Grex Agora47 Conference

Item 27: BANNED BOOKS WEEK - 20 to 27 September 2003

Entered by rcurl on Thu Sep 25 19:18:39 2003:

September 20 to 27 is Banned Books Week, and the ACLU is calling attention
to the wealth of creative expression that is stifled when books can be
forbidden from library shelves. 

For example, which of these books was among the 10 Most Challenged Books
of 2002: 

-- The "Harry Potter" series by J.K. Rowling?

-- "I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings" by Maya Angelou?  Or,

-- "The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn" by Mark Twain?

Give up?  Take the ACLU's online quiz to find out: 
http://www.aclu.org/FreeSpeech/FreeSpeech.cfm?ID=13757&c=83&MX=959&H=0

The ACLU is also using this Banned Books Week to raise awareness of the
other ways freedom is being compromised in America's libraries.  The ACLU
has been in court fighting the government's attempts to force public
libraries to use Internet blocking software.  And we are working overturn
Section 215 of the USA PATRIOT Act, which gives the FBI license to snoop
in a person's library records. 

The ACLU encourages Americans to mark Banned Books Week by telling their
elected officials to preserve our right to privacy and keep censorship out
of our libraries. 

For more information, see the ACLU's feature page on Banned Books Week at
http://www.aclu.org/FreeSpeech/FreeSpeech.cfm?ID=13668&c=83&MX=959&H=0

50 responses total.

#1 of 50 by cross on Thu Sep 25 19:54:35 2003:

This response has been erased.



#2 of 50 by gelinas on Thu Sep 25 21:45:03 2003:

I'd guess all three. 

Now I'll go take the quiz.


#3 of 50 by rcurl on Thu Sep 25 21:51:57 2003:

It was a trick question - they all were. 

There is more about Banned Book Week at the website of the American Library
Association - http://www.ala.org.


#4 of 50 by dah on Fri Sep 26 00:52:25 2003:

I'm reading Ulysses.


#5 of 50 by willcome on Thu Nov 27 07:37:04 2003:

AHAHA< FAG!

whore.


#6 of 50 by gull on Fri Nov 28 15:11:56 2003:

Freak.


#7 of 50 by md on Mon Dec 1 03:01:13 2003:

Maybe they've changed the web site since Rane entered #0, but it 
isn't "the 10 Most Challenged Books of 2002," it's "20 of the Most 
Frequently Challenged Books of 1990-2000."  Also, it isn't a "quiz" at 
all.  You're instructed to "Check the box next to every book you've 
read to find out if you're a rebellious reader."  The 20 books are: 

Harry Potter series by J.K. Rowling
I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings by Maya Angelou 
The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn by Mark Twain 
The Handmaid's Tale by Margaret Atwood 
To Kill a Mockingbird by Harper Lee 
James and the Giant Peach by Roald Dahl 
Native Son by Richard Wright 
Are You There, God? It's Me, Margaret by Judy Blume 
The Bluest Eye by Toni Morrison 
The Chocolate War by Robert Cormier 
A Wrinkle in Time by Madeleine L'Engle 
The Pigman by Paul Zindel 
Brave New World by Aldous Huxley 
The Dead Zone by Stephen King 
A Light in the Attic by Shel Silverstein 
Flowers for Algernon by Daniel Keyes 
Where's Waldo? by Martin Hanford 
Summer of My German Soldier by Bette Greene 
Pillars of the Earth by Ken Follett 
Lord of the Flies by William Golding 

Except for one major classic and a couple of minor ones, the quality of 
the books on the list isn't very high, nor is any of them 
especially "rebellious."  It's the sort of list a cynical politician 
would put together to appeal to what he insultingly imagines to 
be "average" people.  It says more about the cretins that banned them 
instead of Thoreau ("Break the law!") and Whitman ("Resist much, obey 
little!") than it does about the books themselves.  You actually 
*could* ban most of them and the culture wouldn't even blink.  The ACLU 
is like my cable company: I keep saying, as soon as an alternative 
comes along...


#8 of 50 by mcnally on Mon Dec 1 03:36:24 2003:

  I presume "Where's Waldo?" was included as a joke..


#9 of 50 by mary on Mon Dec 1 03:41:23 2003:

Nope.  It's because in the beach scene there is a lady
going topless.  Her nipples are about the size of an
ant's footprint.  But, as we all know, size isn't 
everything.


#10 of 50 by mcnally on Mon Dec 1 03:53:57 2003:

  <gasp>  Nipples?

  Won't somebody PLEASE think of the children?
  Where's my Congressman?


#11 of 50 by aruba on Mon Dec 1 04:43:24 2003:

There are some scenes in Where's Waldo of people apparently stoned on
Marijuana, too.


#12 of 50 by other on Mon Dec 1 05:33:01 2003:

How's that?


#13 of 50 by tpryan on Mon Dec 1 06:47:28 2003:

        No they went to the crease and sniffed the binder glue.

        I take it they were banned near the time of their 
initial publication, instead of all being challenged today.


#14 of 50 by bru on Mon Dec 1 14:53:20 2003:

I have some Idea why some of the books are controversial, but some make no
sense to me at all.  Mean, Flowers for Algernon?  What in there is
controversial?   Oh!  now I remember.


#15 of 50 by remmers on Mon Dec 1 15:06:02 2003:

I suspect that the people who try to ban these books don't read
very widely, and certainly don't read the classics.  If they did
they'd be trying to ban a lot of other stuff, such as Plato.
I mean, all that stuff about the pleasures of homosexual love.
Can't have the kids being exposed to that!


#16 of 50 by rcurl on Mon Dec 1 15:27:51 2003:

I think very few even read the books - someone else did and reported
something (in their opinion) nasty. So the banning bandwagon runs on
largely on hearsay. This gets reported now and then, especially when
some bigwig is the spokesperson - when asked, they admit they haven't
read the books but lots of people had told them....etc.


#17 of 50 by gull on Mon Dec 1 15:29:36 2003:

My dad is a school librarian, and he's had people ask him to remove the
Harry Potter books before.  He always offers to let them borrow a copy and
read it for themselves, but everyone has turned him down.  Generally they're
going on what they've heard second- or third-hand, or on their church's
party line.  One guy brought in a copy of an Onion article about the dangers
of Harry Potter that had been emailed to him; he didn't realize it was
satire, apparently.


#18 of 50 by rcurl on Mon Dec 1 16:06:34 2003:

(Was that explained to the visitor, and did he understand, and admit he
was embarrassed?)


#19 of 50 by mynxcat on Mon Dec 1 17:24:11 2003:

Why were James and Giant Peach and Are you there God, It's me Margaret 
on the list?

I haven't read James... but it seemed harmless enough. And I read the 
Judy Blume book when I was 10. Nothing controversial, unless the whole 
concept of a pubescent girl dealing with her first period was too 
controversial for the banners.


#20 of 50 by jep on Mon Dec 1 17:40:26 2003:

Of course he didn't admit he was wrong or misinformed.  That would be 
about as likely in that situation as someone doing so in a discussion 
on Grex.


#21 of 50 by gull on Mon Dec 1 17:49:46 2003:

Re #18: Yes, I think so.  Well, I don't know if he admitted he was
embarassed, but as far as I know he stopped pestering my dad about
removing the book.


#22 of 50 by happyboy on Mon Dec 1 19:44:23 2003:

ask him to ban the bible because of all the dirty sex and
violence in it.


#23 of 50 by mcnally on Mon Dec 1 20:29:26 2003:

  Whenever I find material at the library to be offensive, I prefer to
  insist that it be bowdlerized.


#24 of 50 by other on Mon Dec 1 23:00:16 2003:

Whenever I encounter people demanding that books be banned from 
libraries because of objectionable content, I prefer to insist that 
such individuals and any existing progeny they may have be 
sterilized in order to prevent the spread of their disease of 
ignorance.


#25 of 50 by mcnally on Tue Dec 2 02:56:13 2003:

  Since they're almost always objecting to the content based on their
  assumption of its likely effect on their offspring, I would expect
  such a policy to be, errr.. fruitless.


#26 of 50 by bhoward on Tue Dec 2 03:13:32 2003:

(groan)


#27 of 50 by willcome on Tue Dec 2 07:48:02 2003:

Is it OK to object to books being allowed in libraries if it's based on size?
See, there're certain editions of certain books which're made humoungous and
I voted against them being in my Local Library, did I do wrong.


#28 of 50 by aruba on Tue Dec 2 14:23:46 2003:

Re Where's Waldo: It's been many years since I looked at the book, but I
remember one page that was "The Sixties", or something like that.  It had a
area with hippies, and they seemed to be smoking weed and acting strangely.

But, I could be remembering it all wrong.  If anyone has a copy of the book,
please correct me.


#29 of 50 by rcurl on Tue Dec 2 16:53:07 2003:

Re #27: most libraries have a section of "oversize books". They aren't in
any subject order, of course, but can be located via a catalog.  Did you
object to your library holding oversize books per se, or just an oversize
edition of a book that was already in the library? I would not think the
latter involves book-banning - especially if the book would still be
available via ILL.



#30 of 50 by jiffer on Tue Dec 2 21:26:04 2003:

I say we get all the ignant peoples together, force them to read the 
books, and discuss. I don't find anything objectionable in the list.  
Then again, my parents went out of their way to ensure that we read 
books on the banned lists. 


#31 of 50 by willcome on Tue Dec 2 21:43:14 2003:

29: nononno.  The books I'm talking about are several storeys tall.


#32 of 50 by rcurl on Tue Dec 2 21:46:47 2003:

Many books have lots of stories, and some are tall. But how tall are the
books?


#33 of 50 by willcome on Tue Dec 2 21:48:00 2003:

They're nearly as tall as the building.


#34 of 50 by tpryan on Tue Dec 2 22:31:02 2003:

        Do you know how many books perished in The World Trade Center?


#35 of 50 by gull on Wed Dec 3 14:55:50 2003:

They say it was burning paper that created the heat that weakened the
towers enough to collapse.  So those books are TERRORISTS.


#36 of 50 by bhoward on Wed Dec 3 14:58:51 2003:

Hmm.  The "they" I read, said it was a combination of the fuel and poor
insulation (possibly the asbestos or whatever was used had flaked off
or been shaken off by the force of the collisions).


#37 of 50 by edina on Wed Dec 3 15:15:42 2003:

A close friend is a manager at George Washington University's Eccles library,
and they had a display on banned books.  What was interesting is that the
books had been banned in public elementary and secondary schools.  This
brought about the question as to whether these books had been banned in any
colleges/universities.  Anybody know?


#38 of 50 by gull on Wed Dec 3 15:17:13 2003:

That was part of it, but the jet fuel fire burned itself out relatively
quickly.  What continued to burn after that was paper and other office
debris.


#39 of 50 by bru on Wed Dec 3 16:27:23 2003:

They didn't use the right kind of insulation on the steel framework. 
asbestos would have worked, but was banned as a cancer causing agent.  They
went with a type of concrete.  Being hard, it was blasted off by the impact
and explosions.  Teh blast also moved all the furniture to one corner where
it burned unhindered.


#40 of 50 by flem on Wed Dec 3 17:00:41 2003:

re #30:  It's called high school.  It doesn't really work.  


#41 of 50 by tod on Wed Dec 3 17:06:21 2003:

This response has been erased.



#42 of 50 by scott on Wed Dec 3 17:17:31 2003:

They also didn't adequately protect the stairwells with fireproof material,
such as drywall.

(interesting side note about the paper - don't think of it as burning sheets,
think of it as an almost explosive dust... which is what it would have turned
into during the initial blast.)


#43 of 50 by gull on Wed Dec 3 21:44:40 2003:

No, they used drywall.  The problem is drywall is easy for pieces of jet
planes to smash through.  Not only did that make it ineffective as a fire
break, the drywall debris blocked the stairway.  If the stairwells had been
surrounded with concrete more people would have gotten out.

The fact that, during the first WTC bombing, people trapped in elevators
were able to cut through walls and get out with nothing but car keys should
tell you something about the quality of construction we're dealing with.


#44 of 50 by tod on Wed Dec 3 23:17:29 2003:

This response has been erased.



#45 of 50 by rcurl on Thu Dec 4 02:51:44 2003:

Drywall is "quality" construction. It's purpose is to support some
attachment, paint, and to not burn very well. If you started installing
concrete walls you will not have 100 story buildings.

According to a documentary I saw about the Twin-Towers, they did design it
to survive an airliner of that time flying into it.



#46 of 50 by gull on Thu Dec 4 15:54:19 2003:

Yes, the intercontinental version of the Boeing 707.  I think they only
took into account the initial impact, though, not a fire.

From what I've heard the WTC towers were considered firetraps from the
day they were built.  The only reason they got constructed at all is the
New York Port Authority had the right to ignore building codes.


#47 of 50 by tod on Thu Dec 4 19:44:56 2003:

This response has been erased.



#48 of 50 by jp2 on Thu Dec 4 19:49:54 2003:

This response has been erased.



#49 of 50 by gull on Thu Dec 4 23:37:10 2003:

Notice, though, that both disasters revealed that the buildings were
impossible to evacuate in a timely way.  That's pretty much the definition
of a firetrap.


#50 of 50 by aruba on Fri Dec 5 02:24:49 2003:

I dunno - I've heard that things could have been a lot worse.  Most of the
people got out, after all.


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