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dang
Accepting Credit Cards on Grex Mark Unseen   May 6 21:09 UTC 1999

Over the past 2 months, I've been researching possible companies and methods
for Grex to accept payment via credit card.  For those of you not familiar
with credit card charges from the merchant's end, here's a brief description,
along with some difinitions. 

Basically, there are three things necessary to make a charge on a credit card:
1. A merchant account.
2. A method of sending information to the processing company.
3. A company (usually a bank) to process the actual charges.

All three of these things cost money, and, in a traditional storefront, the
merchant would pay for all of them.  I'll get back to our options after
definitions.

Definitions:

Merchant Account: This is an account that a merchant makes with a bank.  It is
analgous to a credit card account for an individual,  but it allows the
merchant to accept charges and get money, rather than spend it.  It requires a
credit check and an application fee, similar to a credit card.  Usually, it
does not require any regular fees, but the setup fee can be large.  I've seen
them range from $75 - $500.  Each account is associated with a business, and
the name of that business is what appears on the charge receipt.  Ordinarily,
we'd need to get one, but there are a few scenarios where we don't need one.

Card Reader (or Swiper): This is a piece of physical hardware, which just
about all of you will have seen in a store.  It requires the physical presence
of the CC, so it can be run through the machine.   It then dials a phone line
to connect to the processing company and automatically sends the information,
and received the confirmation number or rejection notice.  It is either
bought (ca. $500-$700) or rented/leased (ca. $20-$50/mo.).  It is the "normal"
way of accepting credit cards, and is the most secure because you have the
signature of the person and the card so you can compare.  Obviously, this will
not work for us, because we won't have the cards.

Card Processing Software: This is the main alternative to a card swiper. It is
software that accepts the CC number, expiration date, and billing address and
connects to the processing company either via a direct modem call or via a
secure internet connection, and makes the processing request.  It then returns
with the confirmation number or rejection notice.  Because you don't have
signatures, it requires the billing address and costs more to process.  The
software comes in two main forms: PC and Website.  The PC form runs on a PC or
Mac, and requires us to manually enter the information we obtained via some
method, such as a secure webserver or secure email or via the phone.  The
website form actually runs on the secure webserver itself, and gathers the
information directly from the consumer.  It then automatically runs the
processing, and returns the result immediately to the consumer.  The software
is either bought or rented/leased, and usually is priced the same as that's
company's card swiper.

Processing Company:  Someone in the financial world needs to do the actual
charge processing.  This is usually a bank, and usually a bank that issues
credit cards.  The card information is gotten to the processing company, and
that company contacts the issuer of the card and checks to see if that is a
valid card with correct information and that the owner has enough credit to
handle the charge.  If so, the charge is made to the card and the money
transfered to the processing company.  The processing company then returns an
acceptance, and the money, less some percentage as a processing charge, is
transfered to the merchant's bank account.  This usually takes from several
hours to 2 business days.  If the card is not valid, the information is not
valid, or there isn't enough credit, and appropriate rejection notice is
returned and no money is transfered.

That covers what is actually needed to make a charge.  There is still one
thing left, however.  We need to get the credit card information.  There are
five possible ways to do this, 3 of which are an option to us.
1. Actually swipe the card itself.  This is not possible to us, because we
   won't have the card in our possesion.
2. Obtain the card information via some insecure method, such as unencrypted
   email, an unsecure web server, a posting somewhere on Grex, or something
   other way where the number can be stolen.  This is not an option, because
   it would allow credit card fraud, which we have to agree to not allow.
3. Secure Email.  This involves picking some email encryption scheme, such as
   PGP or a VeriSign certificate, setting it up, getting it verified enough so
   it's trusted, possibly paying for it, and teaching everyone who wants to
   use it how to use it.  It's possbile for us, but quite difficult.
4. Phone.  We could require anyone who wants to make a charge to us to call us
   on the phone to give the information.  This is relatively secure, but is a
   hassle for us and expensive for them.
5. Secure Web Server: We could set up a secure web server, or pay someone else
   to host one.  This would allow us to accept credit cards from anyone with
   access to a secure-capable web browser, and is the best option for us, in
   my opinion.  Setting up a secure web servers requires a seperate computer,
   server software, and a certificate.  The seperate computer is necessary
   because it needs to store sensative information, which must be secure.
   This is a one time cost, and we could make one from spare parts we have.
   The server software isn't a problem, because Apache, the software we use
   now, is capable of secure serving.  The Certificate needs to be bought from
   some well-known company, such as VeriSign.  It both acts as a key for
   encryption of the session, and acts as reassurance to the consumer that we
   really are who we claim to be.  Currently, a VeriSign Certificate costs
   $350 per year.  If we pay someone else to host the server, we just pay them
   a monthly fee, and set up our pages on it.  They handle the rest, including
   the certificate.  Since they are buying certificates in bulk, they can get
   them cheaper, so it may actually be comperable in price, and involves much
   less hassle. 

Now we come to what Grex actually has to do to accept credit cards.  There are
4 things that need to be done: someone needs a merchant account, someone needs
a swiper or equivilate software, someone needs to process the charges, and
someone needs to host the web server.  Basically, we can to all of them
(accept actually process the charges, but we'd pay for that ourselves.) This
is the most common way currently, and the closest to a traditional storefront.
This means that the most stable and reputable companies only allow this
method.  We can do none of them, by contracting with a company such as
Billpoint below.  They will have the merchant account, collect the
information, make the charges, and only notify us when it's all done.  They
charge us a percentage of the sale.  This has three major side-effects:
everyone involved in the transaction needs to have an account with Billpoint,
including Grex.  This is one more account and password to remember; The
payment is delayed by at least a month; and the actual charge receipt will say
Billpoint, not Grex.  I'm not sure how this interacts with charitable
deductions.  Or, we can do some of the four and hire out others.  Charge
Solutions is an example of this method.  We could get our merchant account
through them, have them host the site, and process transactions through them.
Since they host the site and process the charges, they have the processing
software there, and we don't need it.

Below are several sample companies, along with their payment schemes.  I tried
to get samples in the relevant catagores, along with a traditional, good
reputation example.  When choosing a company, reputation is important.  During
the 2 months I was looking, several of the companies I looked at disappeared.


Billpoint --
  People pay them, they tell us, we ship product, they receive confirmation of
  product arrival, they pay us via direct-bank transaction. Payment is delayed
  by at least 30 days, possibly up to 45. http://www.billpoint.com

  Transaction Amount            Billpoint                 Billpoint 
                                Transaction Fees          Transaction Fees 
                                for Visa and              for American Express
                                MasterCard 
   
    Over                            3% of the             4.5% of the
    $7.00                           transaction value +   transaction value +
                                    $0.40 per each        $0.40 per each
                                    transaction           transaction
                                                         

    $2.01 -                         5.5% of the           7% of the
    $7.00                           transaction value +   transaction value +
                                    $0.20 per each        $0.20 per eac
                                    transaction           transaction
         
    $0.00 -                         15% of the            15% of the
    $2.00                           transaction value     transaction value


Charge Solutions --
  We get a merchant account, but *no software or card reader* and give them
  our merchant account number.  They host the secure web site, and we link to
  it.  Charges are to our merchant account.  http://www.chargesolutions.com
/
  Allows Visa, MC, Amex, Disc, Diner's Club.  Specifically allows membership
  sales.  Lots of impressive capability for the maintainer. 

      Plan 1 - On-Line Processing 25 

          NO Lease or Purchase 
          NO Percentage Fee 
          $ 99.00 One-time Set-up Fee 
          $ 25.00 Monthly Service Fee 
          $.25 Transaction Fee

      Plan 2 -On-Line Processing 50 

          NO Lease or Purchase 
          NO Percentage Fee 
          $ 99.00 One-time Set-up Fee 
          NO Monthly Service Fee 
          $.50 Transaction Fee 

      Plan 3 - Merchant Account and On-Line Processing 25 

          NO Lease or Purchase 
          NO Percentage Fee 
          Bank Fees: 
                 $175.00 One-time Set-up Fee 
                 2.50% Discount Fee 
                 $.35 Transaction Fee 
          On-Line Processing Fees: 
                 $ 25.00 Monthly Service Fee 
                 $.25 Transaction Fee 

      Plan 4 - Merchant Account and On-Line Processing 50 

          NO Lease or Purchase 
          NO Percentage Fee 
          Bank Fees: 
                 $175.00 One-time Set-up Fee 
                 2.50% Discount Fee 
                 $.35 Transaction Fee 
          On-Line Processing Fees: 
                 NO Monthly Service Fee 
                 $.50 Transaction Fee 
      

Total Merchant Account Services
  We get a merchant account (possibly through them), and lease the software to
  run our website.  Lease price is $39.95/mo, for 48 mos. Monthly statement
  fee of $20.  Per transaction fee of 2.95% + $0.30.
  http://www.all-approved.com/rates.html


Yahoo! Store
  Up to 50 items for sale $100/month, up to 1000 items $300/month.  Can view
  orders on the web, can retrieve as database files in several formats, can
  have orders forwarded by fax, or can have orders sent to our server in real
  time via OBI fomat (whatever that is.)  We can apply for a merchant account
  from Bank One via form on Yahoo.  There is a one time $250 setup fee if our
  application is accepted.  The account will allow us to accept MasterCard, 
  Visa, American Express and Diners Club.  Discovery is coming soon.  There is
  no minimum contract period, we can cancel at any time.
  http://store.yahoo.com

TeleCharge
  We get an account with them (not a merchant account) and send in our charges
  via telephone.  We'd need our own software etc.  Funds held for 5 business
  days and then electronically transfered into our checking account (either
  business or personal).  Can cancel at any time, and restart with $25 fee.
  No monthly minimum.  $300 application fee, 3.10% and $0.30 per transaction.
  No equipment costs.  Maximum transaction amount $500.00, maximum volume/week
  $1000.00.  http://www.cathost.com/telecharge/

Merchant Express
  Get a merchant account with them.  $75 application fee, refundable if not
  accepted.  Covers Visa, MC, American Express (optional).  Extra $25 fee if
  want Discover.  Use Authorize.net for charging.  Is $550 to buy or $35/mo
  for 24 mo. or $21/mo for 48 mo.  Monthly gateway fee of $10.  Per charge
  fees:
 
      Fee Item                                                                                          Standard Program        Special Risk Program
                
                        Discount Rate Retail (Swiped)   1.59%                                           1.79%
                        Discount Rate Internet                                  2.09%                                           2.49%
                        Transaction Fee Retail (Swiped) $.20                                                    $.30
                        Transaction Fee Internet                                $.30                                                    $.30
                        Monthly Statement Fee                                   $10                                                     $15
                        Monthly Minimum Fee                                             $20 *                                           $20 *
                        Application Fee                                                                 $75 Refundable          $75 Refundable
                        * You will not incur a monthly minimum fee unless your sales are very low 
                        (under ~$700) for any given month.  Discount rate and transaction fee 
                        count toward this amount.
        
        http://www.merchantexpress.com


  I personally recommend Charge Solutions Plan 4.


  respectfully submitted,
  Daniel Gryniewicz
  Board Member, Cyberspace Communications Inc.
29 responses total.
mdw
response 1 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 7 04:46 UTC 1999

I hate to sound like an anti-technology bigot - but is there any good
reason why we should be doing credit card processing online?  Unless we
get thousands of members, I'm tempted to think that it might be a lot
simpler to think of some system where our treasurer does more work, but
gets more opportunity to be involved in the process and detect obvious
cases of fraud.
aruba
response 2 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 7 15:21 UTC 1999

Thanks, Dan for that great report.  I'm really glad you worked on this. 
When I tried to understand the problem last year I got frustrated and
discouraged after looking at just a few web sites. 

If we went with Charge Solutions Plan 4, we would still have to get a
merchant account with someone else, right?  Or am I misunderstanding? 

If someone else handles a web site for us, then we never see the credit
card number, correct?  That means we can't automatically charge a member
every month (or every year) if that's what s/he requests.  That might not
be so bad.  I'm not crazy about the idea of keeping a bunch of credit card
numbers around, even if they are on a secure machine.  But one of the
biggest arguments people used to give for accepting credit cards was that
it would make it easier for members to renew.  (I.e., they wouldn't not do
it just because they were too lazy to write a check.  All they'd have to
do was to request to be charged every month, or simply reply to the e-mail
saying their membership is up and ask to be renewed.  Personally, though,
I don't think we should count on getting a lot of money from people who
think it's too much trouble to write a check.  I suspect most of them will
find another excuse for not contibuting when we start accepting credit
cards.  Getting money from overseas is another matter though.  Credit
cards will certainly make that a lot easier.)

To answer Marcus: I'm willing to accept credit card numbers through PGP
and then phone them in, if that will save us money.  But I don't know if
that would mean fewer (or more) people would be willing to pay us.
dang
response 3 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 7 20:39 UTC 1999

resp:2 No, if we use Charge Solutions Plan 4, then we get our merchant
account through them.  Plans 3 and 4 are plans 1 and 2 with merchant
accounts.  Hense the added percentage charge.
aruba
response 4 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 7 21:23 UTC 1999

Ah, OK.  I get it.
devnull
response 5 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 8 00:22 UTC 1999

My understanding is that you can enter the credit card number using the keypad
of at least some card swiping machines.

I don't believe it is actually necessary to get a VeriSign
certificate.  You only get to get it from them if you want certain
netscape warnings to go away.  Maybe someone else knows more aobut this
than me?  (I have certainly dealt with non-verisign certificates at MIT.)

dang
response 6 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 8 15:35 UTC 1999

No, it isn't necessary to get a certificate. However, if we're accepting credit cards, and don't have a certificate, someone could run a "man in the middle" attack and steal credit card numbers from our members. This would, IMHO, be really bad.
richard
response 7 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 10 21:50 UTC 1999

with credit cards, grex could set up automatic payment options, where
dues could be taken automatically out of one's checking account or 
credited to credit card every month.  most companies offer some form
of automatic payment options these days, which is often convenient for
those who are forgetful (and forgetting to renew an expired membership
can be quite easy Im sure)
dang
response 8 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 10 23:37 UTC 1999

If we have someone's CC number, we can do that. Checking, however, we couldn't do unless they had a Checking Visa, or some such.
richard
response 9 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 11 21:43 UTC 1999

if the phone company can process automatic payments directly from
one's checking account, why cant grex>?
pfv
response 10 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 11 21:58 UTC 1999

        geezus.. *sigh*

        Who owns the transmission systems?

        Who owns the technology?

        Who has the money to throw at it?



        If you answer "Grex" to any of these, you should be shot.
scott
response 11 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 11 22:07 UTC 1999

If we had the economy of scale that the phone company has... no problem.  But
with ~100 members it is a bit more difficult.
lilmo
response 12 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 12 02:05 UTC 1999

Actually, I don't think automatic debits would be that hard, or expensive (I
could be wrong, of course).  I think we would just need an ACH membership,
and a few simple forms.  Of course, I have no earthly idea how much it is to
get on with ACH...
devnull
response 13 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 22 04:20 UTC 1999

My understanding is that grex probably could do ACH.  And I'd probably be
happy to use it if grex supported it.  This does not, however, imply that
I expect the amount of effort saved from supporting ACH to make the treasurer's
life easier than just getting checks from me.
danr
response 14 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 22 17:13 UTC 1999

I can't say that I studied completely #0, but I'd be more in favor of something
like billpoint.  The transaction fees are higher, but there are no up-front
costs, so our exposure is less.  Also, administering this would be less work
for the treasurer.

After we get a feel for how well this works, we could then shift to a program
that was more advantageous financially to us.
rtg
response 15 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 23 00:52 UTC 1999

For some reason, I've been getting a lot of spam lately which advertises
low-cost ways to get into the internet commerce business, including accepting
credit cards.  I refuse to encourage them by responding to spam ads, but if
you're interested, I'll scan my spam files and pull together a list of
contacts..
scg
response 16 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 23 01:38 UTC 1999

Most of those spams tend to be fradulent, as far as I can tell.
jshafer
response 17 of 29: Mark Unseen   May 29 22:21 UTC 1999

Agreed, don't do business with anyone who has to resort to spam to 
advertise.

Re: keeping track of members' card numbers, I don't know if it would be 
a good idea or if it would be necessary.  The cards expire often enough 
that it might be pointless...

I know I would trust Mark to keep my card # somewhere, but don't know 
if many would, or if I'd want to impose such a burden on him.
aruba
response 18 of 29: Mark Unseen   Jun 1 15:08 UTC 1999

My plan would be to keep all credit card numbers encrypted, with the password
known only to the treasurer.  Of course they would be on my machine, not on
Grex.
srw
response 19 of 29: Mark Unseen   Aug 1 04:18 UTC 1999

It's been two months since the last pasting here. Did this die?

I think we need to focus on an inexpensive way to get payments from 
abroad, and not try to use CCs as a way rebill the member for each 
payment (although I suppose we could - it's not the main point). 

srw
response 20 of 29: Mark Unseen   Aug 1 04:19 UTC 1999

(err posting)
aruba
response 21 of 29: Mark Unseen   Aug 1 14:25 UTC 1999

Accepting credit cards is not dead, no.  At the May board meeting we voted to
allocate $200 to start an account.  dang has been working on this, and just
recently I got a packet from the credit card company we selected (Charge 
Solutions).  They need a credit card number from us in order to bill fees.
I've asked our bank for a debit card so we can do that.  I explained to the
woman what we wanted to do, so I *hope* she understood and is sending us a
card with a 16-digit number, not just an ATM card.  We'll see in about 2
weeks.
janc
response 22 of 29: Mark Unseen   Aug 19 20:32 UTC 1999

Progress report on this (I'm temporary treasurer right now).

The bank sent us a Cyberspace Communications VISA card.  There were
some problems in getting it activated, but today I was finally able
to get it activated, so we are OK on this.  We needed this because the
company that runs the secure server needs to use it to charge us various
fees.

So the application to Charge Solutions is mostly ready to send.  It
needs signatures from the company president.  Mark had suggested we do
that at the next board meeting.  There is also a blank named "Business
License #" (which is different from "Tax ID #").  Mark left it blank and
didn't say anything about it.  I don't know what it is or if we need it.
i
response 23 of 29: Mark Unseen   Aug 19 23:47 UTC 1999

I'd guess that the State sales tax license # or Corporate ID # is what
they're looking for.
janc
response 24 of 29: Mark Unseen   Aug 22 17:09 UTC 1999

"Tax ID #" is asked for in another blank (already filled in as
38-2998091, which is our Employer Identification Number - pretty much
the corporate equivalent of a SSN).  The State Sales Tax License Number
sounds plausible - only I don't know what ours is.
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