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| Author |
Message |
| 25 new of 183 responses total. |
srw
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response 125 of 183:
| 
May 9 07:43 UTC 1995 |
Yes, it applied to the government in exactly that fashion.
Scg said nothing that implied otherwise. What's your point?
We aren't the government ans we do permit anonymous political statements.
You inferred improperly from scg's statement. He said our verification
policy is designed to prevent using Grex as a base to hack into other
systems, he did not say that Selena was such a hacker.
But to "permit anonymous internet access to those whom we do not think are
really hackers" is not an objective policy.
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selena
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response 126 of 183:
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May 9 12:34 UTC 1995 |
Maybe not, but I have to thank tsty, 'cause it did hurt.
Scg, endlessly? I'm not the only one here who's against it. I really wish
you'd stop making it sound as if I am.
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lilmo
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response 127 of 183:
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May 9 22:41 UTC 1995 |
I work as a Night Monitor in the dorms at the univ. I attend, and I am
required to verify the identity of entering residents, and have guests
"sign in" AND be escorted by a resident. I can't let friends of mine,
known to me personally to be trustworthy and reliable folk, just roam
the building freely if they don't live there. Doing so would create a
lack of respect for the rules in them, and anybody that heard or even
saw that they were doing so, and encourage others to seek to have the
same privileges, seriously compromising even this minmal effort at some
building security.
Selena, the situation here at Grex is not exactly analogous (what analogy
is ever exact?) but it seems to me to be reasoning fairly similar, and
I hope that this helps you understand why the board and staff are so
reluctant to fulfill your request.
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tsty
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response 128 of 183:
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May 10 18:07 UTC 1995 |
If they all had to pay money to roam and you waived the payment, the
dorm situation would be more analogous. It's more analogous to consider
access akin to entry to a zoo. Some entrants will try to hop the
fence to play in the alligator pit. That's two "mistakes." Just to
roam the zoo anonymously, having paid as everyone else pays, is not
a "mistake."
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rcurl
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response 129 of 183:
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May 10 19:41 UTC 1995 |
Roaming on Grex is free. The analogy to a zoo is pretty good... ;->
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adbarr
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response 130 of 183:
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May 11 01:02 UTC 1995 |
Ahem! I see a problem with the zoo analogy. [#128/#129] When visiting
a zoo, someone would not normally anticipate having the ability
to open the cages to the tigers and let them eat the zookeepers.
A terrible way to go.
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mdw
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response 131 of 183:
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May 12 08:37 UTC 1995 |
Actually, Grex's verification policy isn't "just" to keep users from
trying to break into other systems. Breaking into other systems is just
one form of social "misbehavior"; and unfortunately, for better or
worse, the norm on far too many systems is to kick users off who
misbehave. If we want to have a different norm on this system, then we
are stuck with having a "border" of some sort, between our norms, and
the norms on the internet. There is no way we can reasonably get rid of
that border (unless we decide to adapt the norms of the internet), so
that means the only choice we have left is what kind of border we have.
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curby
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response 132 of 183:
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May 12 09:17 UTC 1995 |
The way that I understand the old NSFnet UAP, they did not care what
the system did, but it would hold the whole system responsible for what
happens on the system. (ex. Canter and Seigel and PSI.) The only way
for systems to keep themselves stable is to have the personal
inforamtion of the people on the system. This does not mean that they
have to share it with anyone, unless that person does something to
warrant being investigated.
This type of situation is the norm for almost all Internet Providers,
and is becomming even more of a norm for Universities and other
historically insecure networks.
So, I do not think that there will be much sympathy from the "Powers
That Be(tm)". But that does not mean that you should stop petitioning.
I think that there are definately some things that can be set up a
little looser here on grex...
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remmers
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response 133 of 183:
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May 12 11:13 UTC 1995 |
Hmm, I thought Grex was about as loose as they come, but what do I know?
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steve
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response 134 of 183:
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May 12 12:58 UTC 1995 |
I know of few systems looser myself.
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popcorn
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response 135 of 183:
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May 12 13:35 UTC 1995 |
Jared's nether.net system? Metronet?
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curby
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response 136 of 183:
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May 12 15:10 UTC 1995 |
OK, it has been awhile, but I think that there is still the outstanding
verification .vs. member privledges. (Sorry if I am out of date, but,)
Has grex implemented the policies that were being discussed a few
months ago regarding the above? Those are what I meant by being
something that could be made better.
As far as the system, yes, other then local BBS systems, Grex is by far
one of the most relaxed communities that I have seen. (I wish that my
klocal sysadm would learn some of what the grex people have. Mostly, I
wish he would just take a few seconds to LISTEN to what we want!
Grrr... <grin>)
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peacefrg
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response 137 of 183:
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May 12 16:28 UTC 1995 |
How do I get onto jared nether board?
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steve
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response 138 of 183:
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May 12 16:46 UTC 1995 |
Does metronet allow email? Does nether.net have a future beyond
what Jared is putting into it? Those are good examples, but I should
have said something a little more like "of the systems that are
established, and whose prospects for survival are reasonable, how many
are as open as Grex and provide the services that Grex does?".
I wish nether.net well; I do wonder however what will happen to
it when Jared gets a) bored with it, b) decides he wants to spend
money on other things c) it becomes too expensive for one person
to run (with net cost issues probably being the more pressing,
dependiong on what you believe will hapenn to commercial net
providers in the next year).
I like what I've heard about Metronet, but I don't see
how they are going to survive. How are people going to get
to them they way it works now, with Merit not allowing the
open free access it did before? I'll grant that if metronet
can get the funding they could buy the "tokens" or whatever they're
called for merit access, but as I understand it, that is terrifically
expensive.
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ajax
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response 139 of 183:
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May 12 18:24 UTC 1995 |
Re #137, probably telnet to nether.net from metronet, if you use metronet.
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tsty
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response 140 of 183:
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May 12 20:21 UTC 1995 |
there is a space problem with nether.net - and newuser +might+
be turned off for a bit, dunno, but it is 8-n-1 313-572-7504
14.4 bps v.42bis linux on an intel processor.
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peacefrg
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response 141 of 183:
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May 12 21:07 UTC 1995 |
Yeah, I made an account there when he first started it. But now that
account is long gone. And I tried to make another but they arn't accepting
newusers anymore. And I can't get jared to return any mail.
And, no metronet doesn't have e-mail.
Do you guys know of any other free places with full access?
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scg
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response 142 of 183:
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May 13 02:31 UTC 1995 |
Jared will probably return your mail eventually. My experience sending
Linux questions is that it often takes a weke or two.
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selena
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response 143 of 183:
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May 13 22:29 UTC 1995 |
Metronet is accessable through library dialins, too.
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tsty
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response 144 of 183:
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May 15 03:46 UTC 1995 |
jared is heading to a CA HH with a few of the M-b0x perns, from
here and from CA .... we expect him to return, probably.
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scg
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response 145 of 183:
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May 15 04:00 UTC 1995 |
What's a CA HH?
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carson
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response 146 of 183:
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May 15 06:23 UTC 1995 |
California Happy Hour. There are plans for several M-Netters to convene
in California for a Happy Hour.
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selena
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response 147 of 183:
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May 16 12:11 UTC 1995 |
drift, anyone?
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rcurl
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response 148 of 183:
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May 16 21:26 UTC 1995 |
Is that a drink?
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adbarr
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response 149 of 183:
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May 16 21:42 UTC 1995 |
I would like a double while I worry 'bout verification
dangers, but not much.
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