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| Author |
Message |
| 25 new of 378 responses total. |
edina
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response 254 of 378:
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Mar 9 21:50 UTC 2006 |
re 252 Wow. That's just amazing. First off, you are an idiot. Secondly,
if Lynne wanted the surgery, I'd think - cool - and if she didn't, I'd think
the same thing. It's a personal decision and I understand why she's not for
it. Thirdly, the only thing I'll ever tell any fat person who is
bitching/commenting/orating/whining about being discriminated against is that
it is up to them to stand up for themselves. E.R. said it best when she said
the only person who can make you feel inferior is yourself.
Now step off and go get your thorazine shot.
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richard
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response 255 of 378:
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Mar 9 21:53 UTC 2006 |
but I didnt think slynne was whining, therefore your comments about her came
across as belittling to me. Which is my opinion and nobody is an idiot for
having their own opinions.
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edina
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response 256 of 378:
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Mar 9 21:55 UTC 2006 |
Christ, you don't read a word anyone says, do you?
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richard
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response 257 of 378:
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Mar 9 21:58 UTC 2006 |
I do read what you post, you said you don't think fat people should whine
about being discriminated against, presumably because being fat is their
choice. Except it isn't always their choice. Not everyone can afford to have
expensive surgery.
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jep
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response 258 of 378:
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Mar 9 22:00 UTC 2006 |
Lynne, do you feel like Brooke was belittling you?
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tod
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response 259 of 378:
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Mar 9 22:01 UTC 2006 |
Stop presuming.
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edina
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response 260 of 378:
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Mar 9 22:01 UTC 2006 |
That is not what I said - or at least, you are very much A) presuming and B)
taking a few words out of context. Read it again and tell me how I'm oh so
belittling.
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richard
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response 261 of 378:
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Mar 9 22:03 UTC 2006 |
see I'll accept that I *might* have misread or misinterpreted that post. Not
sure I did, but unlike JEP, I accept my own fallability. JEP is always right,
about everything. I admit I am not.
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tod
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response 262 of 378:
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Mar 9 22:06 UTC 2006 |
We are jep.
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edina
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response 263 of 378:
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Mar 9 22:07 UTC 2006 |
Ok, well this isn't the item where you and John act out some gay
porn/political fantasy, ok? This is the item where we talk about how society
handles obesity - good, bad, whatever.
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slynne
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response 264 of 378:
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Mar 9 22:12 UTC 2006 |
resp:250 Denial is a funny thing. I dont think I am in denial about
smoking and I think a big part of that is that there is consistant
research that shows that there is a negative health consequence to
smoking and that it is significant. There are some studies that show
that smoking isnt too bad for you but all of them were conducted by
tobacco companies so I feel ok about not considering them as valid as
the other studies.
And I am not in denial that severe obesity (more than 100lbs overweight
which is a catagory I fall into) is a health risk for certain things. I
have read studies that have shown that obesity is a risk if one has to
have surgury. It is a risk for certain types of cancer. It is a risk
for heart disease. But it isnt as great of a risk as most people think
and even if it were, there is a LOT of evidence that shows that other
than gastric bypass surgury there are no weight loss methods that have
acceptable rates of success for me. The best one anyone here has
presented is that if a person goes on a medically supervised very low
calorie diet, they will lose a very small amount of weight (if they are
average). But I have been on very low calorie diets and I know that
they make me feel bad and I am not willing to live my life that way for
some kind of unconfirmed health benefit.
Beware about common sense, btw. It is often wrong. On an unrelated side
note, if you want a really fun read that is full of examples about how
common sense is often wrong and how once one reads the numbers, a
different conclusion comes up, get _Freakonomics_.
resp:251 I absolutely feel comfortable in my own skin. But that doesnt
mean that I like being treated in a negative way because of my weight.
It doesnt mean that I dont know that my life would be a lot easier in
some ways if I were thin. I think I probably have a better self-esteem
than a lot of people including a lot of thin people. I certainly am
able to handle being accused of "being in denial" when I say that I
dont think that I am lazy or undisciplined because I am fat. I dont
think my weight is a character flaw. I even think I am kind of
beautiful although I also, at the same time, recognize that most other
people probably dont think so.
resp:258 I think Brooke has made this a little more personal than I
would have liked and it does bother me a little bit that whenever there
is a discussion about weight discrimination and prejudice, someone will
always accuse the fat people of being in denial. That happens in almost
every weight discrimination discussion I have ever been in. Truthfully,
I expected it when I first entered this item. I think it is because a
lot of the negative feelings about weight are very ingrained and people
dont give them up easily. They are faced with a choice. Because I
refuse to believe that being fat is as unhealthy as most people think
and because I believe that being fat is a state of being that people
dont have as much control over as they think, they either have to agree
with me or they have to think that I am in denial. There are almost
certainly a lot more people here than tod and edina who think I am in
denial about this. I expect that. Challenging common prejudices is very
hard. But all in all, I dont think she is belittling me. I certainly
dont feel belittled.
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keesan
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response 265 of 378:
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Mar 9 22:42 UTC 2006 |
I am happy that you quit smoking, slynne and todd. My new upstairs neighbor
is trying to quit. Something changed recently and the smoke is getting into
my apartment. I thought we had sealed off all access to my apartment and we
are not using the heating ducts. Today while she was running the furnace we
were airing out my apartment all afternoon. Luckily it was in the 50s and
the doors wide open were sort of nice. I could live with an overweight
upstairs neighbor even though the floor creaks, unless she fell through the
floor or the stairs.
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tod
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response 266 of 378:
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Mar 9 22:49 UTC 2006 |
And I am not in denial that severe obesity (more than 100lbs overweight
which is a catagory I fall into) is a health risk for certain things. I
have read studies that have shown that obesity is a risk if one has to
have surgury. It is a risk for certain types of cancer. It is a risk
for heart disease. But it isnt as great of a risk as most people think
I think 35 lbs over is obese and 100 lbs over is "morbidly obese".
Certainly the threats to life are mostly related to heart disease but the
risks to health are much greater when one is morbidly obese. I don't consider
those facts some sort of prejudice or folklore. Knee problems are very common
for the morbidly obese. Enlarged heart by itself should be enough to get a
person into the doc let alone knowing your cholesterol levels.
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richard
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response 267 of 378:
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Mar 9 22:53 UTC 2006 |
sometimes you can live the perfect life and it still doesn't matter. Dana
Reeve, Christopher Reeve's wife, died this week at age 47. Of lung cancer.
She had never smoked in her entire life and stayed in great shape. It didn't
matter. A person who has surgery and loses 200lbs can still get hit by a bus
outside the hospital. slynne could diet her whole life and still not live
a day longer than had she never dieted. You shouldn't spend your whole life
trying to make things perfect, when things can never BE perfect. There is
not a perfect weight, height or hair color. All you can do is enjoy your
existence in the moment, and BE in that moment, as opposed to constantly
thinking about the next moment.
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tod
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response 268 of 378:
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Mar 9 22:56 UTC 2006 |
That's a neat hippy dippy approach, richard...if you're a selfish ass that
thinks nobody else matters in your life. Its borderline Christian, imo.
"Fate will run things so why should I bother"
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richard
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response 269 of 378:
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Mar 9 23:02 UTC 2006 |
its not borderline christian, its borderline buddhist. or existentialist.
consider if a guy saves all his life for retirement, and the day before he
retires, he drops dead. instead of being in the moment, he spent all his life
preparing for a moment that never came. Life is too random and too short to
NOT live in the moment.
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tod
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response 270 of 378:
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Mar 9 23:04 UTC 2006 |
Like I said...selfish
You don't consider if the guy wants to leave it behind for his kids or wife
or siblings or parents or whomever.
SELFISH, richard.
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rcurl
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response 271 of 378:
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Mar 9 23:04 UTC 2006 |
So the way to really live is to shorten life intentionally?
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naftee
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response 272 of 378:
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Mar 9 23:37 UTC 2006 |
i started re-reading this item, and sort of whoa-ed at resp:8 .
>My grandma had to get both hips replaced.
she has two hips ?? both which had to be replaced due to arthritis ?
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tod
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response 273 of 378:
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Mar 9 23:39 UTC 2006 |
She had each hip replaced, yea. She's long since passed away.
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naftee
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response 274 of 378:
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Mar 10 00:10 UTC 2006 |
RIP :(
also, slynne ! you should stop eating pancakes.
substitute wild rice, or something.
i eat pancakes maybe once every THREE months ?!L if that ?
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richard
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response 275 of 378:
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Mar 10 00:52 UTC 2006 |
re #271 no rcurl, I didn't say anything about intentionally shortening
one's life. What I'm saying is that life isn't a race and there is no
finish line and, unless you believe in an afterlife which I do not,
there is no glory at the end. The only glory as I see it is simply
BEING in the game. If you can't win and you can't lose, and you are
going to die at the end anyway, you may as well just enjoy the
moments. Because those moments are all you have.
Slynne is choosing not to live her life dieting and pursuing some goal
or end that may never come, and won't matter in the long run even if
it does come. She is choosing to BE in her moment and enjoy being in
that moment in and of and for itself.
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rcurl
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response 276 of 378:
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Mar 10 02:30 UTC 2006 |
I still think it doesn't hurt to take moderate action to extend one's
enjoyment of the one life one has. I did, and it has been very good I did.
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slynne
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response 277 of 378:
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Mar 10 04:01 UTC 2006 |
resp:266 Ok, what are the risks? Like in a group of a 100 people who are
morbidly obese, how many of them will be dead by the time they are say
70 compared to a similar group of people of what you consider to be a
healthy weight. This seems to be a difficult statistic to find but it
seems kind of essential to me. I appreciate your good intentions though.
resp:275 Yes, we are all going to die in the end. Which reminds me of a
stat someone once threw at me (with nothing to back it up of course).
They said, "You are fat and fat people have a 50% greater chance of
dying" I couldnt help myself and I said, "So? I have a 150% chance of
dying?" which got a blank stare.
resp:276 I dont think it hurts to take moderate action to extend the
enjoyment of one's life. But I dont think that the kind of weight loss
diet that would be required for me to stay thin is moderate. I also have
not seen any evidence that it would have any effect on the length of my
life. In fact, considering how stressed out I get when I try to lose
weight and considering the known health risks of stress, it might
actually be healthier for me to stay fat.
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klg
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response 278 of 378:
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Mar 10 04:02 UTC 2006 |
(254: Quit calling RW and idiot. That's my job.)
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