UTC 1996 |
For what it's worth, I'm happy with nephi's work as partyadm. I wanted to
make a little bit of a point with him about the emote, and the method I chose
ended up producing a lot more hooplah than I planned. That's the risk of that
method, one I've had to deal with before. :/
Anyway, it ended up in Coop, which is the Right Place for it.
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popcorn
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response 56 of 104:
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Jul 27 06:06 UTC 1996 |
Ditto -- I'm happy with nephi's work as partyadm. Most people don't know it,
but partyadm gets a zillion requests a day. Nephi puts in a bunch of work
dealing with all that. Lots of effort and not a lot of thanks. I'm glad he's
there to do it.
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dam
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response 57 of 104:
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Jul 27 15:28 UTC 1996 |
I don't use party, but as far as I can tell from the discussion, the only
difference between 'emote' and just entering things, is 'emote' lets you talk
in the 3rd person. So what is wrong with it? What is the difference for
potential of abusive behaviour in the 3rd person between angle brackets, and
after a username and a colon?
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pfv
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response 58 of 104:
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Jul 27 17:38 UTC 1996 |
There is no difference - wehich is why the naysayers really have no leg to
stand on..
And, with the janc-mod that stores whomever triggers a noise (anonymous or
not), the abuse is almost impossible.. Nice idea, Janc - thankyou ;-)
(now, all we needs is a trailer-byte on input to external filters so we
can determine EOL as fast as possible ;-)
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janc
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response 59 of 104:
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Jul 27 21:06 UTC 1996 |
I am a little bothered by the way this was handled. The message that pointed
party users to this item in this conference was very skewed, and the
replacement was hardly less so.
However, I think most party users want /emote. I also think most party users
have lousy taste.
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pfv
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response 60 of 104:
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Jul 27 21:51 UTC 1996 |
Taste?
Umm... lemme see... The author of said program suggests that
'party' users lack in taste? (we all know that partyers are tastless ;-)
I'd have to respond with the fact that most conferences are about
as tasteful - not to mention that the attitudes of the
"conference-dependent" are rather egocentric - however, it's all a matter
of taste <evil grin> - not to mention a dearth of intelligent conversation
in one or the other at any given..
In truth, Usenet is a better place for conferencing, and IRC is
generally better than party - the difference being that both mean you need
an ISP and they are both specifics, where both grex and mnet and (when you
can reach it) nethernet are generalist-systems.
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mdw
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response 61 of 104:
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Jul 28 01:13 UTC 1996 |
I think emote is a matter of taste. Personally, I think it's sort of
tasteless - you actually had to be more creative (not to mention more
familiar with the noises, or at least with tools to find noises), when
you couldn't say "just anything" but had to find a way to use the
existing noises to say what you wanted.
IRC & usenet are *different*. Esp. with PicoSpan & usenet, you are
talking about apples & oranges. W/ Usenet, you reach a huge audience,
and there is a lot of other stuff going on at the same time. The only
way to deal with a lot of it, is to think of it as being like a
newspaper - you use yesterday's to wrap the fish, and if you go away for
a weekend, you don't worry about catching up. IRC is, so far as the
functionality provided, more like party, although the user interface is
definitely not the same. But you have the same scale issue as usenet,
and that means you get some *very* odd behavior - if you check out any
typical IRC server, you will find hundreds of people each waiting in
their own individual "chat" room - that is *definitely* way different
than you see here on grex. Basically, something like grex is dealing
with "medium" scale human interaction, several hundred humans,
while something like IRC or Usenet is dealing with the "very
large" scale, thousands and millions of people.
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pfv
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response 62 of 104:
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Jul 28 03:55 UTC 1996 |
I prefer to see what sorta' english a user can manage on his own - without
the crutch of preprogrammed silly-ass noises - this apllies to their text
AND their noise..
Worse - it also applies to the conferences..
Silly me..
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sidhe
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response 63 of 104:
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Jul 28 04:30 UTC 1996 |
As a member who voiced against this in the first place, I am
appalled at the thought of this being put back into place, when no
properly run conversation on it has reversed the decision made on it
a year ago!
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scg
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response 64 of 104:
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Jul 28 05:26 UTC 1996 |
How does one properly run a conversation?
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pfv
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response 65 of 104:
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Jul 28 05:39 UTC 1996 |
well, you line them up (staggered), and then shoot the runners - it's
saves time to the finish line..
Golly, I am so glad that a few folks are bent... I dunno' if I coulda'
stood for a concensus..
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janc
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response 66 of 104:
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Jul 28 07:11 UTC 1996 |
I've seen only a few reasonably strong argument against it.
- A certain amount of editorial control has been applied to the noisetab
in the past. For instance, the partyadms are unlikely to create anything
like
/rape <$0 rapes $1>
The original idea was that a particular "atmosphere" can be created in a
particular channel by allowing a particular array of noises. The types
of noises in a party channel tend to encourge/discourage particular kinds
of behavior, if not in a strong way.
The problem with this argument is that that whole philosophy was pretty
much abandoned long ago, with the hugely bloated noise list, and the
addition of the /is noise, which has pretty much all the problems of the
/emote noise.
- The addition of a /emote noise makes most of the other noises in the
noisetab redundant. I suspect that when the /emote noise was added,
no other noises were deleted. I suspect if you actually deleted all the
ones rendered redundant by /emote, users would scream and yell, because
they like many of those noises. I've seen people complain about Grex
and M-Net "stealing" noises from each other. People care about their
noises. So aren't you diminishing something of value by making them
all redundant?
The bloat in the noisetab has made listing all the possible noises a
pretty painful experience. But an endless list of vaguely useful
noises is much less obnoxious than an endless list of useless noises.
I think it would make sense to take /emote as an opportunity to solve
the noisetab bloat problem. The reason you won't do that is part of
the reason /emote is in poor taste.
I don't think these two arguments are really very strong. In fact, both
suggest that quite different, and much more drastic things should be done to
solve the party noise problem. (That is, drastically editting down the noise
tab.) However since this would be politically touchy, we are left to choose
between crummy solutions.
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brighn
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response 67 of 104:
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Jul 29 00:38 UTC 1996 |
The second argument is silly, because there *are* redundant noises...
many programmed noises start with "is", some with "think"...
(!findnoise "think" turned up more than a screenful of noises, most of which
are redundant (the ones that didn't scroll away: loserf, loserm, mask,
nosanta, pinky, pinky2, quayle, riker, and trent2) )
As to the other argument, Pete, please read my responses before you say there
is no difference between /emote, /is, and joebob: ... You complain about
other people repeating themselves, and then you do that. The resaon why
people are compelled to repeat themselves ad nauseaum is because other people
make silly blanket statements of "no one here has said ..." when people here
*have* said...
Clearly stated: I favor a trial run of /emote (as it is now). I also
recognize there is a subtle but important psycholinguistic difference in
effect between:
<brighn fucks carson up>
<brighn is fucking carson up>
brighn: i'm gonna fuck you up, carson
brighn: i'm fucking you up, carson
<brighn says "i'm gonna fuck up carson">
<brighn says "i'm fucking up carson">
and so on... if there were NO difference between /emote and /is, NONE AT ALL,
then *clears throat* WHY ARE PFV, RYAN1 AND EVERYONE ELSE WHO IS ARGUING SO
VOCIFEROUSLY IN **FAVOR** OF /EMOTE?
That is to say, if /is and /emote are the same, why are we even bothering with
htis item? Why aren't we all happy with /is?
Logic would suggest one of two possibilities:
(1) There is, in fact, a subtle difference that the proponents of /emote
either don't recognize, can't explain, or refuse to acknowledge
(2) We spend way too much time in here arguing trivialities.
(Granted, (2) goes without saying, but I think (1) holds too...)
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scott
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response 68 of 104:
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Jul 29 00:52 UTC 1996 |
The advantage to canned noises is obvious... I can always spot emote noises
by all the spelling mistakes.
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pfv
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response 69 of 104:
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Jul 29 03:51 UTC 1996 |
I don't "is", but thanks for the input... Filed appropriately ;-)
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tsty
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response 70 of 104:
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Jul 29 15:46 UTC 1996 |
oh, wow ..... the results were probably the 'new toy' effect, but party
sure was over/emoted suddenly....
i guess there were about 2 dozen or so happy typers tapping away.
/tnx
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eskarina
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response 71 of 104:
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Aug 8 10:09 UTC 1996 |
<one happy typer goes to get some strawberries and whipped cream>
Thanks for emote, guys. We all love our new toy.
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selena
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response 72 of 104:
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Aug 9 06:32 UTC 1996 |
Like hell. Real partiers don't emote.
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pfv
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response 73 of 104:
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Aug 9 10:39 UTC 1996 |
And real members verify themselves <shrug>
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jenna
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response 74 of 104:
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Aug 10 04:21 UTC 1996 |
umm.. are you saying every user should be a member
and send grex money, even those who can't afford it?
are you saying we should close the system to non-
paying non-verifyed usrs? and is that saying thagt [people who don't pay
don't care? <set rant mode = off>
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