response 38 of 357:

Jun 20 02:21 UTC 2010

Or cyberspace communications could start a second (fresh) system for 
conferencing.  It would live in the cloud and not be encumbered by old 
software and old rules. This version would remain and we could see how it 
goes for both of them.

response 40 of 357:

Jun 20 04:45 UTC 2010

once this cirle jerk circus stops spinning then grex is dead. we have 
the same people debating the same topic over and over. with no clear 
winner.

I say offer some cool ass php games like facebook does. keep the shell 
for those granfathered in and attact other users with the sort of games 
facebook does.

80% of facebook revenue is either directly or indirectly connected to 
games.

my first suggestion is  "kill the neo-commies"

I can code it if you can support it.

response 44 of 357:

Jun 20 04:57 UTC 2010

level 8

get the whole ann arbor circle jerk circus in an uproar


level 9

make marcvh do a google search

level 10

defend the hero cross against all comers

level 11

make nharmon address you personly

level 12

flame fatass steve and ugly glenda for never participating in a system 
they desire to control

response 46 of 357:

Jun 20 15:47 UTC 2010

Re 38: If that would help Grex financially and in terms of its mission,
it'd be worth discussing.  It sounds a lot like throwing in the towel on
the one community idea, though.  Unfortunately, it may be the best way
to move Grex forward when significant change is required.

Re 39: That sounds reasonable to me.  It would probably just be an
indent of the quoted text with a couple blank lines, but it would help a
lot to differentiate quote from response.  A simple tag could indicate
start and end of the quote.  Of course, once you add tags like that you
might as well just be running a more modern bbs which supports such
things, including editing.

Re 40: Debate is generally a good thing.  But endless debate without
conclusion and not changing with changing times will kill Grex.  Given
that a lot of people (as evidenced by Facebook) want to play games this
might be something we can do to gain users.  For example, Grexburg!
We've always offered text-based games so it's not like games are
forbidden.

We still need to encourage communication and discussion as part of our
main mission.  (It may be that some people who come here to play games
will become involved in other activities on on Grex.)

However, using a game to defame other users won't help Grex (legally or
otherwise) even if it is done humorously.

For those of you who are not members, but want Grex to do or not do
something, why are you not members?  What would convince you to become a
member?

response 48 of 357:

Jun 20 16:43 UTC 2010

And the financial aspect of membership is the least important.  

response 50 of 357:

Jun 20 20:08 UTC 2010

Right; if we can't get members, then it becomes painfully obvious that
the membership can no longer support the corporation.

response 52 of 357:

Jun 21 00:30 UTC 2010

The board is a group of people who have generously volunteered to help 
(note the word "help") keep the system viable.  They are working with not 
a lot of money, almost no staff, and a group of users who are unwilling to 
consider any change unless it meets their personal preference regardless 
of the bigger picture.  It's sad, really.

Go to your room, Richard, until you can come out and apologize to those 
willing to be your pinata.  Or get on the board yourself and show us how 
it should be done.  

response 54 of 357:

Jun 21 01:48 UTC 2010

I don't know how much money Grex has now, but I quit being a member
because it had a big bankroll and nothing on which to spend money.  The
only purpose for contributing money to Grex under those circumstances is
because you don't want to have it yourself.  I think Grex still has
plenty of money for any conceivable need over quite a few years.

If it has a need for more money, I will send a check.  Grex is valuable
to me, and I will support it as needed.

I haven't voted because I am not a member and so not eligible.  I did
vote a half year ago when longtime users such as myself were invited to
do so.

As for a vision for the future, I like Grex now.  I won't use it if it
becomes anything like Facebook, because I don't enjoy Facebook.  And if
I did, I would spend time there. 

I agree that Grex needs a stronger user base and isn't going to get one
by remaining as it is.  I haven't thought of any changes to the user
interface or functionality which would bring more users in, while
retaining what I like about it now.

I think a lot of what has driven many people away has been the
willingness and ability of conversation snipers such as zulu and lar to
disrupt discussions.  I think they will eventually drive me away, too,
which is why I think it's a reason why others have left.  Grex has held
to it's choice to be "free speech", which really means to retain such as
those at the expense of others who would be more community minded. 
People who won't tolerate that kind of stuff leave, and so the snipers
become more and more prominent.  If that problem had been solved years
ago, I think Grex would be a lot more stable now, and a lot more
interesting.  I don't know if it's too late and I don't think those
remaining want to change the Grex philosophy of doing business, anyway.

response 56 of 357:

Jun 21 02:43 UTC 2010

If we were to invest everything we have in a new system (which is what
it would take given some of the staff's suggestions), we'd be without
funds to operate.  

It is also prudent to keep some money as back up in the event of a
shortfall in funds or an increase in expenses, thus not all of the money
we have is available for a new system.  So we'll come up short if we
try to do that.  It has been suggested to run a fund-raiser for a new
system, which I think is fine.  But we need to to have a clear idea of
what we want to do with that new system (which is what this item is
intended for).

response 58 of 357:

Jun 21 17:17 UTC 2010

Re 57: yeah, that's on my list of ideas, too.  Other similar systems
have lower rates, so to be competitive, we might want to lower the
cost.  Then it wouldn't prove as much a barrier to those who feel
Grex has a huge pile of cash (which I would argue it doesn't unless
you feel like limping along like we are now, with few members, old
equipment, etc. in which case we have about a year or so to go).

response 60 of 357:

Jun 21 19:00 UTC 2010

re #52 see this is one of the problems.  You suggest ideas here and 
people get defensive.  Grex has thousands of dollars in the bank and 
yet was down for more than a month this past December because it took 
that long to get the board to meet and authorize a hundred bucks to 
purchase new hardware.  It also didn't help that even though there 
multiple staff members, there was only one apparently who knew the old 
code well enough to be of any use fixing it.  Poor STeve got bashed for 
taking so long fixing things when other staff members didn't want to 
touch Grex with a ten foot pole.

At least one board member (Cross) said he wanted Grex to go away.  

So don't sit here and get defensive when you've got a Grex that is a 
shell of what it once was and expect people to call those serving on 
the staff saints.  Hey I've volunteered places and I've never looked at 
the fact that I was donating my own time as an excuse to be above all 
criticism.  

response 62 of 357:

Jun 21 20:37 UTC 2010

Yep.