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Grex > Coop7 > #49: An interesting phone conversation | |
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| 25 new of 93 responses total. |
adbarr
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response 25 of 93:
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May 25 23:45 UTC 1995 |
Cyberspace Communications, Inc. can register "Grex" with the
Michigan Dept. of Commerce as a fictitious or assumed name. It is
very inexpensive - aobut $5 I think. The registration may not
be perpetual, hovever - maybe 5 years? Michael Todd Glazier
had his corporatin corporation Michigan Public computing Consortium
register the name "Huron Valley Free-Net" as a d/b/a (same
thing). You might also register "Grex" as a servie - service
mark with Michigan - a little more complicated - should include
a logo while you are at it, I would think. I wi would also
think you could get a federal service mark registrtation that
covers all the other states, since you do do business in
other states I think? Certainly you have out of state customers
and some are even thought to visit other planets. Fed registration
is about $245.00 and you take the risk it might be rejected
by the Patent Trademark Office - but a professional search
is very expensive comparatively. U of M is supposed to
archive the fed database on CD rom somewhere so you could
probably do your own search. Valerie I think I sent
you a coul couple of numbers to call to get this info
free, if not I wio will do so at your request.
. Wow. Sorry no paragraphs! That is ugly!
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scg
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response 26 of 93:
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May 26 01:24 UTC 1995 |
$245 sounds a bit expensive. I don't think it would be worth it.
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robh
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response 27 of 93:
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May 26 01:33 UTC 1995 |
I thought Grex already had a DBA for "Grex"?
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jep
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response 28 of 93:
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May 26 02:39 UTC 1995 |
Cyberspace is indeed "doing business as" Grex; it is a name with
commercial value solely because of Cyberspace Communications' use of it.
Grex is a business, taking in money in exchange for services it provides.
The Detroit Institute of Arts is also a business. Like Grex, it is a
non-profit business. It probably is under the control of an organization
with a different name (such as "Detroit Institute of Arts, Inc." or some
such).
M-Net is a dba registered under the state of Michigan. We own the
statewide rights to the name. It cost very little money -- I believe Dan
Napolitano paid for the fee out of his own pocket while still a student.
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scg
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response 29 of 93:
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May 26 03:42 UTC 1995 |
I could be wrong, but I think the DIA is owned by the City of Detroit.
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rcurl
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response 30 of 93:
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May 26 05:48 UTC 1995 |
Article 450.2217 of MCL specifies that a corporation may "conduct its
affairs under any assumed name or names". A Certificate of Assumed
Name (Form C&S-541) must be filed, and the fee is $10 (or was...).
The certificate is valid for five (5) years, and may be renewed
for additional periods of consecutive five (5) years by refiling not
earlier than 90 days before the expiration of the prior certificate.
(In this sense, the assumed name may become "perpetual".) I suggest
that we proceed with doing this, if such a certificate was not filed
for "Grex" at the founding of the corporation.
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danr
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response 31 of 93:
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May 26 12:34 UTC 1995 |
I'll look into this. I believe I'm going to be downtown this afternoon.
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popcorn
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response 32 of 93:
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May 26 13:34 UTC 1995 |
Cool -- I didn't realize statewide dba's existed. I only knew about dba's
that cover a single county.
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rcurl
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response 33 of 93:
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May 26 17:05 UTC 1995 |
(Shows you what you can find in a little light reading of the MCL :)).
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zook
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response 34 of 93:
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May 26 18:02 UTC 1995 |
Should we think about the federal thing?
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adbarr
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response 35 of 93:
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May 26 22:41 UTC 1995 |
I think you would be remiss not to raise the funds to register this
system in the United States. $245 is not major money - if we steal,
beg, borrow, and whine and cry a lot.
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aaron
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response 36 of 93:
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May 28 17:59 UTC 1995 |
Why would Grex need a federal trademark?
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curby
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response 37 of 93:
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May 28 23:12 UTC 1995 |
Someone mentioned a patent search to see if the name is already
registered. I think that there is an url out there that does search
the Federal patent archives. I think that I read it from the
interesting people mailing list. If anyone is interested in the url, I
think that I could dig it up. Let me know...
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mdw
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response 38 of 93:
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May 29 11:26 UTC 1995 |
Actually, this is a trademark search, or rather, a servicemark search.
That's a much easier deal than a patent search. Trademark searches are
cheap because they're essentially just string matching on short phrases,
and the rules regarding trademark matches, whatever they are, are bound
to have been worked out to great legal precision long ago.
A *Good* patent search, on the other hand, is going to be expensive.
Patents deal with non-obvious original ideas. That means they're
usually complex, and hard to understand. Patents are normally also
written as broadly and vaguely as possible, to lay claim to as much
territory as possible. That means patents are generally hard even for
humans to understand, let alone computers. The best a computer could do
would be a rather cursory keyword search; netting many patents that
might bear little actual relationship, wile missing perhaps the one
crucial patent that covers the crux of your patent. Even the patent
office won't guarantee that any patent it issues is unique and valid.
It's quite possible, and often happens, that a patent will be found
invalid years after it was issued, and only after expensive litigation.
Now, aren't you glad we're only interested in a servicemark?
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curby
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response 39 of 93:
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May 29 17:43 UTC 1995 |
I wasn't saying that the patent search engine was any good, I was just
saying that it existed. :) (At least I think it does, I still need to
look back at my old mail...)
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aaron
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response 40 of 93:
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May 29 19:08 UTC 1995 |
As I recall, a federal patent search generally runs in the neighborhood
of $10K, whereas a federal trademark search generally runs in the
neighborhood of $1K.
On the other hand, state trademarks are generally easy and cheap to
obtain, even without the help of an attorney. As are d/b/a's.
For clarification, a trademark is used in the identification of products,
whereas a servicemark is used in the identification of services. Beyond
that, they are roughly equivalent.
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tsty
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response 41 of 93:
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May 29 20:39 UTC 1995 |
and roughly equivalent on protection? <real question>
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aaron
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response 42 of 93:
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May 29 22:21 UTC 1995 |
On trades and services respectively, yes.
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tsty
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response 43 of 93:
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May 30 14:02 UTC 1995 |
thank you
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adbarr
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response 44 of 93:
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May 31 01:56 UTC 1995 |
I agree with Aaron in #41 and 42.
the reason you might want to do a federal registration are that the
concept(s) of Grex have value, and the name certainly is unique. The
members cannot expect a return on those values - like a typical for-
profit shareholder - but there are other "returns" the membership
enjoys by having the name protected - if you are here, you
understand the idea - Something tells me you should do this, even
if it takes time to raise the money. <sorry about the tense errors>
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steve
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response 45 of 93:
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May 31 13:43 UTC 1995 |
Arnold--if at the next board meeting we decide to do some of
this, would you be a volunteer for this? I think its a really
good idea.
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adbarr
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response 46 of 93:
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Jun 1 03:01 UTC 1995 |
Sure, I would be glad to do the muck work, and know some Mich. lawyers
that could help - for (nevermind). Perhaps Aaron would help critique
and suggest?
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ajax
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response 47 of 93:
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Jun 10 23:02 UTC 1995 |
The notion that somebody in another state would copy the name, look,
and feel of a system like Grex is ludicrous. Quit tilting at windmills.
By the way, anyone tried Arbornet (telnet 199.3.182.69) of Chicago? :-]
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adbarr
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response 48 of 93:
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Jun 11 21:34 UTC 1995 |
You are right ajaj. "Internet Cafe" is (or is it?) an exception?!
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ajax
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response 49 of 93:
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Jun 14 20:04 UTC 1995 |
(In case it wasn't clear, #47 was meant sarcastically - a person in Chicago
has copied M-Net in concept, and named it Arbornet, claiming it's the real
and true Arbornet system...I do find it ludicrous, but obviously it happens!)
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