response 25 of 269:

Mar 6 21:46 UTC 1996

  I wonder if potential landlords would be hesitant to rent to Grex
because of Grex's pending vulnerability to CDA.  Have to consider
whether liability of landlords would be an issue if its decided to
try limited compliance with CDA or non-compliance.  You'd be
surprised what crafty lawyers will go after to attach damages they 
are having a hard time getting.

response 27 of 269:

Mar 7 02:07 UTC 1996

Confederate Doctors of America?

response 29 of 269:

Mar 7 06:26 UTC 1996

It should be noted, though, that there's a clause in my lease giving
the landlord permission to boot me out with 7 days notice if I
commit a felony.  So moving Grex to my place is out of the
question.  >8)

response 31 of 269:

Mar 7 12:34 UTC 1996

Mike Meyers did it, back when M-Net was his own personal system.
So did Dave Parks, though he lived in a house and not an apartment.
 :)

response 33 of 269:

Mar 8 06:25 UTC 1996

Though he had some problems with the condo committee over M-Net and its
tendancy to soak up all the buildings phone lines.

response 35 of 269:

Mar 8 08:11 UTC 1996

Robh, contrary to popular opinion, in Michigan, or at least in Ann Arbor,
you cannot sign away your legal rights in a lease. If a landlord puts
a clause in your lease that is illegal, you are free to sign that lease
and then *ignore* the illegal clause. You don't even need to point this
out to him at the time of signing. For example: A landlord could put the
following clause in a lease:
  "The landlord reserves the right to enter the tenant's apartment and
   take any of the tenant's property at any time he chooses."
That is called stealing. You could sign that lease, and the landlord
would *NOT* have the right to steal from you.

In michigan, a landlord cannot throw you out of a rented space without
following specific eviction procedures. So the, throwing you out in
7 days, is not really legal. The other problem is that just becuase
you may have been 8arrested* for a felony, doesn't mean that you've
actually *committed* a felony. Even if the clause was legal, he couldn't
throw you out until yu'd actually been convicted.

response 37 of 269:

Mar 8 18:25 UTC 1996

  I once had a dispute with a former landlord when he added a clause
to the leases of everyone in our building saying we agreed not to use
or sell illegal drugs on his property, and saying that if we did so
he had the right to initiate immediate eviction actions.  I dont use
illegal drugs but I thought the principle of the matter was wrong.  As
long as I dont damage the property or violate the basic terms of the
lease, what I do in private is my own business.  I told the landlord
he didnt have the right to pass judgement on the personal behaviour
of his tenants and he said that he did, that he owned the building and
we were essentially guests on his property.
  I'm probably more libertarian in my views of personal freedoms and
such than the average person.  I think there are certain limits to
the power of government and society to infringe on personal freedoms, 
and that beyond those, people have the right to lead their own lives
and follow their own moral codes.  Thats one reason Im strongly
pro-choice and strongly against the CDA.

response 39 of 269:

Mar 9 00:30 UTC 1996

I am a landlord, and I agree that landlords give  up certain rights when
they sign leases. This is a matter of state law, but most states see it the
same way. Gregc is correct, that as long as the lease is honored by the
tenants the apt. becomes their home, and the landlord has only limited rights.

The question is much stickier over what it takes to break a lease.
A tenant who fails to uphold any *LEGAL* clause in a lease is subject to
the consequences, which could be as much as eviction. In general, landlords
to do not want to perform evictions until things get really out of hand,
because they are expensive.

If Robh's landlord determined that someone who had not been convicted of any
crime had nevertheless broken the lease by virtue of that clause, he could
begin eviction proceedings. It would be up to the court that grants such
actions to agree with him, however, and I would guess that if the tenant
actually showed up at the proceedings and attempted to defend himself (on
the grounds that he had not been convicted of anything) then the court would
not likely grant such an eviction.

So - while not strictly an illegal clause in the lease, it still sounds like
more of a scare clause than one with any real teeth in it.

Comments from any lawyer reading this would possibly be enlightening, too.

response 41 of 269:

Mar 9 04:16 UTC 1996

OK, here's a comment from a lawyer who is a member of what we laughingly
call the tenants'-rights bar locally.
        The *most* unstable situation imaginable is a lease with a landlord
who is a partnership where the partners disagree.  This appears to be
Grex' situation.  
        The situation becomes totally unsatisfactory when one of these
landpersons violates Michigan's "anti-lockout" law by cutting off power.
FWIW, as I'm sure Grex' letter say, *each* such power cutoff entitles
Grex to $200 damages minimum.
        *But* Grex doesn't need squabbles, especially since the landperson(s)
retain the *physical* power to cut off the power, steal the chrono-
syncrastic infundibulator off the disk drives, or whatever.
        What Grex does need is a new home.  Now, not a year or so from
now.
        As to sharing space with M-Net, I'm afraid the NEW Center is
jammed up and not accepting new tenants.  Yes, they insist on 501(c)(3)
status.  No, there isn't room in M-Net's overgrown closet for Grex.
Indeed, there is hardly room for M-Net!  I considered it one of my
finest achievements that I recently rearranged things so that someone
could actually sit down at the desk...8-)

response 43 of 269:

Mar 12 17:29 UTC 1996

There are lots of potential locations to scout out which might be relatively
cheap.  For one thing, most commercial space around AA now can be had for
something in the range of $6-8/sq ft.  (Maybe I should say much, instead of
most).  For a 10x10 space or 100 sq feet that's $600-$800/mo.  If you found
an un-used and otherwise un-rentable space in a commercial bldg you could
likely get it considerably cheaper (it's not like you're making a lot of
noise, having lots of people traffic or require lots of parking).

OTOH, some non-profit places like churches, community centers, etc might also
be available.  Grex has always been a supported/participant in the JCC sale.
They have little room and are planning a big expansion if they can raise the
money, but there _might_ be a closet-sized space that even has the potential
of a separate entrance.  If grex would be able to find a way to offer some
level of service/support to the JCC or Hebrew Day School (as Arbornet "does"
at the NEW Center) the JCC might be willing to work out a deal.  Maybe they
would be able to install their own modems to their own system which could
communicate with grex in order to access e-mail, etc.  Just a thought.

The JCC is not the only potential for this kind of cooperation.  As I said,
check out churches, community centers, senior citizens bldgs (even places like
Arborland, what the heck!).

FWIW, Arbornet is seeking similar alternatives in the event they are not
renewed for another term on their lease.

response 45 of 269:

Mar 13 00:43 UTC 1996

Your suggestions about finding a partner for space are good, Rick. We should
look into possibilities like that. $600 a month is way beyond our means.
So is $200/month, and even $100/month is pushing it. That's the income from
16 memberships, and we don't have 100 even.

So commercial space at commercial rates isn't even close to feasible.

We are currently paying $25/month.

response 47 of 269:

Mar 13 06:55 UTC 1996

Right. I'll go along with that.

response 49 of 269:

Mar 19 07:09 UTC 1996

Fwiw, i am also shopping a "differnet space." Film at 11.