response 4 of 58:

May 22 02:12 UTC 2002

UP?  Take a couple extra blankets!

response 6 of 58:

May 22 04:27 UTC 2002

        I got the old Ryan family tent.  Actually the family size tent
was the overflow tent for the kids that did not make it into the
pop-up, pull-apart trailer tent camper.  Anybody interested in a 
real canvas tent?  It's still perfectly practical and does not
need to be replaced by some petrolium depleting plastic one.
        I used the two man (or daddy and two boys) tent when I was
in the UP last.  That was a mix of car/state park & motel camping.

        The small rustic state park site near Hell seems to have
disappeared.

response 8 of 58:

May 22 13:10 UTC 2002

Canvas tents are heavy and difficult to set up compared to newer nylon 
tents.  In my case, especially, where I'll have to set it up by myself, 
a canvas tent that isn't a pup tent would be out of the question.

When I was in Boy Scouts, we had a winter campout for which we took 
sheets of plastic and bales of straw, and built our own tents.  It was 
about 10 degrees out that night.  That's when I learned not to wear my 
pants to bed in a sleeping bag.  I woke up sweaty-wet, and had damp 
pants for the first couple of hours.

response 10 of 58:

May 22 14:11 UTC 2002

Plastic makes a terrible tenting material unless you have some way to screen
out the insects and also ventilate.  You want something with a separate
waterproof fly, and then another layer that breathes.  Otherwise it gets very
damp and therefore cold inside.  Down is not a good idea in damp climates like
Michigan, try Hollofil or other synthetics that stay warm when wet.
For camping you need some sort of shelter (to keep out rain and insects) and
bedding, and something to cook on (it can be wood and rocks, or a tiny stove
that runs on a small can of fuel) and something to cook in.  A wok with a
cover can be used for both boiling and frying - we also took a small pressure
cooker which cooks grains much faster.  A metal bowl and spoon to eat with.
A change of clothing and a small towel.  Lots of food.  Transportation (in
this country you need your own but in others you can take a bus to the park).
Raingear.  First-aid equipment.  Summer camping does not require lanterns or
flashlights.

response 12 of 58:

May 22 16:51 UTC 2002

I have something to say about gear advertised as "warm when wet" I have 
done quite a lot of wilderness camping including several winter trips. 
It has been my experience that "warm when wet" does not 
mean 'comfortable when wet' but instead means 'warm enough to survive 
but wish you had hypothermia to end the misery'

The moral of the story is: Stay dry :)

response 14 of 58:

May 22 20:07 UTC 2002

Andrea and I got engaged at Tahquamenon Falls, and went there on our 
honeymoon.  I plan on skipping that this time.

I love the Shipwreck Museum.  I've seen other such museums, but none I 
thought were as good as that one.

I might take John on a Pictured Rocks tour.  He likes boats all right, 
but I don't know how impressed he'd be by the actual tour.

I'm looking forward to showing him the Houghton Lift Bridge.  I'm sure 
he's never seen a lift bridge before.

Some things I've never seen/done, that we might go and take a look at 
are Drummond Island, Lake of the Clouds, and a trip into a copper mine.

Some things I've seen many times and refuse to miss: Brockway Mountain, 
Lac La Belle, Estavant Pines, McLain State Park, the many waterfalls of 
the Keeweenaw Peninsula, the wonderful waterfalls of the Black River.

I, at least, will get a decent pasty somewhere.

response 16 of 58:

May 22 22:10 UTC 2002

Jep - can I be your honorary kid for a week?  I miss the U.P.  ;-)

I thought the Pictured Rocks tour was cool, even as a student up there.  He'll
love it.

response 18 of 58:

May 22 23:54 UTC 2002

I do most of my camping while traveling by motorcycle.  Small 2 person 
sized tent, plus a vinyl poncho as a ground cloth.  I need to replace my 
sleeping bag with one better suited to cooler temperatures, but it is a 
standard rectangular sort than rols up nicely, and which I then cover 
with a piece of material which seems to be two layers of spandex with a 
layer of rubber bonded between them.  It's waterproof, durable, and has a 
slight thermal quality to it.  Usually I use my rolled up coat as a 
pillow.  As for cooking gear, I am not usually out of civilization for 
days at a time, so all I really need is a bunch of strike-anywhere 
matches in a pharmacy pill bottle (waterproof seal), a pair of 
chopsticks, a flagon, and a jug of water, which I usually strap to the 
gas tank of the bike.

I prefer to camp in as rustic an environment as possible, which is not 
often what I get.  National Forests are far better than Parks.  I have 
managed on occasion to forego showering and bathing for extended periods 
while on the road, but that only makes it feel better to peel off the 
black leather when the opportunity comes to do so.  ;)

response 20 of 58:

May 23 02:11 UTC 2002

re #16: Heh.  Ask me again next year and I'll probably consider it.

re #17: Sindi, I had a friend in college, with cerebral palsy, who used 
to ride from south of Lansing to Houghton.  If you and Jim are into 
long-distance bike riding, you could make it to the UP and see quite a 
lot of it in a week or two.

As for me, I like to take a shower every day, even when I'm camping.  
Or at least go for a swim.  If that makes me a wimp, so be it, but this 
is the 21st century and there's no such thing as really enduring 
hardship in America.  State park campground have modern bathroom 
facilities.  I don't object to that at all.

It probably won't snow in the UP in early June, but Lake Superior will 
definitely not be fit for swimming, not even in the bays.  John and I 
will give it a try, of course, being men, but I don't anticipate 
staying in for long.  Maybe some of the smaller lakes will be 
tolerable.  Maybe we'll stay a night or two in a hotel, since he loves 
to swim and we could go to a place with a swimming pool.

response 22 of 58:

May 23 04:31 UTC 2002

I used to do a lot of camping.  There was a year when I slept one night
in 8 in my tent.  We have a family sized tent now that we are a family
sized family, but haven't done much with it.

response 24 of 58:

May 23 12:49 UTC 2002

It is a lifelong dream of mine to get to Isle Royale some day.  I fell 
in love with it when I first heard of it as a kid, but I've never been 
there.  I'll have to wait until John is a few years older, I think, but 
we'll go someday.

The Yooper Tourist Trap was not there the last time I was in the 
Western UP.  I have no doubt we'll be stopping by.  And probably buying 
some tapes or CDs.

response 26 of 58:

May 23 15:16 UTC 2002

We were headed to Isle Royale and discovered that Porcupine Mountains is the
other end of the same geological formation and is much easier to get to.  You
can camp anywhere in the park (hang up your food to avoid bears).  No burning
of wood.  There are cabins to reserve. No vehicles in the park.

We know someone who bikes to northern Michigan in a hurry but he does not
carry on his bike a tent, mat, sleeping bag, pots and pans, and food.  He
stays in hotels, that is his idea of fun.  We carry up to 50 lb of gear (Jim
does - I get the lighter stuff so I can keep up) and avoid the roads with
traffic which means we bike mainly on dirt roads, which is slow but more fun.
We have stayed in farmer's fields or gravel quarries or people's yards - at
one point two people at the supermarket were bidding for our presence.  We
spent a few days on the last family dairy farm in Michigan and climbed the
silo (I watched).  Nobody is afraid of someone on a bike.  Even car camping
in the boonies (more than 100 miles from a big city) can be done like this.
Having a little kid ask permission would be a big help.  Even with me asking,
we would be offered a place to camp way back in the woods on a private lake
owned by someone with a large collection of exotic birds, or someone with an
egg farm and a restored steam tractor.  You have to be prepared for an
occasional suspicious rejection.

response 28 of 58:

May 23 16:36 UTC 2002

re #25: When I was living there, some people had private yachts, and 
the bridge had to go up for those.  You'd get the bridge going up 
several times per day in the summer.  We'll find a way to see it go up 
and down, anyway.

Hmm, come to think of it, once the ice broke up, they used to raise the 
bridge; there was a road going across it in it's lowest position, then 
in a higher position as well.  It still had to be raised for the 
tallest boats going under.  Is that what you mean, that the Ranger is 
the only one tall enough to need the bridge to be raised to it's 
highest position?

re #26: From what I know of the people in the UP -- a fair amount, as I 
used to be in the National Guard with them -- if a tourist came by and 
asked to camp in someone's yard, they'd react adversely.  Call the 
police, get a shotgun, send you to eat dinner at a horrendously bad 
restaurant, something like that.

If you were a stooooodent, you'd get worse treatment than that, but 
that's another subject.

I'll stay in public campgrounds, I think.

No one has mentioned the Soo Locks as an attraction in the UP.  I don't 
think we'll be going there, unless John really wants to; I've seen them 
several times and took a boat tour through them once (with the family, 
including John).  It's an interesting place to visit, watching 500-700 
foot ore freighters come through, and watching them be raised or 
lowered 50 feet or so to be able to pass through the straights.  It's a 
worthwhile trip if you've never been there.