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Grex > Helpers > #140: Grex System Problems - Spring 2005 | |
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| Author |
Message |
| 25 new of 457 responses total. |
eprom
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response 343 of 457:
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Jun 2 04:47 UTC 2005 |
it'd be nice if we could post edit our posts....I made a boo-boo :O
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glenda
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response 344 of 457:
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Jun 2 07:10 UTC 2005 |
STeve is working on it as he has time. He is having a real time crunch at
work with many machines there acting up, budget time for purchase of new
machines with their installation problems (and what looks like a bad batch
of Dells). When choosing between the paying job and volunteer Grex to spend
limited time and energy on, I'm sorry, but the paying job has to win.
Especially this summer when my job gets dropped from 20 hrs/wk during the
semester to just 4 wks of work from May through September.
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cross
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response 345 of 457:
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Jun 2 13:06 UTC 2005 |
This response has been erased.
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twenex
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response 346 of 457:
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Jun 2 13:34 UTC 2005 |
Anyone doing a simple cost/benefit analysis of
being root staff of grex would be have to be either crazy to do it, or
they'd very likely have some kind of agenda.
Anyone who doesn't have an agenda is probably not the kind of person you want
to have around when the going gets tough. That happens a LOT in system
administration - on any platform you care to name.
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gull
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response 347 of 457:
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Jun 2 13:53 UTC 2005 |
Re resp:345: Well, information hiding is one way an "in group" stays
exclusive. Information is power in any organization.
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naftee
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response 348 of 457:
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Jun 2 14:58 UTC 2005 |
re 344 That means you can start cooking at home ! :-0
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nharmon
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response 349 of 457:
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Jun 2 15:06 UTC 2005 |
The old argument of "anyone who wants to be {root,ircop,sysop,admin} just
wants it for the power, or to further their agenda, otherwise, they wouldn't
want to be {root,ircop,sysop,admin}" has been used for decades to discourage
people from volunteering their time to improve a system.
I mean, am I the only one who was somewhat offended that when people started
suggesting that we need more volunteers that the response was that the user's
were to blame because of how staff is treated in BBS.
Which, by the way, I don't buy for a second. After system crashes, there is
usually an outpouring of gratitude and support from the users. Save for a few
trolls here and there, people generally support the staff.
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tod
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response 350 of 457:
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Jun 2 15:26 UTC 2005 |
re #344
Thanks for the status update. I can certainly sympathize. Best of luck to
STeve.
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rcurl
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response 351 of 457:
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Jun 2 16:22 UTC 2005 |
Would STeve be willing to have some staff apprentices work with him?
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nharmon
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response 352 of 457:
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Jun 2 17:14 UTC 2005 |
How about Grex call out for people who are willing to volunteer to help out
with the system. These volunteers can list their abilities, things they are
good at. Then you take that, create a skills matrix, and assign projects;
problems; etc. to teams of people with the skills applicable to that project;
problem; etc.
Then all Steve would really need to do is make sure things get down, and are
routed to the appropriate teams.
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tod
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response 353 of 457:
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Jun 2 17:30 UTC 2005 |
re #352
But that sounds like WORK! :(
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keesan
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response 354 of 457:
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Jun 2 17:59 UTC 2005 |
Glenda, could STeve show you how to help with this during the period when you
are not working?
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twenex
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response 355 of 457:
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Jun 2 18:48 UTC 2005 |
Re: #349. Nate, you're right.
To be fair, not all the sysadmins on Grex blame the users. For various
reasons, some of them unrelated to their capacities as sysadmin, I've
suspected for quite a while that some of those who do have a generalized
attitude problem.
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jep
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response 356 of 457:
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Jun 2 19:07 UTC 2005 |
re resp:351: In fairness to the staff members such as STeve, training
someone else to do a job is hard. If he doesn't have time to fix
newuser, he probably doesn't have time to teach someone else how to fix
it.
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twenex
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response 357 of 457:
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Jun 2 19:16 UTC 2005 |
Grex needs to bulk up it's core, but the "in" group here has as one of
it's very highest principles than no one else "gets it". The silent
majority of us peripheral users support their belief, too.
Grex needs to bulk up it's core, but the "in" group here has as one of
it's very highest principles than no one else "gets it". The silent
majority of us peripheral users support their belief, too.
If that's true, which it very well may be, then it's the "in group" that need
to "get it". Many of our most regular users (myself included) have some level
of UN*X expertise. Many more of them, perhaps excluding only the trolls,
subscribe to some version of our "philosophy". Indeed, iirc, complaints about
the (perceived or real) abuse of the system or its principles have, when
specific, usually come from the users and been directed at staff, not the other
way around; other staff have also either kept silent on the issue or defended
the target(s) of the complaints.
It's easier to inculcate technical expertise than philosophy. Perhaps none of
those outside the "in group" have the expertise to hack on a binary-only copy
of newuser, but given that those who do won't last forever
(for whatever reason), who cares? It may be time to start replacing our
proprietary sw with open-source versions, or at least with versions which have
source code open, but only to staff. The more sysadmins we have, the more
time they will collectively be able to spend on projects like this. If staff
want more colleagues, and they don't accept that people who might have the
ability to join them might not know Grex inside out but can be shown the ropes,
and that their expertise can grow over time (they can learn by doing), they are
going to *have* to accept it. If not, I can only hope, that those users who
care revolt, and set up their own system, a la Grex, just like what happened in
the early nineties to M-Net. I don't know if there's enough momentum for that
to happen, though.
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tod
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response 358 of 457:
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Jun 2 19:25 UTC 2005 |
re #357
revolt, and set up their own system, a la Grex, just like what happened in
the
early nineties to M-Net.
I think you got it backwards. There is too much apathy and ego invested here
for skilled volunteers to "step on toes" I mean..."get trained" by existing
staff.
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rcurl
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response 359 of 457:
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Jun 2 19:29 UTC 2005 |
Re #356: that's a recipe for nothing ever getting fixed when current staff
fades away. But I don't believe it. I suspect there are quite a few
members that need only know what the fault is, and could look at the code
and fix it. OK - ask them to do a "beta" fix, and STeve can check it out
and test it, before installation. But things would move forward - and
some new people would learn how Grex software works.
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tod
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response 360 of 457:
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Jun 2 19:46 UTC 2005 |
I bet Mike McNally could fix newuser without too much tutorial on where it
is and operates but you don't see anyone welcoming him with open arms.
It's a shame more folks aren't invited to volunteer because the qualifications
aren't THAT specialized.
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happyboy
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response 361 of 457:
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Jun 2 19:48 UTC 2005 |
mike doesnt have the proper level of
aspberger's syndrome to fit into that
role.
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tod
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response 362 of 457:
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Jun 2 19:59 UTC 2005 |
If you don't show up for the Grex Trundle and Trough-off then you're not
trustworthy.
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mary
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response 363 of 457:
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Jun 2 20:04 UTC 2005 |
Is this the part where we're being nice to staff?
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jep
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response 364 of 457:
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Jun 2 20:07 UTC 2005 |
re resp:363: I see offers of help, and tod and happyboy being
irrelevantly trivial which is normal for them. What do you think would
help?
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happyboy
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response 365 of 457:
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Jun 2 20:14 UTC 2005 |
you just responded to yourself, nerse ratchet
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naftee
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response 366 of 457:
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Jun 2 20:29 UTC 2005 |
would you trust a gay man with your children ?
would you trust TWENEX with your COMPUTER ?!
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tod
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response 367 of 457:
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Jun 2 20:36 UTC 2005 |
re #363
WHAT staff? Why is it staff that has the authority to decide who can
volunteer and who can't? Why doesn't the BoD step up to the plate and make
some management decisions instead of letting things drag on over and over?
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