|
|
| Author |
Message |
| 25 new of 158 responses total. |
mvpel
|
|
response 25 of 158:
| 
Apr 19 01:05 UTC 2002 |
Watch out, if the situation out here in California is any indication, next
thing you know the Lionel Lobby will be hitting you up for a tax-funded
multi-billion dollar <insert cool-sounding adjective here> rail system,
that they promise (no, really!) will break even with fare income within
five years.
|
bru
|
|
response 26 of 158:
|
Apr 19 01:20 UTC 2002 |
Time to get some kind of cable car system going.
|
ea
|
|
response 27 of 158:
|
Apr 19 01:24 UTC 2002 |
It's worth mentioning, that, as a rider, from what I remember, the
smaller busses (Ford F-350's, I think), are actually louder on the
inside than the larger busses. Maybe I'm misremembering things.
|
mvpel
|
|
response 28 of 158:
|
Apr 19 01:28 UTC 2002 |
Re: 26 - if they can't make any honest money running diesel busses on routes
that can be changed at a moment's notice as demand patterns shift, what makes
you think they'd be able to make any honest money with a cable car, a.k.a
<light> rail?
|
cmcgee
|
|
response 29 of 158:
|
Apr 19 13:36 UTC 2002 |
re 14: Art Fare, Football, and other out-of-town crowd-moving trips are
priced at market rates: ie what we think we can charge without costing
more than parking.
re 19: I'm not certain, but I believe that what you are seing is based on
demand. There are far more people going from Ann Arbor back to Ypsilanti
at that time (9-11 pm) than there are people coming in to the center of
Ann Arbor. That last bus from arborland connects with the last surge of
outbound routes from downtown.
re 25: That's already being planned. The new communter rail route
between Lansing and Detroit comes through Ann Arbor. There will probably
be a millage election in the next year or so to fund it.
|
gull
|
|
response 30 of 158:
|
Apr 19 14:32 UTC 2002 |
A rail link to Lansing would actually be pretty nice if it ran often
enough to be convenient. I have friends who live in California and they
use BART all the time.
|
danr
|
|
response 31 of 158:
|
Apr 19 15:48 UTC 2002 |
The difference, of course, is that BART serves an area with a high
population density. This is not the case in SE Michigan, and my guess
is that the probability that this commuter rail project will be a
success is quite small. Let's hope the majority of the voters realize
this before they vote to bankroll it (i.e. waste their money).
|
keesan
|
|
response 32 of 158:
|
Apr 19 16:11 UTC 2002 |
A train from Ann Arbor to Lansing would be wonderful! How long since that
route was last in operation? There is a public swimming beach in Hazlett
within a few miles, on safe sidewalks, of E. Lansing and it might be a quicker
way to get to the beach than biking 12 miles (1.75 hours on dirt roads) to
Independence Lake. Will the train also stop in E. Lansing and/or Hazlett?
Jim tells me Bush is trying to eliminate all Amtrak service except the E.
Coast corridor - would the Detroit Chicago train also be a victim?
Where else might the Detroit-Lansing train stop besides Ann Arbor? Is this
info online somewhere?
|
jmsaul
|
|
response 33 of 158:
|
Apr 19 16:23 UTC 2002 |
Put me down for also doubting that there will be enough ridership to make it
worthwhile, though if it goes to the airport there might be.
|
krj
|
|
response 34 of 158:
|
Apr 19 17:50 UTC 2002 |
The Ann Arbor News regularly has coverage of the various hopes
for a Detroit-Lansing commuter rail. As an Ann Arbor-> East Lansing
commuter, I don't see this working too well. The news I vaguely
recall about proposed fares was $10 per person per trip.
Steve Andre and I are carpooling most days now; I don't
think our car expenses run $40 per day. It would also add most of
an hour to get from the East Lansing train stop to our MSU
offices -- that becomes much worse if the stop is only in East Lansing.
|
gull
|
|
response 35 of 158:
|
Apr 19 18:15 UTC 2002 |
Yeah, at that price it's pretty much a non-starter, considering I can drive
to Lansing on less than four bucks' worth of fuel.
|
jmsaul
|
|
response 36 of 158:
|
Apr 19 19:02 UTC 2002 |
Man, that's a lot.
|
cmcgee
|
|
response 37 of 158:
|
Apr 19 20:39 UTC 2002 |
The train will be an express train with only 3 or 4 stops between Lansing
and Detroit.
It is not intended to be rapid transit like BART. Just your basic coupla
trains each direction in the morning, couple more at quitting time and one
or two in the middle of the day. It is commuter service, built around the
Monday through Friday, 8-5 work day.
|
jp2
|
|
response 38 of 158:
|
Apr 19 20:41 UTC 2002 |
This response has been erased.
|
jmsaul
|
|
response 39 of 158:
|
Apr 19 21:30 UTC 2002 |
Re #37: I don't see the point, because I can't imagine there are many
people who want to commute between Detroit and Lansing, but I
assume they've done studies...
|
russ
|
|
response 40 of 158:
|
Apr 19 23:52 UTC 2002 |
Re #26: That would have the advantage that the vehicle would be
electric instead of diesel. I've seen Toronto's street cars; they
are delightfully quiet (though they use air brakes, and have a
noisy air compressor).
Re #28: The problem with the "honest money" appraisal is that it fails
to consider a number of issues:
1.) Fuel-tax revenue doesn't pay for local roads; property taxes
do. Direct cost to the driver isn't a good measure of how
much it costs to build a road network which can handle all
the cars. A bus uses a lot less road than cars with the same
number of seats.
2.) It doesn't consider the cost of congestion. As a driver whose
routes lie nowhere near bus lines, I'd be thrilled if more
people would ride the bus if it meant that there would be less
traffic and things would move faster. More to the point, I'd
be happy to pay for it. (I'd also be happy to pay for properly
timed lights and traffic enforcement which tickets the senile
drivers who go 20 MPH in the left lane.)
OTOH, buses without riders are just a waste of space and money.
|
gelinas
|
|
response 41 of 158:
|
Apr 20 03:11 UTC 2002 |
Someone mentioned the compressed natural gas school bus: last I heard, AAPS
only had one, and it is very slow to refuel. There was supposed to be a
high-speed refueling point installed, but I don't remember the details; it
may be the one on North Main.
So far, the CNG bus has not been a significant savings for the school
district, because of its limited range.
AATA board members aren't the _only_ ones who worry about insurance costs,
cmcgee. ;)
|
senna
|
|
response 42 of 158:
|
Apr 20 03:33 UTC 2002 |
Wait, ken, break down that hour between the East Lansing train stop and your
MSU offices--are you walking? Or are you talking about the length of time
between the Ann Arbor stop and the office?
The price sounds prohibitive to me, too. I can get to Chicago and back on
$20 in gas, in only slightly more time.
|
krj
|
|
response 43 of 158:
|
Apr 20 05:22 UTC 2002 |
I'm guesstimating 20 min bus time, including waiting for the bus,
for each one-way bus trip between the East Lansing
train station and the MSU offices. I could walk it in somewhat
less time, but Steve could only walk it with difficulty right now.
Maybe I'm overly pessimistic.
|
pthomas
|
|
response 44 of 158:
|
Apr 20 19:32 UTC 2002 |
Metrobus in DC has quite a few natural-gas buses.
|
jp2
|
|
response 45 of 158:
|
Apr 20 19:36 UTC 2002 |
This response has been erased.
|
pthomas
|
|
response 46 of 158:
|
Apr 20 23:17 UTC 2002 |
They must all run in my part of town then.
|
keesan
|
|
response 47 of 158:
|
Apr 21 13:36 UTC 2002 |
I presume it will be possible to take bikes on the train, right? And that
you won't need to pay $5 handling fee (each way) and $7 for a box to put them
in. The '20 min bus ride' could then be a 5 min bike ride, for those able to
bike. (I hope STeve continues to recover to the point where he can do so).
Is the ability to read or do other work for the 2+ hours round trip worth the
extra $6 over the cost of driving? How about reduced wear on the car, with
less maintenance? Or even sleep?
I just did a Ukrainian translation for a Ford executive who has been working
(in the German branch) on fuel-cell vehicles, which he says will be very
common within 10 years and are already becoming so in Germany. No need for
a heavy battery that needs frequent replacing and long charges, you only fill
up on compressed hydrogen (which can be generated from other fuels or by
breaking up water with solar power) and produces energy more efficiently than
an internal combustion engine even if you start with gasoline to make the
hydrogen. On top of which it is clean-burning and alot less noisy. Not yet
available here so he plans to get a short-range electric car to go to work
with (in Dearborn) and solar-charge it. This is extremely encouraging
considering it is Ford supporting this research. There are fuel-cell buses
in Germany already. (The translation is because he will be importing his
fiancee, who he met on the web.)
|
cmcgee
|
|
response 48 of 158:
|
Apr 21 15:16 UTC 2002 |
I doubt you will be able to take bikes on the train. These are commuter
trains, not long-distance passenger trains like Amtrak. There won't be
baggage cars. Think DC Metro, for example.
|
jp2
|
|
response 49 of 158:
|
Apr 21 17:56 UTC 2002 |
This response has been erased.
|
