Grex Music3 Conference

Item 84: The Tenth Napster Item

Entered by krj on Thu Mar 28 18:38:56 2002:

Continuing the weblog, with occasional discussion and outbreaks of 
bitter argument, about news relating to the deconstruction of the 
music business: with side forays, to steal polygon's description, 
into "intellectual property, freedom of expression, electronic media,
corporate control, and evolving technology."

This quarter we have a major news story, the introduction of 
Sen. Hollings' proposed Consumer Broadband and Digital Television
Promotion Act (CBDTPA), formerly known as the SSSCA.  Dicussion
on that proposal is in Agora item 13 ( item:agora41,13 ).

This item is linked between the Spring Agora conference and the 
Music conference.  All previous versions of this item can be found
in the music2 and music3 conferences.
165 responses total.

#1 of 165 by brighn on Thu Mar 28 18:48:57 2002:

You didn't steal polygon's description. Haven't you been paying attention to
anything Russ (or polygon, for that matter) has said? You can't steal
intellectual property. ;}
 
(Just finding that particular word choice ironic, is all...)


#2 of 165 by krj on Thu Mar 28 18:58:59 2002:

I've taken a week or so off from this, and items have piled up a bit...
 
To start this quarter, we have two pieces of Genuine Napster News.
They might be close to the last pieces of Genuine Napster News, too.
 
http://www.wired.com/news/mp3/0,1285,51301,00.html
"Dead Napster Gets Deader"
 
The Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals has upheld the injunction of trial
court judge Marilyn Patel which demands perfection from Napster in 
barring the exchange of copyrighted material through its (old) free
service.  So Old Free Napster remains shutdown, probably forever.
At some level this ruling was not terribly relevant, because Napster
had never resumed operating.
 
Nowhere have I found a legal explanation for what appears to be a reversal
by the Ninth Circuit.  Judge Patel originally ordered Napster to stop 
all infringements through its service in summer 2000, and at that time
the Ninth Circuit overruled her with an order laying out what Napster 
could reasonably be expected to do, and what the obligations of the 
copyright holders were.  A year later, Judge Patel came out with an
order which sounds to me just like the summer 2000 order, and this time
the appeals court upheld it.  Beats me.

In the second Napster story, which I have temporarily lost the citation 
for, Napster announced that its plans to launch its for-pay service are
now on a long-term hold: one story said nine months, one story said 
indefinitely.  Napster's executive said the problem is their inability
to negotiate license arrangements with all five major labels.

-----

Wired and Cnet also cover a stunning reversal against the copyright industry
in the Kazaa case.  A Dutch appeals court ruled that the Kazaa company
could not be held responsible for the copyright infringements of its users
when they swap files.
The ruling comes a little late for the Kazaa operation, which sold all 
of its assets to a mysterious Australian buyer earlier this year.

http://www.wired.com/news/mp3/0,1285,51380,00.html
http://news.com.com/2100-1023-870396.html




#3 of 165 by krj on Thu Mar 28 22:01:55 2002:

Two stories on the proposed new royalties for Internet radio broadcasts,
and the expectation that they will wipe out the independent webcasters
and hand complete control of this function to the major labels:
 
http://www.siliconvalley.com/mld/siliconvalley/news/local/2922047.htm
"Proposed royalty rates could bankrupt Webcasters"
 
http://salon.com/tech/feature/2002/03/26/web_radio/index.html
"Web radio's last stand"
 
The Salon story interviews a web radio operator who says that under
the new Digital Millenium Copyright Act rules, his royalty payments
will go from $1000 per year to about $1000 per day.
"We just want to be treated as over-the-air broadcasters are treated,"
he says.
 
To recapitulate for those who came in late:  The DMCA created a new 
"digital performance right" for web streaming operations -- this 
royalty is only to be paid by Internet radio operations, not by 
"conventional" broadcasters.  And the Copyright office proposal 
would set this rate so high that only the largest corporations could
afford it -- probably just the major record companies, who would be 
paying themselves.   The result is that by law, we are strangling
what should be a tool for cultural diversity.


#4 of 165 by remmers on Thu Mar 28 22:14:48 2002:

Yup.


#5 of 165 by vidar on Thu Mar 28 22:20:36 2002:

<dies>


#6 of 165 by other on Fri Mar 29 06:35:47 2002:

From slashdot:  

CBDTPA Finds A Champion In the House:  Wired is reporting that House 
member Adam Schiff of Burbank is seeking a co-sponsor for his House 
version of Hollings' CBDTPA. 
http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,1283,51400,00.html

http://slashdot.org/yro/02/03/28/2137253.shtml?tid=103


#7 of 165 by other on Fri Mar 29 07:26:07 2002:

oops, i'm replicating an earlier entry in the other "stupid government 
behaviour" item.


#8 of 165 by gull on Fri Mar 29 14:48:04 2002:

Re #3: Will this apply to regular radio stations that simulcast online, 
too?  In other words, will they be double-billed?

I remember a while back an organization that represents TV stations 
tried to get a bill considered that would have banned anyone from 
streaming more than 30 minutes of continuous video over the Internet.  
It was promptly heavily opposed by their own constituancy -- many small 
TV stations were just starting to benefit from simulcasting on the 
Internet, which gave them a bigger audience than they could get 
otherwise.


#9 of 165 by krj on Fri Mar 29 15:08:37 2002:

IIRC, radio stations which broadcast over the air get a 50%
break on the new digital performance rights royalties for their
Internet simulcasts.  


#10 of 165 by keesan on Fri Mar 29 16:25:45 2002:

I thought the record companies (CD companies?) liked to have radio stations
broadcasting their music because it resulted in more sales.  And that they
would even pay them to do so.


#11 of 165 by jazz on Fri Mar 29 16:41:11 2002:

        Okay.  Record companies aren't really worried about theft of property
through services like Napster or internet radio;  they're quite good at bean
counting and even the most elementary statistical analysis shows that, like
radio play, Napster had a noticeably positive effect on record sales.  What's
happening here is that record companies want to OWN the Napster business. 
By regulating it and making it difficult, if not impossible, to get into the
business, they create an industry where they can be the only players.

        The intellectual property argument is for political spin control.


#12 of 165 by krj on Fri Mar 29 22:29:04 2002:

The old online journal NewMediaMusic had one of their best pieces
on this subject, maybe about a year ago.  Unfortunately I did not save
a copy and their site is now gone.

In the record company business model which is now rapidly breaking,
the record company would work like the dickens to get free temporary
copies delivered to customers over the radio, with the expectation
that this would motivate purchases of tangible, permanent copies.

(The effort to get those temporary copies out onto the radio waves
has become so expensive that industry execs cite it as a major
reason that major-label releases have to sell 500,000 copies to 
break even now.)

Now, map that old business model to the Internet world.
    The delivery of the free radio samples:  
         ship digital bits to user's computer.   
    The delivery of the paid-for copy: 
         ship digital bits to user's computer.
The difference between the marketing function (free radio) and the 
sales function has vanished.  Uh-oh... thus we come to 
the SSSCA-type proposals to cripple all computers to create
artificial distinctions between groups of bits, and restrict
the manipulation and processing of those bits accordingly:
essentially, to outlaw the general purpose, Turing-machine computer.


#13 of 165 by krj on Fri Mar 29 23:41:15 2002:

While writing resp:12 I had a wisp of another idea.  
The major labels say they have to spend an obscene, and rising,
amount of money promoting their releases to radio.  
Why should this be so?  Well, in the last couple of years we have
had the rise of the Clear Channel radio "pigopoly."
But more generally: the major labels are having to spend more to 
try and get Release X to stand out from the pack, because there 
are so many releases.  There is, in short, an oversupply of music.

Market theory tells us that some things are supposed to happen
in response to an oversupply: prices are to decline until the 
less efficient producers are forced out of the market.

One wonders when the market forces start to kick in.
Articles published in the wake of the music industry sales reports
for 2001 said the decline in sales would probably lead to a 
decline in prices, but we have not seen it yet.


#14 of 165 by jazz on Fri Mar 29 23:41:17 2002:

        That's not going to happen.  Follow the money.  There's way too much
money at stake in computing.


#15 of 165 by russ on Sat Mar 30 01:00:12 2002:

Re #9:  In the case of the dual-casting station which currently
pays $1000 a year to BMI and ASCAP, instead of paying $1000 a
day for the compulsory webcasting license they would only have
to pay $500 a day.  That's only 180 times what they pay now.
Whatta bargain...

You can bet that there will not be any webcasting by student
radio stations if this is not radically scaled back.   Non-profits
will be pretty much removed from the market too.


#16 of 165 by krj on Sat Mar 30 01:37:18 2002:

I've come across some mention of a lower rate for non-profit organizations,
but I can't remember all the details.


#17 of 165 by raven on Sat Mar 30 20:38:39 2002:

re #15 Why Russ it sounds like you are calling for goverment regulation
of the record companies?  I think the genuis of the market knew everything,
could it be that life is more conplicated than that?


#18 of 165 by krj on Sat Mar 30 21:15:53 2002:

Here's a story from about ten weeks ago about the DataPlay discs:
http://news.com.com/2100-1023-864058.html
"Small discs to feature big artists"
 
DataPlay discs are "about the size of a quarter and can hold 5 to 11 
hours of music, or three to five albums."  (Those are really, 
really long albums...)  Leading independent label Zomba, home to 
Britney & N'Sync, has signed a deal to start using the format for 
new releases, joining major companies Universal, EMI and BMG.
 
The hope of the recording industry is that they can convince 
consumers to switch to DataPlay discs, which include digital rights
management, so the unprotected CD can be withdrawn from market.
 
"Blank discs will cost between $5 and $12."        (*coff, coff*)


#19 of 165 by oval on Sat Mar 30 23:33:18 2002:

i've put this item off until i could thoroughly divulge into it and i must
admit it all seemed confusing and inevitable what with tv and the
entertainment industry being how it is already. but until i read *this*
article:

http://www.wired.com/news/print/0,1294,51274,00.html

i wasn't nearly as angry. maybe they should should control the english
language so that every word i'm typing here comes with a fee.

(#11 was very well put by jazz)



#20 of 165 by mcnally on Sun Mar 31 00:08:34 2002:

  Wired News is now reporting that Senator Leahy, chairman of the Senate
  Judiciary committee (which for some reason has jurisdiction over the
  SSSCA / CBDTPA) is opposed to the measure and has stated his intention
  to prevent it from reaching a vote this year.

  http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,1283,51425,00.html

  However, the bill (or one like it) is still proceeding in the House
  and if Leahy's opposition should falter or fail the bill is still a
  danger.  It's still important to contact your elected representatives
  to let them know that you're strongly opposed to this legislation.


#21 of 165 by krj on Sun Mar 31 02:37:02 2002:

Tsk, mcnally's resp:20 belongs in the Agora item on the CBDTPA, not
in the Agora/Music "napster" item.  :)    But it's mildly encouraging
news anyway.


#22 of 165 by oval on Sun Mar 31 02:40:04 2002:

there's a CBDTPA item?!



#23 of 165 by krj on Sun Mar 31 02:50:38 2002:

Yes, spring Agora, item 13, is discussing the CBDTPA.   ( item:agora41,13 )
I can usually find enough about the music industry and other 
copyright topics to keep this one busy.


#24 of 165 by oval on Sun Mar 31 02:52:22 2002:

it's all closely related though -- hard to talk about one without fondling
the other just a bit...



#25 of 165 by jazz on Sun Mar 31 08:04:12 2002:

        Fondling bits is expressly forbidden by the CBDTPA.

        The DataPlay maneuver will proabably go over about as well as consumer
copy-protected DAT;  the industry really had to learn that it isn't quite
smart enough to predict the format consumers will choose, and if they were,
their meddling with rights management will delay it's entry to past the
critical few months where the format would have been chosen, anyways.

        That's kind of a salvation to Napster users;  hacker kids, like 'em
or hate 'em, are always going to be smarter about subverting data security
than professionals are about instituting it.  Instituting is by nature a
harder job, and professionals are often more in business than obsessed.


#26 of 165 by krj on Sun Mar 31 19:36:53 2002:

The DataPlay people have a website at http://www.dataplay.com.
You can buy clothes and bags with their logo imprinted, and there is 
a promise that blank media and recording/playback machines will 
soon be available. 
Some of the promotional material on their web site actively 
touts the DataPlay resistance to file sharing, so I don't think 
this site was intended to market to end users.  :)
 
One of the aspects they are happiest about is that DataPlay discs
can be given away or sold with content "locked up" so the holder of 
the disc cannot get it unless additional payment is made.


#27 of 165 by jazz on Sun Mar 31 23:03:13 2002:

        How long d'ya think that'll take to reverse engineer?


#28 of 165 by oval on Mon Apr 1 08:54:48 2002:

so if my friend comes over and i play a cd for him, and he likes it and i let
him borrow it for a while, am i in trouble?


#29 of 165 by gull on Mon Apr 1 17:01:49 2002:

Re #17: Record companies don't seem to be part of a free market.  Sales 
of CDs have been falling for months now and the price has oddly 
remained the same.  The "unseen hand" doesn't seem to be doing its job.

Re #26: That sounds like the DIVX "pay for play" model.  You'll note 
that DIVX was extremely unsuccessful.


#30 of 165 by mdw on Tue Apr 2 00:07:02 2002:

Unless the DataPlay discs have some sort of per-disk uniquification
(using a long enough key), I don't think it will last very long.
There's already an active market in subverting satellite TV encryption
systems, which are apparently based on a shared symmetric key.


#31 of 165 by krj on Tue Apr 2 21:24:29 2002:

In the Napster legal case:  Judge Patel has given Napster *TEN MONTHS*
for the discovery procedure, in which Napster gets to look in the 
record companies' paperwork for evidence that they were abusing their
copyrights.  This was reported by the L.A.Times.  This drags the Napster
case out into January 2003, at least.
 
http://www.calendarlive.com/top/1,1419,L-LATimes-Music-X!ArticleDetail-5461
3,00.html
(warning, URL is wrapped)
 
-----

http://news.com.com/2100-1023-872765.html
"Small Webcasters Campaign for Survival"  

This is a good article from Cnet, with some numbers.  Quote:
>   Negotiations over the actual rates for the new royalties proved 
>   bitter, ultimately winding up in front of the U.S. Copyright Office's
>   arbitration panel.  Record labels proposed a per-song rate that
>   was about 100 times what the big Webcasters' trade association --
>   led by companies such as America Online, MTV and RealNetworks -- 
>   said was feasible.  The arbitration panel's proposed rates 
>   split that difference.
...
>   The fees, once passed, will add a large new expense to Webcasters'
>   bottom line.  To date, they've only had to pay the same songwriters'
>   fees that regular radio stations pay -- about 4 percent of their 
>   revenues.

The rates are so unmanageable that everyone outside of the record business
agrees it kills all independent webcasting.  Some large companies are joining
the effort to change the rules.  Arbitron, the ratings firm, wrote to 
Congress:
 
>   ...a Webcaster that reached as many people as a big radio station 
>   in New York would have to pay more than $30 million a year in 
>   royalties alone.  That would make it almost impossible to survive,
>   Arbitron said.

Small webcasters and their fans are organizing to lobby
Congress to revise the rules, since they have no standing at this 
point in the Copyright Office procedures.


#32 of 165 by krj on Fri Apr 5 22:41:57 2002:

The dead tree edition of USA Today has an overview story about 
home copying in their business section today.  Little new, but 
a few interesting snippets:
 
"The public is almost evenly divided on whether Internet users have
the right to swap music from CDs online, according to a CNN/USA TODAY/
Gallup poll: 43% say it should be legal, 46% say illegal, with 
11% undecided."

"((CD)) Sales this year are worse.  Total units are down another 12%
vs. the first three months of 2001."   (KRJ adds: Total units were 
down 10% in 2001, but a big chunk of that represented the industry's
decision to wind down CD single production, which is why the 
dollar value only went down 6% or so.  If that 12% decline for 
2002 to date is mostly album sales, then the companies are getting 
walloped much worse than last year.)

Band manager Miles Copeland says banks are turning down 
music companies for loans.

Pam Horowitz, president of NARM (music retailing trade group)
says: "Do we still have a competitively priced product?...
DVD sales have exploded, and it's a product where the price has
come down while the price of CDs has gone up.  If our only response
as an industry is to stop copying of CDs, we may be missing a 
consumer message."   

A few other people in the article mention the usual argument that 
consumers are buying less music because most of what the companies are
flogging right now is crap.   (A big point of support for that position
came from a similar article in the Miami Herald about a week ago, 
which reported again that rock concert attendance is also down.
A falloff in the business of live music indicates that the public's
attention is shifting away from music.)



#33 of 165 by dbratman on Thu Apr 11 18:34:55 2002:

Good column today by Jon Carroll on the morality of the proposed 
restrictions.

It's at http://www.sfgate.com/columnists/carroll/ - click 
on "04/11/2002 Jolly new threat to our freedoms"

Direct access at http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?
file=/chronicle/archive/2002/04/11/DD240137.DTL


#34 of 165 by krj on Sun Apr 14 02:30:21 2002:

April 6 Billboard, browsed at Borders, has a big lead story:
   "Losses Mount for Music Industry Digital Services":
which seems to be mostly about Pressplay and Musicnet.  
Apparently the losses are mounting to a point where the parent
corporations are getting concerned.  

I wasn't willing to spend $7 to take it home with me, and Billboard
does not put the juicy business news on the web site.   I forgot to 
note if there was any clue as to the number of paying customers for 
the official services.



#35 of 165 by jaklumen on Sun Apr 14 04:10:06 2002:

I've forgotten again-- these are the for-pay sites?


#36 of 165 by krj on Mon Apr 15 12:56:46 2002:

"Music-for-rent" would be a more accurate description.  :)
 
-----
 
A Washington Post writer gets a beta-test version of actual 
DataPlay hardware and pre-recorded music disc.  The reviewer
thinks the technology might have some potential for replacing flash
memory in digital cameras, "but I can't figure out why anybody would
want to buy music this way.  The CD works just fine as is."
 
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A42176-2002Apr13.html


#37 of 165 by jaklumen on Tue Apr 16 08:59:54 2002:

Interestingly enough, I think equalizing forces may be at work here.

I seem to have no problem getting big hits from the KaZaA et al 
community.  But every now and then, there is a song that millions of 
users don't seem to be fond of and don't have online to share.

I was looking for Jazzie Redd's "I Am A Dope Fiend," which was a 
little hip-hop tune back in the early 1990's (perhaps 1990-1991) and 
was remade in 2000.  Apparently, I will need to order the single or 
the CD/album it comes from to get it.

Ironically, might that mean that hard-to-find music might actually get 
more real sales?


#38 of 165 by krj on Sun Apr 21 17:22:30 2002:

Very nice overview article from the Chicago Tribune on the
consolidation in the radio business, and spillover effects into
the record industry and Internet radio.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/showcase/chi-0204140469apr14.story?coll=
chi-n
ews-hed
"Rocking radio's world"

Quotes:
> Since 1996, Arbitron surveys show that the
> average time spent listening to radio by consumers 
> 12 and older has dropped 9 percent. In the
> last two years, listenership has dropped more than 
> 7 percent, Arbitron says. The young
> especially are tuning out: Teen-age listeners are 
> down 11 percent, and people between the ages
> of 18 and 24 have declined 10 percent.
...
> Playlists at stations across the country 
> continue to shrink, with only about 20 songs a week
> played with any regularity, most from the best-funded 
> major labels. Many commercial stations say
> they play only records approved by their audience
> through extensive market-testing, but this
> practice has led to a numbing sameness of programming, 
> with many of the same records played
> in the same formats from Miami to Seattle. In one week 
> recently, the 40 biggest modern-rock
> stations in the country opened a total of 16 
> slots for new records, and the 45 biggest top-40
> stations added a total of 20. That means that 
> even though more than 30,000 CDs are released
> annually, the vast majority of the songs played 
> at these stations is the same week after week, a
> pool of a few dozen artists who are also seen 
> extensively on video networks such as MTV and
> VH1.

The quotes from the Clear Channel execs, about how they are only there
to serve the public, are particularly nauseating.

The article also reports that (KRJ paraphrasing) the RIAA is starting
to wake up to the idea that destroying the fledgling Web radio business
would be a bad move, in terms of choking off promotional opportunities
for record companies.


#39 of 165 by mcnally on Sun Apr 21 22:11:10 2002:

  Meanwhile the New York Times has an article this week about the band
  Wilco ( http://www.nytimes.com/2002/04/21/arts/music/21PARE.html )
  and their new album, Yankee Hotel Foxtrot.  Deemed unsuitable by Reprise,
  a part of the Time-Warner-AOL media megacorp, the album was rejected.
  The band, unhappy with their label support anyway and unwilling to be
  forced into the alt-country niche in which Reprise had successfully
  promoted their 1996 album "Being There" fought for and obtained control
  over the recordings..  They shopped the completed album around and
  eventually placed it with Nonesuch, another part of the Time-Warner-AOL
  media megacorp..  Go figure.


#40 of 165 by orinoco on Mon Apr 22 04:06:33 2002:

In fact, there was a cute line in the article -- unfortunately, I don't have
it with me -- about how all the music company mergers allowed them to play
one branch of Time-Warner against another.  It sounds like they were basically
going and asking dad when mom had already said no.  Funny that those mergers
might actually have made it possible for this album to come out.


#41 of 165 by mcnally on Mon Apr 22 06:02:12 2002:

  I think it's more likely that the mega-mergers make it increasingly
  difficult for such albums to be released by marginalizing or frequently
  eliminating the smaller labels which will take chances on music that 
  doesn't exactly fit into a recognized format, but in this case it does
  sound like the band benefitted from the fact that the acquired labels
  still retain some degree of independence/individuality.


#42 of 165 by orinoco on Mon Apr 22 15:50:42 2002:

Well, right.  That's why I thought it was so ... ironic?  Am I allowed to call
this irony?  


#43 of 165 by krj on Tue Apr 23 19:14:20 2002:

The Boston Globe has the usual piece on the distress of the 
music business:
 
http://www.boston.com/dailyglobe2/111/living/Burned_+.shtml
 
Nothing really new here except one pair of sales statistics:
 
>  It's also notable *where* the people who still buy music are buying it.
>  Chains like Tower and Virgin are down 8 to 9 percent, according to
>  SoundScan, while mass merchants such as Wal-Mart and Target (that is,
>  stores that sell many other products besides CDs) are up 6 percent.
>  That has a negative impact on the selection of music in record
>  stores, because obviously, those retailers focus on the faster-selling
>  hit-making acts, rather than exposing a lot of new, lesser-known
>  CDs that sell fewer copies and take up space.

Tower and Virgin seem to be at $19 for top-line releases that aren't 
on sale.  What do Wal-Mart and Target charge?  I never go there.
But I smell a price revolt.


#44 of 165 by mcnally on Tue Apr 23 19:57:36 2002:

  Also interesting, Salon has a piece today centered around the struggle of
  Joshua (?) Byrd, a music professor at a small college, to get Sony to pay
  royalties on two obscure albums he released in the 1960s (and on their much
  more recent CD reissues.)  He claims that despite the fact that his works
  remain in print (suggesting that they must be selling to someone, though I
  can't imagine who..) Sony pays him no royalties and won't even acknowledge
  his requests for sales figures.

  The story makes it seem that this is common practice in the music industry
  but unless you've got as much money on the line as the Dixie Chicks did
  when they sued Sony that it's rarely economically feasible to collect from
  a stonewalling record company.

  I apologize for not digging up the URL but I've got nine or ten different
  batch MP3 encodes going right now (part of the Great Leap Backwards) and 
  my CPU is thrashing so badly that using Mozilla to find the article would
  probably take 10 minutes of staring at half-rendered screens..



#45 of 165 by anderyn on Wed Apr 24 00:03:15 2002:

This response has been erased.



#46 of 165 by senna on Wed Apr 24 01:13:07 2002:

Large-scale outlets have always been cheaper than Tower, Virgin, and company.
Back when Tower existed in the downtown Ann Arbor area (which continues to
disintegrate, I might add, and I'm a lot younger than you folk who know what
it was like when it was *really* good), I'd usually browse, perhaps purchase
an item or two that was harder to find, and do my actual CD buying at a place
like Best Buy.  Best Buy's cd selection actually used to be better and more
appealing, in my opinion.  Anyway, I saw little point in actually spending
money there when the same stuff was considerably more affordable elsewhere.

I'm surprised this is even newsworthy. :)


#47 of 165 by jaklumen on Wed Apr 24 01:59:09 2002:

Of course large-scale outlets are cheaper than smaller stores.  The 
smaller stores usually find a niche getting more unusual recordings 
and such.  For example, a used tape and CD store earned most of its 
money through orders of boxed sets.


#48 of 165 by senna on Wed Apr 24 03:20:45 2002:

Indeed.  Tower and Virgin are not niche stores, though.


#49 of 165 by krj on Wed Apr 24 18:06:55 2002:

http://www.rollingstone.com/news/newsarticle.asp?nid=15817&afl=mnew
 
> "Retail Hopes Ride on Nelly, Korn"
> 
> "Slumping industry puts faith in blockbuster summer releases" 
> 
> Record stores are looking to summer releases from
> the likes of Nelly, Korn and Eminem to help recover
> from a dismal first quarter of 2002, when album
> sales dropped nearly TEN PERCENT compared with last
> year.    ((emphasis KRJ))


#50 of 165 by krj on Wed Apr 24 18:39:32 2002:

Mike in resp:41 on Wilco's move from the Reprise imprint to the 
Nonesuch imprint, both within the AOL Time Warner empire:

>  ...but in this case it does
>  sound like the band benefitted from the fact that the acquired labels
>  still retain some degree of independence/individuality

... except that neither Reprise nor Nonesuch were ever independent
labels; both were Warner Bros. divisions since their creation. 

Reprise was originally started so Frank Sinatra could have his own 
label, IIRC, and for many years it was where Warner stuck many of 
its prestige/quirky artists, most notably Neil Young, who I think saved
the label from being killed off when it was floundering some years 
back.  Nonesuch was founded as Warner's classical division in the 
early 1960s and it had a glorious history; in the last ten years or 
so the brand has been repositioned as a world music/serious art label, 
with a lot of licensing of European issues (artists such as Radio 
Tarifa, Oumou Sangare, Ali Farka Toure, Youssou N'Dour).
More recently Nonesuch has picked up Emmylou Harris after the 
main Warners label discarded her following the WRECKING BALL album.

Label "branding" is a fascinating concept... but it's really drifting
here, isn't it?


#51 of 165 by keesan on Wed Apr 24 18:59:59 2002:

I thought Nonesuch was mostly folk, not classical.


#52 of 165 by krj on Wed Apr 24 20:43:37 2002:

Nonesuch did a lot of folk music of other cultures under their 
"Explorer" series -- what would be called World Music today, though
that term was many years in the future -- but classical music
was why they were founded.  See the many obituaries for 
Teresa Sterne, the record executive who built the label, which
turn up on Google under "nonesuch records teresa sterne".


#53 of 165 by mcnally on Wed Apr 24 21:03:53 2002:

  re #50:  Wow..  I simply can't imagine dumping Emmylou right after
  "Wrecking Ball."  Not only was it a terrific album but it was a 
  great critical success and has to have been her best seller in years..
  Truly the record industry makes no sense to me..

  Regarding Wilco, I was listening to NPR on the way back from a very
  nice day hike in the Cascades yesterday and they had an interview with
  Jeff Tweedy.  I was struck by a couple of thoughts on the matter..

    a)  If I were a really cynical schemer, the kind who no doubt 
        thrives in the music industry, what could be a better way
        to get lots of free publicity and scads of indie cred for
        an artist I managed than to arrange for them to be dropped
        by the big bad evil oppressive record company and have them
        be picked up by the true-to-artistic-vision risk-taking 
        prestige label, especially when both are exactly the same
        company?

        I actually doubt that the decision was as calculated as all
        that but it does seem to work out well both for Wilco *and*
        for Warner.  Even if this particular instance wasn't planned
        from the get-go, it wouldn't surprise me if someone eventually
        pulls a similar trick, especially if sales of "Yankee Hotel
        Foxtrot" are at all good..

    b)  Either Jeff Tweedy has sinister hypnotic control over record
        critics or he has the best publicist in the music world.
        Every time I read an article or a review about one of his 
        albums it's filled with comparisons that make me want to rush
        out and buy it and every time I actually sit down and listen
        to a Wilco or Uncle Tupelo album I wind up losing interest
        and turning it off before it's even halfway done.  What am I
        missing here?



#54 of 165 by krj on Thu Apr 25 04:12:23 2002:

I can't help with (b); I kinda liked Uncle Tupelo but have never warmed
to Wilco, and after their first collaboration with Billy Bragg I 
gave up completely.   I sort of liked Son Volt better (the other 
descendant band from Uncle Tupelo) but I eventually lost track
of them too.


#55 of 165 by gull on Thu Apr 25 13:45:47 2002:

Re #53: I know what you mean.  The snippets of Wilco's stuff I've heard
remind me a little of Guided By Voices' early albums, but it doesn't
hook me in the same way.


#56 of 165 by polygon on Thu Apr 25 16:02:18 2002:

Too many "Uncle" bands: Uncle Banzai, Uncle Gizmo, Uncle Tupelo ... 
I no longer remember which is which.


#57 of 165 by brighn on Thu Apr 25 17:06:42 2002:

So you're saying Uncle?


#58 of 165 by orinoco on Thu Apr 25 17:20:56 2002:

Uncle Tupelo started out as alt-country and kinda drifted.  The other two,
uh, didn't.  Unless Uncle Gizmo isn't who I think they are, in which case all
bets are off.


#59 of 165 by krj on Thu Apr 25 19:26:17 2002:

resp:56 :: You forgot Bob's Your Uncle, a late-1980s band from Vancouver.


#60 of 165 by mcnally on Thu Apr 25 19:55:15 2002:

  Let's not forget U.N.K.L.E.

  (Actually, doing an All Music Guide search on artist names starting with 
  "uncle" reveals more than fifty results, 90% of whom I've never heard of..)


#61 of 165 by brighn on Thu Apr 25 20:22:02 2002:

Detroit's own Uncle Kracker (Kid Rock's DJ, also has a solo CD)


#62 of 165 by oval on Thu Apr 25 20:57:01 2002:

U.N.K.L.E. IS GOOD.



#63 of 165 by dbratman on Mon Apr 29 18:35:16 2002:

Re Nonesuch, uptopic:

Despite its early interest in world music, Nonesuch was a classical 
label, and in the 60s and 70s it was a prime source for interesting 
stuff out of the mainstream classical labels' lines.  I have warm 
memories of their recordings of early Haydn symphonies by some group 
called "The Little Orchestra of London" - this was long before Antal 
Dorati began his massive project to record them systematically for 
Decca - and for many other things ranging from Telemann suites, through 
Bernard Herrmann's surprisingly graceful version of Raff's Leonore 
Symphony (Nonesuch would indeed touch the heavy symphonic repertoire, 
if it was obscure enough) to Ives's Concord Sonata, not to forget those 
wonderful Morris & Bolcom recordings of late 19th century American 
popular songs.

Nonesuch was not originally a Warner subsidiary.  It was Elektra's 
classical and world music label.  Warner later bought it up and killed 
it off.


#64 of 165 by krj on Tue Apr 30 02:56:57 2002:

Oops, I forgot that Nonesuch was originally Elektra's imprint, and that
Warner didn't always own Elektra.  But Warner got Elektra early in the 
consolidation game -- early 1970s, maybe?  By the time I started paying
attention it was the WEA conglomerate, for Warner-Elektra-Atlantic.


#65 of 165 by dbratman on Thu May 2 00:09:51 2002:

Whenever Warner may have bought Elektra, they didn't start putting 
their name on the Nonesuch albums until about 1980 or so, when they 
redesigned the label and killed off the distinctive, delightfully 
primitivist early Nonesuch cover art, as well as the original logo (the 
decorative lower-case n).


#66 of 165 by krj on Thu May 2 22:17:09 2002:

OK, enough drift.
 
Did anyone run into the US webcast protest/shutdown on May 1?
According to news reports in many online sources,  many US webcasters
shutdown their normal operations: either they were completely silent
or else they ran announcements on how the proposed Internet broadcast
royalties would wipe them out.   The protest generated a lot of 
news coverage, at least, and there have been some suggestions that 
they are getting some traction in Congress with their argument that 
the proposed royalty rates would shut down almost the entire industry,
because the royalty rates are vastly in excess of the commercial 
webcaster's gross revenues, and way above anything hobbyists can 
afford.   Not to mention the problems in complying with the 
planned rule that *every connection* from *every listener*
be reported to the copyright industry.


#67 of 165 by jp2 on Thu May 2 22:20:46 2002:

This response has been erased.



#68 of 165 by krj on Fri May 3 06:08:17 2002:

Lots of noise about digital TV issues, and no clarity at all, 
except a general sense that the copyright industry appears intent
on stealthily imposing absolute, totalitarian control on viewer's
use of television. 

The best summary seems to be the EFF's weblog at 
    http://bpdg.blogs.eff.org/

The Newsbytes imprint of the Washington Post reported a story that 
the copyright industry and the hardware industry had reached agreement
on technology to control user's ability to manipulate digital TV
signals, and the two industries were asking Congress to pass 
legislation enforcing the agreement.  No details were specified.
However, Philips (the electronics firm) seems to be in fairly 
serious disagreement with the alleged consensus.
 
One of the EFF entries discusses the copyright industry's proposal
for forcing technologies and devices off the market if they are 
found, after they have been widely distributed, to be insufficiently
protective of copyright.    
            http://bpdg.blogs.eff.org/archives/000061.html
Also, sending any high quality video to a computer is to be 
strictly forbidden.
 
-----

Meanwhile, Slashdot passes along this one, from the San Jose
Mercury News:

http://www.siliconvalley.com/mld/siliconvalley/3186191.htm
 
In the copyright suit by the TV industry against the Replay TV 4000
digital video recorder, well, I'll just quote it:
 
> A federal magistrate in Los Angeles has ordered SonicBlue to spy 
> on thousands of digital video recorder users -- monitoring every 
> show they record, every commercial they skip and every program they 
> send electronically to a friend.
>
> Central District Court Magistrate Charles F. Eick told SonicBlue to 
> gather ``all available information'' about how consumers use the 
> Santa Clara company's latest generation ReplayTV 4000 video
> recorders, and turn the information over to the film studios and 
> television networks suing it for contributing to copyright 
> infringement.
...
> The plaintiffs asked SonicBlue to turn over information on how 
> individuals use the recording devices. SonicBlue said it does not 
> track that information. The magistrate, who is supervising discovery,
> ordered the company to write software in the next 60 days that 
> would record every ``click'' from every customer's remote control.


#69 of 165 by mcnally on Fri May 3 11:28:26 2002:

  !


#70 of 165 by gull on Fri May 3 12:43:14 2002:

Well, that's it.  I'm definately not buying a PVR.

I think the *worst* thing they could do to digital TV is impose DRM on it. 
Think about it.  One of the big problems HDTV is facing is a lack of
consumer interest.  People just aren't buying into it in large numbers.  If
you start telling people they can't record their favorite shows, they're
going to stay away in droves and it will become the next DIVX, except with a
whole lot more development money down the drain.


#71 of 165 by remmers on Fri May 3 13:42:05 2002:

Yep.


#72 of 165 by dbratman on Sat May 4 00:32:28 2002:

I heard about the webcast protest/shutdown.  Consequently I did not 
attempt to listen to any webcasting that day.

I'm pretty much off listening to web music anyway.  It's most handy 
when I'm doing boring stuff at work, but the boring stuff I'm doing 
eats my processing power, or something, and the web music is constantly 
stopping to rebuffer.  This is particularly true if the boring stuff I 
have to do involves web searching, and yet we've got a huge pipeline 
here.  Thinking of bringing in my CD-Walkman instead.

That SonicBlue item is just stunningly awful.  Insert rant here; and 
yes, I think this is part of the same privacy invasion that's leading 
to useless intrusive security measures.


#73 of 165 by keesan on Sat May 4 15:34:43 2002:

Was this webcasting strike US only?


#74 of 165 by krj on Sat May 4 19:12:01 2002:

Yes, because the proposed copyright royalty only affects US webcasters.
(At least, I have not heard about any proposals to try and levy it 
on, say, the BBC.)
-----

Slashdot has a roundup of a couple of stories.
First, Vivendi Universal is talking about trying to make the upcoming
Eminem CD copy-prevented on all editions worldwide; previous 
copy-prevention efforts have been limited to one geographic region, 
mostly to test consumer response.  Reuters story from May 1 is at:
   http://news.com.com/2100-1023-896391.html

And a followup on the band Wilco and their new album
"Yankee Hotel Foxtrot," which was discussed above in resp:39 for about 
ten responses.  Their old label Reprise cut Wilco loose rather than 
release an album Reprise saw as uncommercial; Wilco also, according 
to an article in The New Republic, made the album available for 
online downloads while they were between record deals:
   http://thenewrepublic.com/doc.mhtml?i=online&s=edlund041502
Anyway, first week sales figures are in, and Reprise looks clueless 
for dumping Wilco, and the band looks like a genius for offering the 
album on the net:
   http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/trib/20020502/lo/wilco_defies_experts_as_fo
xtrot_gallops_1.html
 
In tabular form:
 
          title                     first week sales      billboard chart #
1999   SUMMERTEETH                    19,000                around #80
2002   YANKEE HOTEL FOXTROT           55,573                       #13

First week sales almost three times as great as the previous album, 
despite the tracks having been available for Internet download for weeks
or months.


#75 of 165 by dbratman on Mon May 6 23:23:56 2002:

Possibly relevant screed by Philip Shropshire on Locus, claims that 1) 
file sharing and downloading have only increased since Napster was shut 
down; but 2) free online copies of written fiction have apparently been 
observed to increase sales.

http://www.locusmag.com/2002/Reviews/ShropshireOnEllison.html


#76 of 165 by gull on Tue May 7 13:31:14 2002:

I hope this goes through, but given all the money stacked against it I 
doubt it has a chance.
http://www.wired.com/news/print/0,1294,52298,00.html

WASHINGTON -- Rep. Rick Boucher is finally ready to try and dismantle a 
key part of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act. 

Boucher, a Virginia Democrat, said last July that he wanted to amend 
the DMCA to permit certain "fair uses" of digital content, such as 
backing up an audio CD by bypassing copy protection technology. 

In an interview on Thursday, Boucher said he now has sufficient 
support -- from the tech industry, librarians, and Internet activists --
 to feel comfortable introducing his bill "in the next month." 

"If I had introduced it six months ago, you wouldn't have seen this 
kind of support," said Boucher. 

As soon as it's introduced, Boucher's proposal seems certain to be 
targeted for defeat by content lobbyists including Hollywood, the 
recording industry and the publishing industry. 

Boucher plans to rewrite section 1201 of the DMCA, which says, "No 
person shall circumvent a technological measure that effectively 
controls access to a work protected under this title." 

It doesn't require that the person bypassing the scheme is doing it to 
infringe on someone's copyright. Boucher believes that people should be 
allowed to circumvent technological protection for research, criticism 
or fair use purposes, such as reading an encrypted e-book on another 
computer. 


#77 of 165 by krj on Wed May 8 14:43:59 2002:

Wired points to an excellent Wall Street Journal/MSNBC story on the 
backstage industry maneuvering that led to the music industry's
own download service, MusicNet.

   http://www.msnbc.com/news/748564.asp?0si=-

The story says MusicNet has "roughly 40,000" subscribers.
Its owners are trying to come up with Version 2.


#78 of 165 by keesan on Wed May 8 16:00:48 2002:

In the early days of radio, the record companies tried to prevent the radio
stations from broadcasting their music on the theory that nobody would buy
the records if they could hear them on the radio.  Then they discovered it
was worth their while not to charge, but to PAY, the radio stations to play
their music.  I don't understand how it would not equally benefit CD companies
to let their CDs be webcast.


#79 of 165 by gull on Wed May 8 17:44:40 2002:

It's not about whether they can benefit, it's about whether they can 
wring money out of people for the privilage.  They're not in the 
business of letting people do for free what they might be able to 
charge them for.


#80 of 165 by mcnally on Wed May 8 18:24:42 2002:

  And it's equally about the record companies being able to control
  what gets played..


#81 of 165 by krj on Wed May 8 20:54:32 2002:

This quote from a current Business Week magazine interview with 
Stanford Law professor Lawrence Lessig is directly relevant:

http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/02_19/b3782610.htm

> Q: The current debate over Web radio is a good example. New fees
> that the U.S. copyright office has mandated threaten to put small
> Webcasters out of business.
>
> A: Web radio is a perfect example. In the course of its testimony 
> before the CARP hearings [the Copyright Arbitration Royalty Panel, 
> the government group responsible for setting compulsory license fee 
> for Webcasters] the RIAA argued that higher rates would reduce the 
> number of competitors to four or five big players. That's their model: 
> To wipe out diversity and get back to a place where only a few people 
> control delivery. 

(The article, titled "The Dinosaurs are Taking Over," argues that 
the old-economy giants are moving in to control the Internet and 
squeeze out independent service, independent content, pretty much 
independent everything, and that in this power grab, Congress has 
been the willing servant of the corporate powers.)


#82 of 165 by keesan on Wed May 8 21:25:27 2002:

I was looking for classical music webcasts and many of the stations are no
longer in operation in the US.  Europe still has plenty, then there is Hong
Kong and Chile.  Maybe people will start listening to more 'foreign' music
of other genres and the US music companies will lose business before they
realize what idiots they were.


#83 of 165 by krj on Thu May 9 00:26:47 2002:

Everyone's probably seen this one by now, but I'm putting this in here 
for brighn anyway:

"TV exec says skipping the commercials is THEFT"          :)    :)

http://www.2600.com/news/display.shtml?id=1113

Jamie Kellner, chairman and CEO of Turner Broadcasting, 
had a wide-ranging interview about the TV business in CABLEWORLD 
magazine.  To a query about why digital TV recorders 
such as the Replay 4000 are bad, Kellner responded:

  "Because of the ad skips.... It's theft. 
   Your contract with the network when you get the
   show is you're going to watch the spots. 
   Otherwise you couldn't get the show on an ad-supported basis.
   Any time you skip a commercial or watch the button 
   you're actually stealing the programming."   
        ((I assume he means, "hit the fast-forward button"))

Kellner did allow that there was "a certain amount of tolerance" for
viewers going to the bathroom during commercials.  How thoughtful!

2600 did include a link to the original article, but it has now been
moved into the pay section of inside.com.   I did read enough of the 
original interview, before it was restricted to paying users, to satisfy
myself that Mr. Kellner's views were not being distorted.

http://www.inside.com/product/product.asp?entity=CableWorld&pf_ID=7A2ACA71-
FAAD-41FC-A100-0B8A11C30373

-------

Slashdot pointed to the best followup I have seen:
http://research.yale.edu/lawmeme/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=198
 
   "Top Ten New Copyright Crimes"
which is a Letterman-style list...
   "Number 9: Changing radio stations in the car when a commercial comes on."

-------

Slashdot finds a further followup from "Broadcast and Cable" in which 
Kellner suggests that users should be charged $250 per year for the 
privilege of skipping commercials.

http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=02/05/06/232213
http://www.tvinsite.com/broadcastingcable/index.asp?layout=story&doc_id=84804&display=breakingNews



#84 of 165 by keesan on Thu May 9 01:01:43 2002:

In the Netherlands everyone pays a yearly fee for any radio they own which
is hooked up to cable, and they all get to vote on what programming they want,
and the amount of each type of programming is based on the vote.  At least
for the noncommercial tax-supported stations.  There are pirate stations
broadcasting from ships.  I assume some of the for-pay cable TV stations are
also commercial free, am I wrong?  Requiring that one listen to ads in order
to hear music makes as much sense as requiring college students to play
football or vice versa.


#85 of 165 by senna on Thu May 9 03:07:54 2002:

Big entertainment business has become so insular that skipping commercials
is now THEFT?  I don't recall there being any contract signed for me to watch
broadcast television, so this is news to me.  

Thank you, Ken, for your occasionally alarmist tracking of copyright issues
which brings to my attention very real idiocy, and, in situations like this,
outrageously humorous examples of the effects of frontal lobotomy.


#86 of 165 by mdw on Thu May 9 06:51:34 2002:

For-pay cable channels are generally interuption-free.  They generally
run blurbs for other shows as fillers, which is a form of advertisement.
AMC used to run on the same system, although they now seem to be
evolving away from this.


#87 of 165 by slynne on Thu May 9 12:49:41 2002:

Yeah, I have been bummed to find commercials on AMC. But I guess they 
have to make a buck just like everyone else. 

Personally, I would love to see everyone get a TiVo to skip the 
commercials because that really would make that advertising time less 
valuable which could mean that companies that advertise would look 
elsewhere. This would mean a big loss of revenue for the TV/cable 
networks, unless the "elsewhere" was product placement within the shows 
themselves. It would probably mean that they would have to be forpay 
services. I know that if I had to pay a few bucks for *each* channel I 
got, I wouldnt get very many. But it would be worth it not to have the 
commercials. If a lot of folks get TiVo, it could result in a loss in 
choices as probably some networks would find themselves unable to adapt 
to a new model. It *could* also result in lower quality programming but 
I like to think that it would be the lower quality stuff that would get 
lost if networks go under. 




#88 of 165 by void on Thu May 9 15:26:52 2002:

The entire point of cable in the first place was to be ad-free.


#89 of 165 by remmers on Thu May 9 16:30:54 2002:

Now that AMC does commercials, I don't watch it anymore.  Same
goes for Bravo, with rare exceptions.  Wouldn't wanna be guilty
of stealing.  :)

Re #84:  Yes, I remember that when "pay-TV" (which later evolved
into cable) was first being discussed in the 1950s, one of the
selling points was going be freedom from commercials.  Um...


#90 of 165 by jep on Thu May 9 16:58:09 2002:

re #88: There was cable TV in Houghton, MI in the 1950's because there 
were no locally accessible TV stations there.  The original point of 
cable was sharp reception and greater selection of programming.


#91 of 165 by tpryan on Thu May 9 17:00:49 2002:

        The other end of it is the the local advertiser now has
a harder time than ever of getting their niche market into 
the cable station slots.
        I am sure some nightlife spot in Ann Arbor would love 
to advertise only on Comedy Central's Insomniac.  But no, instead
we get the ComCast self promotion ad instead.  To me, it looks
like ComCast is not interested in the small order business.


#92 of 165 by gull on Thu May 9 19:53:44 2002:

Cable TV started as "community antenna television."  (This is where the 
acronym CATV comes from.)  They'd put an array of single-channel Yagis 
on top of some tall structure, pointed at the various local channels, 
then amplify the signals and feed them out to residents, to avoid the 
visual clutter of every house having its own outdoor TV antenna.  
Obviously that wasn't commercial free since it was just another way to 
get broadcast TV.

Even today most cable systems, as part of the francise agreement, have 
to offer a cheap "basic service" level that mostly just provides area 
broadcast stations.  They rarely advertise that fact and will often 
charge an arm and a leg to install it, but it usually exists.


#93 of 165 by keesan on Fri May 10 01:33:51 2002:

Last I knew the local basic service here was $30/month, hardly cheap.
It had suddenly gone up from $8.


#94 of 165 by ea on Fri May 10 01:46:55 2002:

92 - the acronym CATV has since been modified to be "Community Access 
TV", which may go by other names including Public Access, or Community 
Television.


#95 of 165 by jmsaul on Fri May 10 03:53:17 2002:

Re #88:  I thought the point was to be able to show naked people and use
         naughty words.


#96 of 165 by dbratman on Sun May 12 09:43:34 2002:

Well, there's two origins of cable tv, and they tend to get confused.  
One is the provision of tv to back-country areas that get poor 
broadcast reception, and that's always been commercial, simply because 
it was a feed of broadcast stations.  The other is cable-only channels, 
intended in the first place for urban customers, which came along 
around 1980, and that indeed was originally mostly commercial-free, the 
idea being that subscription fees to cable would pay the cost.  So much 
for that notion.

Kellner's remark about stealing is profoundly disturbing, for several 
reasons.

First, as several people have pointed out, applied to print 
publications it would require that you read all the ads (and various 
corollaries about electronic media suggest that you'd have to start at 
the beginning and read the whole thing, read it only once, and you 
couldn't pass it on to somebody else).  It also suggests you can't flip 
stations during commercials, either.

Second, it flies in the face of the whole basis of advertising, in 
which the best ads are designed to actually attract attention and not 
just lecture to a captive audience, and more than that, in which ad 
rates are set with the specific understanding that there won't be 100% 
feed-through.

Thirdly, if you can be required to watch the ads, you can also be 
required to buy the wonderful products being pitched.


#97 of 165 by gull on Tue May 14 15:01:37 2002:

A couple interesting tidbits about copy-protected CDs, from The Register:
http://www.theregus.com/content/54/24940.html

First, it turns out some CD copy protection schemes can be defeated with
electrical tape or a Sharpie marker.  The idea is to cover up enough of
the outer, intentionally corrupt track that the computer will ignore it.

Secondly, a new copy-protected CD release apparently does nasty things
to the flat-screen iMacs.  Not only does it fail to play, it locks up
the computer and prevents it from rebooting properly as long as it's in
the drive.  (iMacs, you'll recall, will try to boot off CDs.)  It also
locks the CD tray, keeping you from remedying the situation by removing
the disc again.  I'm sure this wasn't intentional, but it's an example
of what can happen when you start putting out intentionally non-standard
discs.


#98 of 165 by gull on Tue May 14 15:07:51 2002:

Here's Apple's page about the problem:

http://kbase.info.apple.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects/kbase.woa/wa/query?searchMod
e=Ass
isted&type=id&val=KC.106882

They suggest several ways to try getting the disc out, but admit you may
have to take the machine in for service if it's a model that has no
manual eject hole.  They seem to be taking a pretty hard-line stance on
these discs:

"CD audio discs that incorporate copyright protection technologies do
not adhere to published Compact Disc standards. Apple designs its CD
drives to support media that conforms to such standards. Apple computers
are not designed to support copyright protected media that do not
conform to such standards. Therefore, any attempt to use non standard
discs with Apple CD drives will be considered a misapplication of the
product. Under the terms of Apple's One-Year Limited Warranty, AppleCare
Protection Plan, or other AppleCare agreement any misapplication of the
product is excluded from Apple's repair coverage. Because the Apple
product is functioning correctly according to its design specifications,
any fee assessed by an Apple Authorized Service Provider or Apple for
repair service will not be Apple's responsibility."

Think there's the possibility of a class-action lawsuit against Sony
from people who have to pay Apple to have these discs extracted from
their systems?


#99 of 165 by jmsaul on Tue May 14 15:12:07 2002:

I'd hope so.  The rumor is that putting a disc in actually damages the
firmware somehow, though I don't know how that's possible.


#100 of 165 by gull on Tue May 14 15:26:52 2002:

I doubt it's that.  It sounds to me like it just confuses everything enough
that the drive can't eject the disc.  I've heard of places having to strip
down iMacs and physically remove the disc by hand, but I haven't heard
anything about having to replace or reprogram the drives yet.


#101 of 165 by dbratman on Tue May 14 16:53:18 2002:

I applaud Apple's very hard-nosed, snotty response to the "nonstandard" 
copy-protected CDs, but I have to say that the problem equally lies in 
the Mac's equally bizarre and non-standard way of ejecting disks.


#102 of 165 by krj on Tue May 14 16:59:08 2002:

((One of the copy-prevention systems was rumored to screw up a 
  Windows PC to the point where the CD-R driver software had to be 
  reinstalled, but I cannot remember the details.))          

((Not having an emergency manual eject is a really, really dumb 
  design decision, for reasons that should now be obvious...))
 
It's been suggested by someone I won't name (in case it's a really
stupid idea) that copy-prevented CDs which crash computers could 
legally be equivalent to a malicious computer virus, and that there 
could be liability under the Michigan law which was used to prosecute
the M-net vandal of two summers back.   Hmm, should we draft a note
to the Attorney General?


#103 of 165 by other on Tue May 14 18:12:57 2002:

Not that it takes much to force system software to have to be reinstalled 
on a windows machine anyway...


#104 of 165 by mdw on Wed May 15 05:11:45 2002:

I'd have to say that a cd-player that can't eject a cd that adheres to
the physical standards for a cd is defective, or at least, has a faulty
design.  The manual eject button should only be necessary in cases where
it's no longer possible to safely apply power to the drive (ie, the
computer power supply is dead, the cd drive has somehow shorted ouet,
etc.) If the computer crashes because of the defective cd, then I'd say
the computer has other software or perhaps OS driver issues.


#105 of 165 by krj on Wed May 15 12:14:03 2002:

Wired and Cnet report that Napster Inc. took another step closer to the 
corporate graveyard on Tuesday:
 
http://www.wired.com/news/business/0,1367,52532,00.html
 
The Napster corporate board of directors is torn by a bitter feud
between John Fanning, the uncle of program author Shawn Fanning, 
who provided the earliest funding, and representatives of the 
venture capitalist firm who provided the second round of Napster's
funding.  The Napster CEO Konrad Hilbers, who unofficially represents
Napster's third funder, the Bertelsmann conglomerate (BMG), quit
on Tuesday because the board would not approve selling Napster 
outright to Bertelsmann.
 
Bertelsmann had the foresight to make its $85 million investment in
Napster in the form of a loan; this means that in the looming bankruptcy,
Bertelsmann  is probably in the driver's seat and gets any Napster assets 
it wants anyway.
 
Napster's employees have been given two choices: quit immediately and 
get severance pay, or else take unpaid leave for a week while the 
company desperately searches for another buyer.   The company is just
about out of operating funds.


#106 of 165 by krj on Thu May 16 04:32:44 2002:

Wired thinks Napster is finished and runs an obituary written 
by Brad King, their Internet music correspondent:
 
http://www.wired.com/news/mp3/0,1285,52540,00.html
 
-----
 
The Kazaa music sharing operation has been suggesting that 
ISPs should pay a fee-per-user to the copyright industry, since
the ISPs are making money selling high-speed connections to 
users who want to swap files.   There's a tweak to the proposal
suggesting that the money should go directly to artists, with
nothing for the record company, and today's story in USA Today, 
referenced via Slashdot, says that Verizon is now supporting 
the idea.
 
http://slashdot.org/articles/02/05/14/232237.shtml?tid=141


#107 of 165 by gull on Thu May 16 13:17:02 2002:

Can't say I like that idea much.  I have high-speed access, but I don't use
it to pirate music.  Why should I be charged a fine just because they
*assume* I'm breaking the law?


#108 of 165 by krj on Thu May 16 14:18:42 2002:

www.fatchucks.com points to a huge parade of Napster obituary stories.
I'll single out this one from the Boston Globe for a few quotes:
 
http://www.boston.com/dailyglobe2/136/business/The_legacy_of_Napster+.shtml
 
> 'Napster was absolutely a groundbreaking technology that changed the way
> consumers listened to music, discovered music, and interacted with music,'' 
> said Stacey Herron, an entertainment and media analyst with Jupiter 
> Research in New York. ''Napster so fundamentally changed the way people 
> interacted with music that there's no turning back.'' 

Matt Bailey, of Redshift Research, a "consulting firm that covers the 
digital entertainment industry:"

> ''If you take the three top free file-sharing 
> systems together - Kazaa, IMesh and
> Gnutella - they had an average of 2.15 million 
> users logged on at any given time in
> April,'' Bailey said. ''In February of last year, 
> when Napster was at its peak, there
> were only 1.57 million simultaneous users on the system.''

-----

Also via fatchucks.com:  Sony is trying to use the Scour technology to 
whip up a little P2P enthusiasm for a limited number of artists.
The songs can only be played for 30 days, and only if you are a 
registered user:

http://news.com.com/2100-1023-913534.html?tag=fd_top

There's a really mean review of this "service" at:
 
http://www.slyck.com/newsmay2002/051502a.html


#109 of 165 by krj on Mon May 20 04:14:07 2002:

Many stories report that Bertelsmann finally gets Napster.
Bertelsmann pays $8 million to Napster's creditors in what one 
article described as a "prepackaged bankruptcy filing."
This maneuver is also supposed to wipe out the potential billions
in liability for any past copyright violations. 

(Bertelsmann had offered $20 million to buy Napster in February, 
an offer the board rejected.  In the new deal the shareholders get
nothing, so I imagine the shareholders will be quite displeased with 
the board for failing to sell when the investors could have recovered
something.)
 
In personnel terms; Shawn Fanning's uncle John, who tried to eject other
members of the Napster board, is now off the board himself; Shawn Fanning 
is back on the team, as is BMG's man chief exec Konrad Hilbers; and 
in general it seems like the goal is to reassemble the Napster staff
to the way it was prior to last week's meltdown.


#110 of 165 by krj on Wed May 22 18:09:05 2002:

Reported everywhere:  The new webcast royalty rate proposed by the 
CARP panel has been turned down by the Librarian of Congress, who 
for some obscure DMCA reason has the final say on setting the rate.
No news on what happens next for a month.


#111 of 165 by krj on Wed May 22 20:25:31 2002:

Cnet reports that the music industry is about ready to win two of its
cases against P2P firms by draining their resources before trial:
 
http://news.com.com/2100-1023-920557.html
"Kazaa, Morpheus legal case collapsing"

The original Kazaa BV corporation in the Netherlands has asked for 
"terms of surrender," having sold the Kazaa network to the somewhat
mysterious Sharman Networks, based on a Pacific island.  The RIAA 
accuses them of playing a shell game to move the P2P technology 
assets to a new corporate home.
 
Streamcast Networks, the US operation under the Morpheus name, 
has run out of money to pay its lawyer, who has left the case.


#112 of 165 by dbratman on Wed May 22 23:29:32 2002:

Dreaming about what I'd do if I were Librarian of Congress ...

Make Nicholson Baker pay all the royalties?


#113 of 165 by polygon on Thu May 23 02:07:38 2002:

Plaintiff's briefs have been filed in Eldred v. Ashcroft.  The list
of supporting amici is just dazzling.  See full details at the new
web site: http://eldred.cc


#114 of 165 by polygon on Thu May 23 02:10:20 2002:

Re 110,112: The Librarian of Congress is the deus ex machina of this
whole story.  I had no idea that the Librarian had this kind of power.


#115 of 165 by jmsaul on Thu May 23 02:45:06 2002:

Isn't the Librarian also the Registrar of Copyrights, or something like that?


#116 of 165 by jp2 on Thu May 23 03:00:28 2002:

This response has been erased.



#117 of 165 by remmers on Thu May 23 10:50:28 2002:

(Side note:  The Librarian of Congress, James Billington, was a
history professor of mine back in my undergraduate days.)


#118 of 165 by gull on Fri May 24 14:05:31 2002:

The Register has an article about the Librarian of Congress decision here:
http://www.theregus.com/content/6/25006.html
It doesn't really include much that hasn't already been reported here,
but they do have this interesting quote from Jamie Zawinski that sort of
points out why this system isn't a good deal for artists anyway:

"...regardless of what music you were playing, they take your money,
keep most of it for themselves, and then divide the rest statistically
based on the Billboard charts. That means that no matter what kind of
obscure, underground music you played, 3/4ths of the extortion money you
paid goes to whichever company owns N'Sync; and the rest goes to Michael
Jackson (since he owns The Beatles' catalog); and all other artists
(including the ones whose music you actually played) get nothing." 

Jamie has an interesting article on the hoops you have to jump through
to webcast legally.  Even without the RIAA royalties the rules are a lot
stricter than they are for radio stations:
http://www.dnalounge.com/backstage/webcasting.html
For example, to qualify for a compulsory license, webcasters can't
announce songs ahead of time, play more than four songs by the same
artist in a three-hour period, or play more than two consecutive tracks
from the same album.


#119 of 165 by krj on Fri May 24 16:03:27 2002:

Cory Doctorow of the EFF wrote a good summary of the proposal to put
tight controls on all analog->digital conversion equipment, such as 
soundcards and digital camcorders, and Slashdot 
used that to prompt a roundup of the Broadcast Protection Discussion
Group.  The goal is to make it impossible for anyone, anywhere, to make
a digital copy of "watermarked" video or audio through analog inputs.
The BPDG's work will be about as restrictive as Sen. Holling's
CBDTPA/SSSCA proposal, but it's being sent in under the political 
radar as a minor technical thing.   Slashdot also provides a link
to a US Senate page on the subject.

http://bpdg.blogs.eff.org/archives/000113.html
http://slashdot.org/articles/02/05/23/2355237.shtml?tid=97


#120 of 165 by krj on Fri May 24 16:12:17 2002:

And a couple via the fatchucks.com clipping service:
 
Vivendi Universal is offering an MP3 file for sale, for a buck:
a song by Meshell Ndegeocello (and I don't think ZDnet spelled her 
name right).  This is reported as possibly the first time that a major 
label has offered a plain vanilla unrestricted MP3 file for sale.
http://news.zdnet.co.uk/story/0,,t269-s2110831,00.html

The record companies call for a federal probe of radio payola 
issues, and for "a sweeping government review of radio industry
consolidation."  Clear Channel responds that there is no payola, 
and their grab in the industry "often has led to a more diverse array
of formats in a single market."

http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/05/23/radio.payola.reut/index.html


#121 of 165 by jp2 on Fri May 24 23:38:43 2002:

This response has been erased.



#122 of 165 by krj on Fri May 31 19:28:11 2002:

A Detroit Free Press writer reviews the two satellite radio services,
XM and Sirius.   In contrast to what terrestrial radio has become, 
both satellite services are angling for serious music fans looking 
for both diversity and depth in their radio programming.
The reviewer is positive about both services and says the choice 
between them will be largely a matter of personal taste.
 
http://freep.com/money/tech/newman30_20020530.htm


#123 of 165 by other on Fri May 31 20:30:07 2002:

...until they edge out terrestrial service the way cable tv has then start
selling ads, and then start pushing crap...


#124 of 165 by mrmat on Sat Jun 1 16:42:52 2002:

right on.


#125 of 165 by gull on Sat Jun 1 17:18:10 2002:

Either that or they'll go out of business, and all the early-adopters will
be stuck with expensive paperweights.


#126 of 165 by mcnally on Sat Jun 1 17:46:52 2002:

  My money's on the latter..


#127 of 165 by jmsaul on Sat Jun 1 18:33:25 2002:

Same here.


#128 of 165 by gull on Sat Jun 1 22:51:32 2002:

Me too...even if they don't *both* go out of business, I really think
there's probably only room for *one* satellite radio company in the market. 
It's sort of another VHS vs. Beta fight.  I'd feel better about it if there
were some kind of standard, but these are both proprietary systems, so
you're locking yourself in to one service or the other when you buy a radio.

Personally, if I listened to the talk channels I'd miss hearing local news. 
And if I want to listen to a specific type of music, I have an MP3-CD
player.


#129 of 165 by senna on Sun Jun 2 17:36:29 2002:

I think they're good ideas, and I think at least one of them will succeed.
Back when they first came out, I read something about a receiver that would
take both services, and I told myself I'd wait until that came out before I
thought about buying into the service.  I'm still pondering it.



#130 of 165 by orinoco on Sun Jun 2 19:20:34 2002:

I think if they fail, it will be because everyone expects them to fail, and
we're all waiting for all our neighbors to buy them first.  


#131 of 165 by bdh3 on Mon Jun 3 07:08:17 2002:

Both are doomed.  The moment it becomes a significant market there
are a number of players ready to move into that segment that already
have significant infrastructure in place to deliver such as service
in addition to what they already deliver.  For example, you already
have 'web enabled' cellphones, it wouldn't be too difficult to
offer 'music enabled' as well, indeed I'm surprised it hasn't
happened already.


#132 of 165 by dbratman on Mon Jun 3 20:32:58 2002:

Listening to music on a cell-phone would be the utter triumph of low-fi.


#133 of 165 by orinoco on Mon Jun 3 21:23:32 2002:

The low speaker volume would be a bigger problem.  Bad sound quality's never
stopped people from listening to radio before.


#134 of 165 by scott on Mon Jun 3 23:27:58 2002:

Two (or is it three?) words:  "Headphone jack".


#135 of 165 by orinoco on Tue Jun 4 07:32:32 2002:

D'oh.  Of course.


#136 of 165 by bdh3 on Tue Jun 4 08:00:12 2002:

Exactly. 


#137 of 165 by dbratman on Tue Jun 4 20:00:44 2002:

Orinoco wrote: "Bad sound quality's never stopped people from listening 
to radio before."

Yet more proof that I do not exist, I guess.


#138 of 165 by krj on Wed Jun 5 13:37:26 2002:

USA Today has an overview article on the struggles between the 
music business and music fans.    File sharing only gets a small 
piece of the story.
 
http://www.usatoday.com/life/music/2002/2002-06-05-cover-music-industry.htm


#139 of 165 by jaklumen on Thu Jun 6 09:48:26 2002:

Based on previous discussion, it sounds like the 1980s all over again, 
with a contemporary twist.  We're getting heavy into one-hit wonders 
again.


#140 of 165 by krj on Sat Jun 8 16:54:32 2002:

Via Slashdot:
http://www.newyorkmag.com/page.cfm?page_id=6099
 
The essay by Michael Wolff argues that the music business of the future
is going to look a lot more like the book business -- much less 
significant to the mass culture, and much, much less profitable.
He suggests that rock and roll, which powered the growth of the 
music biz in the 1960s and 1970s, is spent as a cultural force, 
with nothing of equal impact to replace it.

He also sees two ways that the Internet has sandbagged the industry:
besides the file sharing and copying issue, there is the problem that
the Internet has encouraged tastes to splinter into thousands of 
musical subcategories.  This makes it much harder for the major music 
corporations to come up with the megahits which power their profits;
it also means industry costs are way out line with the sales that 
can be expected for most discs, and they need to be drastically pruned.
Translation: lots and lots of layoffs in the music business.

In talking to music business people, Wolff reports that a grim fatalism 
is setting in.

Recommended essay.


#141 of 165 by jmsaul on Sat Jun 8 18:05:09 2002:

Good riddance to them, as fas as I'm concerned.


#142 of 165 by krj on Sun Jun 9 05:28:55 2002:

found it!  The New York Magazine article referred to a Wall Street Journal
item; usually the WSJ stuff is not freely available, but this story
was made available as a cautionary tale for children...  :)
 
http://www.wsjclassroomedition.com/0502_mdia.htm

                  MCA Records spent about two
                  years preparing Carly
                  Hennessy for pop stardom,
                  and about $2.2 million to
                  make and market the
                  18-year-old singer's first pop
                  album, "Ultimate High."

                  But since "Ultimate High" was
                  released in stores nationwide
                  a few months ago, it has sold
                  only 378 copies-amounting to
                  about $4,900 at its suggested
                  retail price. ...

Wonderful story!


#143 of 165 by jp2 on Sun Jun 9 05:31:48 2002:

This response has been erased.



#144 of 165 by jmsaul on Sun Jun 9 14:23:21 2002:

#142 brings a tear to my eye.  I'm proud of the American public.


#145 of 165 by aruba on Sun Jun 9 14:50:43 2002:

I think musical tastes were well on the way to slintersville before the net
became something a lot of people used.


#146 of 165 by scott on Sun Jun 9 17:14:23 2002:

Great interview/article about David Bowie in today's NYT:
"The absolute transformation of everything that we ever thought about music
will take place within 10 years, and nothing is going to be able to stop it.
I see absolutely no point in pretending that it's not going to happen. I'm
fully confident that copyright, for instance, will no longer exist in 10
years, and authorship and intellectual property is in for such a bashing."

 "Music itself is going to become like running water or electricity," he
added. "So it's like, just take advantage of these last few years because none
of this is ever going to happen again. You'd better be prepared for doing a
lot of touring because that's really the only unique situation that's going
to be left. It's terribly exciting. But on the other hand it doesn't matter
if you think it's exciting or not; it's what's going to happen."


http://www.nytimes.com/2002/06/09/arts/music/09PARE.html?todaysheadlines

Sounds like (as usual) Bowie has been thinking a few years ahead of most
people in the music business.


#147 of 165 by bru on Sun Jun 9 21:13:56 2002:

who is carly hennessy?


#148 of 165 by scott on Sun Jun 9 22:04:06 2002:

Carly Hennessy was given as an example in one of the articles Ken posted
yesterday.


#149 of 165 by oval on Mon Jun 10 03:18:16 2002:

it's great to see people so optimistic. i can't wait, if they're right.



#150 of 165 by russ on Mon Jun 10 11:48:20 2002:

Re #147:  That's *exactly* what I'd like everyone to ask about all
the acts which the RIAA tries to manufacture via their hype machine.

If I hadn't seen N'Sync plugged on T-shirts and sniped at by Foxtrot,
I might still be ignorant of them.  The nice thing about such creations
of hype machines is that if everyone stops paying attention to them
they soon cease to exist.


#151 of 165 by dbratman on Mon Jun 10 18:14:33 2002:

And a good thing, too, that musical tastes are splintering.  Whenever I 
see a movie set, say, in the 1950s, it's always filled with the pop 
music of that era, and I think, "If I'd lived back then, I would have 
had to hear that crap all the time _whether I wanted to or not_."  (I'm 
thinking to myself, I'm entitled to call it crap.)

Of course, nowadays I have to hear hip-hop whether I want to or not, 
usually while I'm waiting at red lights in traffic, but at least I 
don't have to hear too much of it.



#152 of 165 by oval on Mon Jun 10 21:42:37 2002:

i'll happily take hip-hop over shit-pop.



#153 of 165 by flem on Tue Jun 11 14:20:38 2002:

Dunno if this is the right item, but I read yesterday that some ReplayTV
users are suing Turner for saying that skipping the commercials is theft. 
I could probably find the URL if I tried.  


#154 of 165 by jazz on Tue Jun 11 20:01:50 2002:

        It's not theft;  you're not taking something that Turner's not giving
away for free.  At worst, it's a breach of an unspoken contract.


#155 of 165 by tpryan on Fri Jun 14 23:51:08 2002:

        It's the defamation of character the Turner is doing, to call
it's veiwers "Theives".


#156 of 165 by scott on Sat Jun 15 03:26:32 2002:

"In a continuing effort to maintain their image as evil incarnate" is how a
slashdot item on record company consideration of attempting to charge
royalties on sales of used CDs.  The referenced article can be found at:
http://www.sduniontribune.com/news/business/20020614-9999_1b14usedcds.html


#157 of 165 by gull on Sat Jun 15 20:09:56 2002:

Re #146: France tried eliminating copyright, after the French revolution.
It resulted in a major reduction in the amount of creative works
produced there. I'd hope we won't make the same mistake.


#158 of 165 by other on Sun Jun 16 05:30:28 2002:

might lead to an overall improvement in the quality of the works actually 
produced...


#159 of 165 by gull on Mon Jun 17 13:27:13 2002:

I'd expect a decrease in quality, personally.  It's the people who are good
at what they do who have the most to lose.


#160 of 165 by mcnally on Mon Jun 17 23:21:48 2002:

  re #157:  I've never heard that before.  Do you know whether other factors
  (such as the loss of aristocratic patronage) were accounted for?


#161 of 165 by gull on Tue Jun 18 12:33:04 2002:

I don't know.  I did find this reference with a web search, though it
appears to be a college student's paper:

http://216.239.35.100/search?q=cache:UnEL9Hlq8KwC:skipper.gseis.ucla.edu/st
udents/dwalker/html/projects/documents/IS-200_Heirs_of_the_Enlightenment.rtf+fr
ench+revolution+intellectual+property&hl=en&ie=UTF8

Sorry for the long URL, it's a Google-converted HTML version of a Rich Text
document.


"In freeing the presses, it appears that the National Assembly intended to
break the monopolistic hold of the book guilds, allowing the great literary
works of the Enlightenment to be printed and circulated freely, as well as
allowing new works to be published without censorship.  The result, however,
was far different.  Having essentially dissolved all copyright, pirating of
new and older works became widespread.  Although slanderous and libelous
pamphlets circulated widely, the publication of books came to a virtual halt
as both authors and publishers found that rampant pirating made the
publishing of books economically unfeasible.  Rather than foster creativity,
the freedom of the presses stifled creativity."


#162 of 165 by dbratman on Wed Jun 19 21:36:03 2002:

Not that it proves anything, but French music had been in kind of the 
doldrums anyway through the later 18th century, and produced few 
masterpieces after Rameau's death in 1764 until Hector Berlioz came 
roaring in after the Restoration, in the late 1820s.


#163 of 165 by krj on Fri Jun 21 03:02:39 2002:

Slashdot points to a bunch of stuff about the Librarian of Congress'
decision on webcasting royalty rates and record keeping requirements.

The short version is that the proposed rates were cut in half
-- the 50% discount for on-air radio broadcasters was eliminated, 
setting the rate at $0.0007 per listener per song.  Mainstream 
media calls this a win for webcasters; Internet media says that 
half of vastly-more-than-total-revenues is still more than total 
revenues, and most independent webcasters in the USA are finished.  
 
To make things worse, everyone who has webcasted has to pay a bill 
for the four previous years' royalties, at this rate, and it's due 
this October.  Many independent and student stations are expected
to be bankrupted.

Slashdot readers report that some online webcasters have already 
started to shut down.  A few sympathetic congressmen are making 
noises.  The RIAA is complaining that the rate set by the Librarian
of Congress is too low.


#164 of 165 by jmsaul on Fri Jun 21 04:40:31 2002:

Wait for legislation on this one, if enough congresspeople get pulled in. 
This isnt a final resolution by any means, and Congress has been looking
increasingly suspicious of the RIAA lately.


#165 of 165 by krj on Sat Jun 22 20:04:37 2002:

  ((Metadiscussion:  the "Napster" items are linked between Music 
    conference and each season's Agora.  The Agora conference has now
    rolled over to Summer; I'll start The Eleventh Napster Item in 
    a couple of days, so other folks have a chance to get things in 
    Agora first;  sooner if there is any big news.))


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