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brighn
Michigan Senate Straw vote (very scientific) Mark Unseen   Oct 20 19:03 UTC 2000

Here's a vote just for the Michiganders (aw, the rest of you can vote too):

Stabenow or Abraham (or other) for Senate? Feel free to discuss, and feel free
to change your vote if you want. And unlike the Real Thing, you can split your
vote and have right in candidates.
62 responses total.
brighn
response 1 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 20 19:03 UTC 2000

Stabenow. Unfortunately. Even more than with the Presidential election, this
is the lesser of two evils.
carson
response 2 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 20 20:25 UTC 2000

(Abraham.)
jep
response 3 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 20 20:57 UTC 2000

Abraham.
arabella
response 4 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 20 21:21 UTC 2000

Stabenow

brighn
response 5 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 20 21:37 UTC 2000

(carson, have you always been this Republican? I hadn't noticed.)
krj
response 6 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 20 22:06 UTC 2000

Stabenow.
polygon
response 7 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 20 22:06 UTC 2000

Stabenow.

(I have known both of the candidates for years -- I went to high school
with Spence, and I knew Debbie since before she was elected county
commissioner in 1974.)
scott
response 8 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 20 22:30 UTC 2000

Stabenow.
carson
response 9 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 20 22:57 UTC 2000

resp:5  (yes.)
brighn
response 10 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 20 22:59 UTC 2000

(fascinating. learn something every day. =} )
albaugh
response 11 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 21 00:11 UTC 2000

Abraham
senna
response 12 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 21 01:21 UTC 2000

Shakey Jake.
scg
response 13 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 21 01:40 UTC 2000

I like what I've seen of Abraham's positions on immigration, and I'd hate to
lose that.  I don't think I agree with him on much else, though.  I don't know
much about Stabenows positions.  If I were voting in Michigan, I would
probably vote for Stabenow because I tend to default towards democrats on
races I don't know much about, but maybe if I were voting in Michigan I would
have made an effort to find out more.
jerryr
response 14 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 21 12:10 UTC 2000

stabenow
remmers
response 15 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 21 13:13 UTC 2000

Stabenow.
gjharb
response 16 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 21 15:21 UTC 2000

Stabenow.
bru
response 17 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 21 16:36 UTC 2000

Abraham, but I wish there was another choice.  Any libertarians running here?
danr
response 18 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 21 21:11 UTC 2000

Stabenow.
mcnally
response 19 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 21 21:35 UTC 2000

  re #13:  What is it you like about Abraham's immigration positions?
  I've been very put off by his support for deeply flawed H1-B programs 
  which are very unbalanced in favor of employers, to the detriment of
  foreign visa holders and American workers alike..

  I've been meaning to enter an item about H1-B visas, maybe I'll use this
  as an excuse.

  (basically my position is that I'm overjoyed when bright, well-educated
  people from around the world want to move to America to fill jobs we're
  having trouble filling, but that current H1-B programs are structured so
  the employers can underpay foreign workers by as much as 20% and have so
  much leverage over them that they can take advantage of them in other ways,
  which gives the employers strong incentives to reject qualified American
  candidates even when they can be found and allows many employers to treat
  their visa-holders very badly.)
gull
response 20 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 22 00:21 UTC 2000

RE #19: Well, what do you expect?  Who do you think writes the laws?
mcnally
response 21 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 22 00:54 UTC 2000

  Trust me, I understand how lobbying on this issue has affected the laws
  that get written (and also enforcement of the provisions of the H1-B
  laws which are *supposed* to guarantee that employers pay the foreign
  workers prevailing wages) but what's your point?  That I'm supposed to
  throw up my hands and say:  "It doesn't matter who I vote for, the
  corporations will write the laws in any event?"  I'm not prepared to do
  that.

  I don't live in Michigan any longer, but if I did I'd certainly be taking
  Senator Abraham's H1-B policy into consideration when making up my mind
  who to vote for.  His position on the Senate committee which controls
  immigration makes his voice on that issue particularly powerful and I am
  convinced that his immigration positions have not been formed with the
  best interests of his constituents in mind.
krj
response 22 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 22 02:05 UTC 2000

(let's start a new item and save the poll items for polling.
 Signed, the committee for the preservation of Grex poll items.
 Thank you for your support!)
brighn
response 23 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 22 02:10 UTC 2000

(ken, I specifically said in #0 that I welcomed discussion here. And it's my
item, dammit. ;} )
brighn
response 24 of 62: Mark Unseen   Oct 22 02:22 UTC 2000

Current count:
Stabenow: me, arabella, krj, polygon, scott, scg, jerryr, remmers, gjharb,
danr (10)
Abraham: (carson), jep, albagh, bru (4)
Shakey Jake: senna (1)
lots of comments, no candidate: mcnally (1) ;}
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