The question has arisen as to how many paper copies there should be of the Grex newsletter (whatever we decide to call it). I have also realized that there is unanswered the question of what type of paper to use. Theoretically, we could use 100% cotton paper, but I dont' think the board is willing to spring for that. So how cheap should we be? These are questions for the board to decide, but for ALL interested parties to discuss, and get their input in. 'Nighty-night!!52 responses total.
Well, does grex have any set "colors" or such? Picking a cheap colored paper would be cool.
Newsletter 5 is now linked to Coop 113. Enjoy!
I Grex doesn't have any set colors, although I guess it wouldn't work too well to have everybody choose their color of newspaper the way we let people choose their tee shirt colors. Have we made a decision yet on whether this newspaper would be on paper or in ASCII? I don't remember.
Black paper with bright flourescent green ink? Also, I think printing it on toilet paper might be appropriate. :-)
Recycled paper, with as high a post-consumer recycled fiber content as is feasible. Well, given Greg's suggestion, I would steer clear of post-consumer toilet paper. :-)
Re #3: the understanding of the editors is that an online version will be made, and paper copies sent to any members (and others?) who so request it, as well as being available for publicity purposes.
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That's in YOUR court !!! :-)
Well, there's plenty of colors to choose from. A recommendation- How often is this going to be published? If quarterly, pick a seasonal color. If monthly, pick one that works with that month's theme, or major holiday.
And let's not forget to argue over those colors until we've managed to discourage the newsletter people from even starting! :) :) :)
I don't know about people covering the costs -- I think the original idea was to have members recieve it free if they want to, with others paying. I don't object, though, to having folks send a SASE or whatever. (I assume that as the editor in charge of paper (It'll alos ne in HTML and ASCII versions, I think) that job will fall to me? My suggestion is that we print n+35 copies of each, where n = the number of pre-requested copies. The remaining 35 could be used as PR and/or go to people who want them but forgot to ask for them ahead of time. Paper? Hey, we're an on-line medium. I say, forget the colour and go with a close to 100% recycled paper as we can find and whatever colour that's in, fine. The exception is if we decide we must have photos. (We'll be doing a couple of series of interviews. I'd prefer a good caricature, to accompany them, myself. Too bad I don't draw.) Then we'd need clay coat paper -- maybe for anniversary issues or something..
That stuff looks awful, though!
Yes, but wouldn't it be fitting to say somewhere in the paper, that Cyberspace Communications uses the cheapest paper possible since we're fundementally opposed to the distribution of it on paper, and then tell folks what url to look at for the 'real thing'? I think that would be cool, telling the world that we're capable of doing paper versions of things we can do online, but that it will be on the flimseyest paper possible.
I kind of like that reasoning, but if the newsletter is used as propeganda to garner new users (or members), it might not be as effectie as a nicer paper. And by the way, decent quality recycled paper generally costs more than decent quality new-fiber paper (timber subsidies are effective). I favor recycled paper for environmental reasons, not for frugality.
(What better way to get new users than to make them get online for the real thing?)
Re #16: If I saw a newsletter on REALLY cheap paper, I'd wonder, 'In what aother ways are they too cheap to do it right?'
(Using ancient computers?)
<chuckle>
In that way, they'd know what to expect.. If the writing was
good, it would kinda reflect exactly what we are: not so much flashy,
but rich in content!
You want something that says: "Poor, but honest.".
Then I think we need to get paper that we expect to be of reasonable quality, but not particularly expensive, like ordinary copier paper. IMHO, of course.
Well, more and more print and copy shops are placing equal-
quality recycled stock at the same price as its' virgin counterpart,
so the only question truly is- just how bad do you want this to look?
I must concur with the idea that the newsletter require no
"virgin sacrifices".
If they are the same cost, then go for the recycled, I say. I hope the board remembers to give us some direction on how many non-requested copies to print, and has some idea what to do with them. :-)
Well, I can help, as I have experience in the printing industry..
Feel free to chime in!! Also, as mta is the only one of us in AA, e-mail her with your ideas. :-)
I do plan to do a few copies on really nice paper with full colour and pretty layout. But that'll be just a very few to be used in my PR attempts. (Pretty please, can we leave brochures here? See, this is who we are and what we do.)
Mta, have you checked into what kinko's can do for you? As I
recall there's a very strong presence of them in Ann Arbor.. now as to
full-color, _that_ can get to be very expensive.. but high quality black
print on good colored stock is most impressive, at very little more cost
than just Black and white..
Also, as I work at a kinko's in Lathrup Village, if you want to
go to hte bother of getting the originals to me, I may be able to
arrange a special discount.
Kinko's is +not+ the only printing game in town, just the most expensive and most obvious. Please look at an offset printing shop. I can think of Partners Press for one.
Though Kink's may be AA's only commercial round-the-clock print-it-yourself shop with good computer output devices. I've never seen them give the cheapest quote for anything, but they're still my first choice for a lot of things (being open at 3am is a BIG plus for me :-).
Kinkies does have its place ... so does the Grex bank account - ithink ajax and i are agreeing here.
tsty, off-set is cheap if you print scads of copies. but the initial set-up (typeset/keyline and master plate) is pretty expensive for lower volume jobs. advantage is good quality retained in large jobs, and faster, cheaper per copy cost (for larger jobs). unless you're talking about k's of copies, i'd go with kinkos who can print from your disk (ie; no typesetting costs) with fair quality.
how many copies are we printing? whatis the breakeven point?
Well, I can tell you that to take a job of less than 500 to
an offset printer will get you laughed out of their shop.
As I didn't see that kind of volume being proposed, I suggested
what I knew to be a good alternative.. if you _were_ talking more like
500+ flyers, I would have suggested offset myself!
I've about 5000 is the break even point
What kind of volume, size, and number of pages do you think the Grex newsletter would be?
I believe that someone reported an authorization from the board to be up to two pages, front and back? (Although I think the equivalent, one 11x17 folded in the middle would be a better idea; less separate sheets to lose or scatter)
If it would help, I recently picked up a big office laser printer cheap at an auction. It does postscript, double sided and 11"x17". My cost for consumables(not counting the paper) would be 0.05 per 2-sided 11x17 page.
So, you would charge Grex $0.05 per newsletter, plus paper costs? What would Kinko's charge?
(in that range, I think. Kinkos would also be able to fold &/or collate for an extra charge, and the product would be boxed)
How much does 11x17 paper cost? In bulk, now, we would not necessarily buy just enough for each run at that time.
For 8.5 x 11" copies, Kinko's charges .07 for the first 100 and .035 for each copy thereafter.
Number 41 is correct for the most part. If greg is willing to do what he has proposed, I would take him up on it.
And..
And, no one seems to know who should make this decision. Including me.
I think you folks should pick a small number of copies to start with, and if they disappear into the woodwork, well, we can always make more up. Better to have three trips to the printers becasue of popularity than one trip and a pile of newsletters that need to go to the recycling bin.
there could ba an official Grex library for timber product productions, perhaps 3-4 copies, minimum?
Wasn't someone to get subscriptions from members?
Let's seee if I can remember...the idea was to offer to send paper copies to members if they want them (this helps members - supporters - that aren't hanging around here all the time), and also to make an over-run for publicity purposes, to pass out at JCC sales, and other events. How many would JCC volunteers think should be in a pile there?
My strategy at a JCC might be to hold on to a pile of them, and if I've talked to someone at the table who seems like s/he might actually log on, give them a copy of the newsletter. If they say thanks and walk away without talking at all after they've picked up a piece of Grex literature, I tend to think there is less of a chance I'll see them online. Thats false to some extent, but without limitless resources, I think we should try to husband them a little, else we'll need 500 of them. People tend to go pick-up crazy and swaps, and will greedily pick literature up when they know that they probably won't even read it. I'd like to avoid that if we can.
If we print as many as we have members, and then ask members to announce if anyone wants a copy mailed to them, we'll end up sending paper copies to some members, and what's left over we can give away at JCC. We are however covered in the (unlikely) event all members want a paper copy (except STeve, who is a tree hugger ;->).
That sounds good to me... anyone else have any other ideas?
Well, it is a simple matter to keep the master copy around for extra runs, if needed.