|
Grex > Coop > #284: Grex Town Hall -- How do we move forward? - Fall, 2010 |  |
|
| Author |
Message |
| 25 new of 334 responses total. |
mary
|
|
response 22 of 334:
| 
Sep 28 17:35 UTC 2010 |
We want to move forward. We don't have any volunteer movers at present.
|
slynne
|
|
response 23 of 334:
|
Sep 28 17:51 UTC 2010 |
FWIW, I am not on the board and have nothing to do with this item. I
just find the way you make your suggestions to be kind of obnoxious.
That is my own opinion and doesn't represent the opinions of anyone
else.
|
nharmon
|
|
response 24 of 334:
|
Sep 28 18:16 UTC 2010 |
Yes it does, slynne, it represents my opinions too.
|
kentn
|
|
response 25 of 334:
|
Sep 28 18:19 UTC 2010 |
The board is considering the suggestions you and others have made. What
makes you think we won't? I think updating the web pages and adding
more web apps would be a good idea. It's not so much that there are
plenty of other places with fancy web pages to visit, but that there are
few any more who like to use the command line and probably take a look
and run away fast. We'll never know what will work if we don't try and
I have to admit, it's more than a little frustrating to see every idea
torpedoed before it gets tried. At this rate, we won't do anything. We
can always ask for help in getting things done, but without a clear idea
of what we want to do, it will be frustrating for any volunteers.
|
twinkie
|
|
response 26 of 334:
|
Sep 28 20:37 UTC 2010 |
re: 19
Since you've admitted that you don't have the background for doing it, I think
it's worth pointing out that overhauling Grex's web presence is not an
insubstantial amount of work.
There has to be some compelling reason to be here, though. And from what I've
seen, that reason is largely nostalgia. With the exception of zulu, there
haven't been any names in BBS that strike me as being new.
Years and years ago, you could have played the "Ann Arbor Flavor" card, but
that's largely gone now, and available elsewhere.
Having a flashy web site isn't enough these days to answer:
*Who do you want to attract?
*How will you attract them?
*Why do you want to attract them?
*What unique or compelling reason will they have to stay?
|
tod
|
|
response 27 of 334:
|
Sep 28 20:55 UTC 2010 |
And how many pieces of flair are you wearing
|
kentn
|
|
response 28 of 334:
|
Sep 28 21:17 UTC 2010 |
So, since a flashy web site isn't enough, what is? Any suggestions?
|
bru
|
|
response 29 of 334:
|
Sep 28 23:10 UTC 2010 |
I would rather have a simple system than a fancy one that takes time to load.
|
richard
|
|
response 30 of 334:
|
Sep 28 23:50 UTC 2010 |
all I did was make suggestions without any mean spiritedness. I fail to
see why slynne thinks that is any more obnoxious than anyone else making
suggestions.
|
twinkie
|
|
response 31 of 334:
|
Sep 29 01:18 UTC 2010 |
It's because she knows you're going to shop it on M-Net to great success,
before the slow pokes here get around to discussing it in coop.
|
slynne
|
|
response 32 of 334:
|
Sep 29 02:10 UTC 2010 |
resp:30 If you really want to know...
You said: "I'm saying that in the situation Grex is in, there is no
reason NOT to overhaul the web page."
But there is a reason NOT to overhaul the web page. There might not be
anyone with the skills and the time to do it. There is a difference
between what you said and simply making a suggestion which would go a
little more like this: "It would be a very good thing to overhaul the
web page"
|
nharmon
|
|
response 33 of 334:
|
Sep 29 02:11 UTC 2010 |
Didn't we already recently overhaul the web page?
|
slynne
|
|
response 34 of 334:
|
Sep 29 02:48 UTC 2010 |
resp:33 The main Grex page is five or six years old. All of the interior
backtalk pages are at least seven years old (I think)
|
kentn
|
|
response 35 of 334:
|
Sep 29 03:06 UTC 2010 |
Which in Internet years is....a lot. There is also a need to update
much of the information on our web site.
|
richard
|
|
response 36 of 334:
|
Sep 29 04:45 UTC 2010 |
Grex also needs to stop this staff verification of new users. It is
against the principles on which grex was founded, and I believe that
if such stats existed, you would see that new usership has dropped
significantly since Cross put his little patch on the new user
program. New users don't stay around waiting for staff members to
wave their magic wands and decide they are good enough, real enough,
to post here. They just go away.
But everytime I suggest this, it hits a wall. Staff just doesn't want
to go there, even if there is broad user support for it.
|
twinkie
|
|
response 37 of 334:
|
Sep 29 07:22 UTC 2010 |
I thought broad user support was where verification came from?
|
slynne
|
|
response 38 of 334:
|
Sep 29 15:12 UTC 2010 |
IIRC the issue with verification is this: If we don't verify, we tend to
have problem users taking the system down. If we had more staff
resources, we could probably handle this. But we don't. Still, I recall
that it was a short term solution and in the long run, if we don't make
it really easy for new people to sign up, there is no future. On the
other hand, if the system keeps being brought down by malicious people,
there is no future.
|
cross
|
|
response 39 of 334:
|
Sep 29 16:23 UTC 2010 |
resp:30 Well, since you asked.... Because you, Richard, stamp your
foot every time someone questions one of your suggestions; nevermind
the fact that they come across more as demand than otherwise.
resp:36 It's certainly not perfect. But every time you bring this up,
I remind you that Chad and Mickeyd were taking down Grex every chance
they got, and we had no way to block them without putting in some kind
of verification system.
Oh, and by the way? You come across as a real asshole in that
response. Just food for thought, man.
|
kentn
|
|
response 40 of 334:
|
Sep 29 17:04 UTC 2010 |
In terms of verification, yes that was a user vote a while back, so the
users at the time agreed enough with it to approve it. See the coop
cf for background and proposals for this (item 23 covers a lot of this
policy, there may be other items that apply).
Note that if you want to change this policy you can propose a new policy
(see Grex by-laws for how to do this). If you're not a member (hint
hint), though, you can't vote on it.
For the restricted access for new users, yes, it is due to trying to
keep the system protected from malicious people. It works, but I think
it may be chasing a lot of non-malicious people away. Unfortunately,
we need something in place to help, otherwise we'll be up and down all
the time--which users complained about (rightly so), and our staff will
spend most of their time dealing with the situation.
If there is a better alternative to leaving the system open to malicious
users, let's hear it. I'm sure we'd all like to go to a more open
system, but not at the cost of being frequently locked out due to system
downtime and/or inability to use the system (denial of service).
|
jep
|
|
response 41 of 334:
|
Sep 29 18:03 UTC 2010 |
Richard is just frustrated that we don't have any new users because of
the verification issue. He's right that the verification issue is a
problem. He's wrong to insist on a solution when he is unable and
unwilling to do the work himself. Richard, Unix programming is not an
innate talent like extreme good looks (my own contribution to the
world), or a limited resource like hydrogen. It's an acquired skill.
Anyone can get it, just as anyone can get the skill to drive a car. If
you're frustrated that no one else does something you want done, there
is an alternative available to you which will get the job done, and in
the best possible way at that. It is to do it yourself.
|
jep
|
|
response 42 of 334:
|
Sep 29 18:07 UTC 2010 |
There are a lot of things Grex could do to attract new users. Some of
them may be compatible with doing what it does now, the things which
keep us all here. How about a smart phone app? Bring back the
multi-user Unix games like Phantasia. Acquire a bigger computer and
host video messages in place of text based messages. Attract some
people who will make the specialty conferences interesting. It can be
done; it was done some years ago, and we haven't devolved *that* much as
a species.
I like Grex as it is. I'm not going to devote any resources to changing
it substantially. I'll toss out ideas, though, if I think of any and
there is any interest.
|
slynne
|
|
response 43 of 334:
|
Sep 29 18:11 UTC 2010 |
resp:41 Small and completely off topic quibble: using hydrogen as an
example of a scarce resource might not be a good idea. It is the most
common element in the universe.
|
nharmon
|
|
response 44 of 334:
|
Sep 29 18:47 UTC 2010 |
Helium, on the other hand...
|
tod
|
|
response 45 of 334:
|
Sep 29 19:06 UTC 2010 |
hydrogen is limited?
(ever put a helium balloon in a microwave? Star Wars, baby!)
|
jep
|
|
response 46 of 334:
|
Sep 29 19:32 UTC 2010 |
re resp:43: Thanks! I thought baloney was the most common element.
(Hydrogen is limited, just not as limited as anything else.)
|