Grex Agora47 Conference

Item 10: Bummer for the season after Summer

Entered by tpryan on Wed Sep 24 13:26:31 2003:

        Been Blue?  Bummed?  Tell us about it.
413 responses total.

#1 of 413 by gelinas on Wed Sep 24 17:26:32 2003:

Eighteen items already.


#2 of 413 by lynne on Wed Sep 24 23:17:55 2003:

I don't want/need a job for another 14 months, and I'm already stressed out
about whether I'm going to find one.  


#3 of 413 by katie on Thu Sep 25 00:55:15 2003:

I emailed my dad's wife yesterday to see how he was, as I haven;t heard
a peep for weeks (she had asked me not to call, just to use email).
She responded that he passed away two weeks ago.

I just don't get it.


#4 of 413 by cmcgee on Thu Sep 25 00:57:44 2003:

Oh, Katie how awful! She must be a very hurting person to have to hurt others
that way.  


#5 of 413 by katie on Thu Sep 25 00:58:30 2003:

She's not, that's the thing.


#6 of 413 by cmcgee on Thu Sep 25 01:50:17 2003:

I guess that was ambiguous.  I meant to quote the "Hurt people hurt people"
concept.  The idea that someone must have a big-time hurt inside themselves
to go around hurting others.  


#7 of 413 by richard on Thu Sep 25 03:08:43 2003:

katie, really sorry to hear about your dad.  

since you say your stepmom isn't a hurting person, do you think your 
dad put her up to her actions (i.e. not communicating with you)  
Sometimes when people are sick or hurting, they just can't bear to be 
with or deal with people, even people they love.  It is just the way 
some people react when they are confronted with bad things, to close 
themselves off.  you shouldn't take it personally, I'm sure it had no 
reflection on his love for you or anything.  Again, condolences


#8 of 413 by keesan on Thu Sep 25 03:37:46 2003:

Maybe she was just too sad to contact anyone?


#9 of 413 by twenex on Thu Sep 25 11:11:04 2003:

My God, that's a real bummer. I'm very sorry for you, Katie.


#10 of 413 by scott on Thu Sep 25 12:29:22 2003:

Sorry to hear about your dad, Katie.  Definitely not a good thing.


#11 of 413 by vidar on Thu Sep 25 13:23:04 2003:

Seems that for much of my life Lofn has been guiding my heart in the 
wrong directions.


#12 of 413 by jep on Thu Sep 25 13:44:32 2003:

Katie, I'm really sorry.


#13 of 413 by jep on Thu Sep 25 13:47:01 2003:

I was finally able to go to one of my stepson's football games last 
night.  But it was called off on account of the thunderstorm.  I was 
able to pass him the sweatshirt I got him from the Smithsonian by 
asking his coach to call him to the locker room door.

I'll get another chance to go to a game in 2 weeks.


#14 of 413 by asddsa on Thu Sep 25 19:44:35 2003:

TWO UNLUCKY RESPONSES MISSED.


#15 of 413 by tpryan on Fri Sep 26 13:25:11 2003:

        I'm sorry to hear of your loss, Katie.  I take it all 
arrangments had been taken of, also without your input.


#16 of 413 by tod on Fri Sep 26 18:20:28 2003:

This response has been erased.



#17 of 413 by slynne on Sat Sep 27 12:47:28 2003:

I cant even imagine what you are going through, katie. You have all my 
sympathies though


#18 of 413 by katie on Sat Sep 27 18:37:57 2003:

Thanks, everybody.


#19 of 413 by richard on Mon Sep 29 02:59:13 2003:

IBB I've been receiving spam email on my grex login from somebody using a
yahoo mail.  They address the mail not to my or my login but to:

Undisclosed.Recipients@cyberspace.org 

this apparently bounces these emails all over grex.  why does this work?
isn't there a way to block such methods? 


#20 of 413 by scg on Mon Sep 29 06:04:39 2003:

The To: line is a part of the message.  It has nothing to do with who the
message was actually sent to.


#21 of 413 by mdw on Mon Sep 29 08:51:14 2003:

Grex *should* be rejecting mail that says in the RFC 822 headers that
it's to "Undisclosed.Recipients@cyberspace.org".  That's a generic
address, one of a bunch that are only used by spammers.  You should
forward any such mail to "uce".  I found one other such sample of the
tail end of that file, so I can believe that something can go wrong with
the check. I'm not sure what - when I tried to recreate it just now
using the sample message somebody else sent to uce, the check caught it
just as it should.

Grex should also be rejecting mail with invalid .com return addresses -
but versign may have broken that.


#22 of 413 by remmers on Mon Sep 29 11:44:43 2003:

<remmers curses verisign>


#23 of 413 by keesan on Mon Sep 29 17:34:31 2003:

I get undisclosed repicient spam at grex frequently - in fact I set procmail
to filter on that string.  I stopped forwarding spam a while ago (to uce) but
will start again if it will be helpful.


#24 of 413 by gelinas on Mon Sep 29 17:52:24 2003:

I'd not seen the "undisclosed_recipient@cyberspace" before; I have seen
something like "<undisclosed recipients>", which Pine seems to use when there
is no "To:" or "cc:" field in the message text.  That is, it shows up when
all the addressees were blind carbon-copy (bcc) addressees.


#25 of 413 by other on Mon Sep 29 20:32:59 2003:

I get some legitimate mail to undisclosed recipient (though not usually 
at Grex) from friends who use mail lists hosted at yahoo or some other 
commercial sites.


#26 of 413 by beeswing on Tue Sep 30 22:17:20 2003:

Boy and I are having problems.

My feet are cold.

I'm starting to hate a particular co-worker of mine.


#27 of 413 by asddsa on Thu Oct 2 02:41:40 2003:

re 21 
Oh boy, mdw is telling people where they should forward their mail. Quick
boys, run for cover!


#28 of 413 by ea on Sat Oct 4 04:26:11 2003:

relationship issues


#29 of 413 by slynne on Sat Oct 4 17:33:48 2003:

I have a code. AAAA-CHOOO


#30 of 413 by vidar on Sun Oct 5 23:23:03 2003:

IBB I had to miss Tango lessons because I was unable to find a parking 
space downtown . . . stupid drivers aside.


#31 of 413 by lynne on Mon Oct 6 02:24:20 2003:

IBB the job-related panicking is trying to set in.  Also, because I made a
careless, meant-to-be-funny remark to a good friend who had been having a
terrible week and was really pissed off by my remark.  Finally, because 
my monthly getting-to-see-Don event always gets severely interrupted by
other people and friends when it takes place in Michigan.  The time we got
to spend together was wonderful, but there wasn't nearly enough of it.
Which leads me back to the "I only have to be in Boston 11 more months"
as an attempted cheer-up, which leads straight back to "oh shit, I have to
find a job for around then."  Hmmm.  Time for bed.


#32 of 413 by russ on Mon Oct 6 03:17:24 2003:

I am *still* looking for my main stereo remote, and it has
not turned up.


#33 of 413 by edina on Mon Oct 6 14:57:32 2003:

Re 31  That's funny - I just discovered that about Dave and myself - when we
are in Michigan together, it's about 90,000 times more stressful, as we're
both contending with family too . . .and alone time is pretty much nil.


#34 of 413 by scott on Mon Oct 6 16:11:45 2003:

Bad cold... the usual annoying symptoms.


#35 of 413 by lynne on Mon Oct 6 16:48:40 2003:

33:  Yup.  We didn't do *too* badly--we got a hotel room for two of the
three nights I was there, and we used the Wings tickets as an excuse to
run away from everybody.  But still <frustrated sigh>


#36 of 413 by bru on Mon Oct 6 18:01:35 2003:

I am severely bummed because my wife just called and said she heard from our
son that he may have to have major surgery.  Apparently he has an enlarged
spleen and it may rupture.  Not good news.


#37 of 413 by edina on Mon Oct 6 18:13:11 2003:

Good karma on Gareth, Bruce.


#38 of 413 by slynne on Mon Oct 6 19:07:36 2003:

Sorry to hear that bruce. I hope everything goes ok for him. 


#39 of 413 by anderyn on Mon Oct 6 19:22:26 2003:

Thanks. He said he'd call me back once the doctor decided what to do. Right
now, he said, they were planning on taking him to the hospital "downtown" via
ambulance and then deciding from there. (I don't know why there's a different
hospital he might go to, since he works at one of the biggest in the area,
but there you go, it's the military.)


#40 of 413 by rcurl on Mon Oct 6 20:01:54 2003:

IABB an acquaintance, who was a very experienced caver, died when his
rappel spool opened while he was descending a 213 foot pit in a Virginia
cave. 


#41 of 413 by aruba on Mon Oct 6 21:06:19 2003:

Re #39: Sorry to hear that, Twila.  Keep us posted.

Rane - that sounds awful.


#42 of 413 by richard on Tue Oct 7 04:52:23 2003:

sorry to hear that bruce and twila.  be thankful that bruce works for 
the government now, because I bet he has really good health insurance 


#43 of 413 by mcnally on Tue Oct 7 06:28:21 2003:

  re #42:  I doubt it applies to Gareth, who's in the Air Force if memory
  serves, but active duty military personnel should get decent medical
  treatment, too.


#44 of 413 by tsty on Tue Oct 7 07:53:35 2003:

zoundz .. bru/anderyn .. sorry for that news .. good medicine to gareth
adn faith to you two.


#45 of 413 by scott on Tue Oct 7 13:35:08 2003:

It's not just a cold, it's the flu!  


#46 of 413 by anderyn on Tue Oct 7 13:43:49 2003:

Gareth is having a cat scan today. He's freaked, a little, because the tests
so far have been negative on what could be causing this. The one doctor wants
to do an immediate spleenectomy, since they're very worried about a rupture.
So I guess we'll wait and see what they have to say after the cat scan.


#47 of 413 by tod on Tue Oct 7 15:26:51 2003:

This response has been erased.



#48 of 413 by slynne on Tue Oct 7 16:43:59 2003:

I hope everything works out for Gareth.

I am really sick today. I have a fever, a cough, runny head, stuffy 
nose. er something like that.  I cant sleep because of the cough. and 
the sneezing. 


#49 of 413 by scott on Tue Oct 7 16:48:03 2003:

I'm not feeling that sick right now, although I had a nice fever and the
chills last night.  But damn, this looks like it would be a perfect day for
a 2+ hour bicycle ride.


#50 of 413 by beeswing on Tue Oct 7 21:46:28 2003:

I am jacked up on an antibiotic cocktail. wooooooo....


#51 of 413 by eskarina on Wed Oct 8 01:19:34 2003:

I have an icky cold.  If I don't take nyquil I can't sleep through the night
(I wake up every couple of hours), and if I do take nyquil I wake up really
groggy and stay that way for at least 3 hours.  Doesn't mix well with 2nd
hour's new attempt to test my authority.

I think I've figured it out... each new class I take on decides to test my
resolve on what kind of bs I'll put up with and what I won't after about a
week... when I start teaching they are really nice cause they're in shock,
and then they decide that the chances that I might be more of a pushover than
Craig are just enough that its worth a try.

Needless to say, 2nd hour got a new seating chart a couple of days ago. 
That'll teach em.  :)


#52 of 413 by bru on Wed Oct 8 01:19:55 2003:

good news.  Gareth still hurts, but they will not haveto remove the spleen.
They are going to do more tests, but have sent him home from the hospital.
The pleen is larger than normal, but shows no sign of rupture, nor disease.


#53 of 413 by jiffer on Wed Oct 8 02:05:38 2003:

IBB my brother decided to not come and get this dog tonight, like he was
supposed to. He also didn't have the decency to call me to tell me this. So,
I guess he will be forking out the dough to store his dog in a kennel from
now on. Tuff luck. 


#54 of 413 by goose on Wed Oct 8 02:32:04 2003:

IBB I have that icky cold too...took sone stuff a couple hours ago that
doesn't seem to be helping with the sinus pressure or runny nose....

/s/sone/some


#55 of 413 by jiffer on Wed Oct 8 02:47:40 2003:

<jiffer passes out hot compresses, hot tea with honey and lemon, some chicken
noodle soup, and copies of The Jughead comics to all the sick people>


#56 of 413 by scg on Wed Oct 8 07:26:40 2003:

IBB Schwarzenegger got elected Governor, and my car (yes, my beat up nine year
old car that was fairly cheap to begin with) got stolen tonight.  I'm somewhat
surprised to find that I'm more upset about the election, but maybe I'll
become more upset about the car next time I want to drive somewhere.

The cop who did the report on the car theft said cars like mine generally show
up abandonned within a few days of being reported stolen.


#57 of 413 by slynne on Wed Oct 8 12:42:15 2003:

Someone stole your 9 year old car? Weird. 


#58 of 413 by goose on Wed Oct 8 13:00:15 2003:

Sorry to hear about both of those things Steve.


#59 of 413 by aruba on Wed Oct 8 13:52:43 2003:

Sorry to hear that, Steve.


#60 of 413 by lynne on Wed Oct 8 14:16:25 2003:

That sucks.  Still, it's a better response than a friend got when his 1977
Chevy got stolen--the cops just laughed and hung up on him.  Good luck
finding the car.  (Not much helpful I can say about the election.)


#61 of 413 by gull on Wed Oct 8 14:18:08 2003:

Re #56: Sorry to hear that.  It's hard to imagine why someone would
steal a nine year old car.  Maybe joyriding kids?

The funniest car theft story I ever heard was from a guy who had an old
VW Beetle.  The body was in reasonably good shape but the brakes were
multiple-pumpers, really shot.  It was once stolen and found abandoned
in the middle of an intersection a block down, where the thieves had
finally gotten it to stop.


#62 of 413 by scg on Wed Oct 8 16:15:05 2003:

The cop said it was almost certainly joyriding kids, and that old Saturns get
stolen so often that they run the plates through the system whenever they see
one.  I think this is really weird.  I was so convinced that nobody would have
stolen my car in a parking lot with lots of newer and nicer cars that I
wandered around the parking lot for 15 minutes convinced that I must have
forgotten where I'd parked, and then asked the store if they'd towed it for
some reason, before I finally called the police.


#63 of 413 by lynne on Wed Oct 8 17:53:19 2003:

Why do old Saturns get stolen more often than other cars?  Is it a regional
thing?  (I think Camrys and Corollas are high on the most-stolen list out
here, but always figured my 12-year-old wagon was an unlikely target.  Hmm.
I'll bet you that a manual transmission also serves as an anti-theft 
device.  :))


#64 of 413 by tod on Wed Oct 8 18:04:14 2003:

This response has been erased.



#65 of 413 by scg on Wed Oct 8 18:36:14 2003:

Mine had a manual transmission, too.


#66 of 413 by gull on Wed Oct 8 18:42:37 2003:

GM cars have for years had a reputation for being very easy to hotwire.


#67 of 413 by tod on Wed Oct 8 19:29:57 2003:

This response has been erased.



#68 of 413 by jep on Thu Oct 9 02:52:47 2003:

I got the bill from my lawyer today.  The last time I talked to her 
was some 6 months ago, before the divorce was finalized.  The bill is 
for $3300.

I find this pretty disturbing, since I often asked her what the status 
of my account was, and was always told, "Don't worry about it".  The 
impression I had was that the retainer ($1000) was still covering what 
I needed for the divorce.

I don't have $3300 extra.

I sure wish I'd known I was running up that kind of bill while it was 
happening.  I don't suppose she depends much on repeat business.  I 
also presume she knows how to collect on bills of this type, and 
generally that she knows what she's doing.  For *her*.


#69 of 413 by gelinas on Thu Oct 9 03:03:53 2003:

(John, take a minute to consider the question, "What would I have done
differently?"  Could you _really_ have done without your lawyer's advice and
assistance at any point in the proceedings?  If not, then not knowing was just
one less thing to worry about.  Talk to her about a payment plan.)


#70 of 413 by jep on Thu Oct 9 03:18:29 2003:

I could have not gone on vacation last month, and made other choices, 
based on the money I really had versus what I thought I had.  I am not 
a careful planner with money, but I do try not to spend what I don't 
have.

I didn't complain about the money; I complained about asking about the 
money and not being told, and now being surprised by a fat bill.  I 
wouldn't have done anything differently with regard to handling the 
divorce itself.

I will indeed have to ask about a payment plan.  I don't have much 
choice.


#71 of 413 by other on Thu Oct 9 03:36:27 2003:

Your mistake was accepting the answer "don't worry about it."  

The appropriate response is, "I have to worry about it.  I have limited 
resources, and I have to plan appropriately in order to assure that I can 
pay the bill."


#72 of 413 by gelinas on Thu Oct 9 03:43:52 2003:

I'm sorry; I misunderstood your plaint.  I agree with you, and Eric has good
advice.


#73 of 413 by jep on Thu Oct 9 03:45:42 2003:

I get burned again and again and again, but I still trust people, with 
very little reason in a lot of cases.  I trust my mechanic, I trust my 
doctor and dentist, I trusted my therapist.  I fight off the impulse 
to trust my ex-wife despite two years of proof that I shouldn't and 
can't.  I don't believe I am going to change.  This won't be the first 
time I'll be paying off a big bill I didn't expect.  Probably not the 
last, either.


#74 of 413 by jep on Thu Oct 9 03:46:09 2003:

Joe slipped in.  It's not your fault if I don't make myself clear!


#75 of 413 by scott on Thu Oct 9 07:41:03 2003:

The runny nose & cough isn't so bad.  Just wish I was asleep right now...


#76 of 413 by tsty on Thu Oct 9 08:36:50 2003:

negotiate with your lawyer ... there is ltos of wiggle room in bills
like that.


#77 of 413 by keesan on Thu Oct 9 12:45:31 2003:

Re the divorce bill, JIm's lawyer charged him (in 1981) $15,000, twice what
he earned in a year before taxes.  The jury cut that in half (he had already
paid half).  I expect the lawyer will let you pay when you can pay as it is
much cheaper than trying to get you to pay when you cannot pay.

Scott's runny nose sounds more like a cold than the flu.  I had a runny nose
for at least a week after a few days of flu-like symptoms but not fever.


#78 of 413 by jep on Thu Oct 9 13:51:15 2003:

My problems are only serious because they're mine.  Reading through 
Sindi's item about lymphoma helps me to put things in perspective a 
bit.  Last night I talked to a divorced woman with three kids who makes 
$15,000 per year, who's ex keeps dragging her back to court for 
expensive items she cannot afford, trying to impoverish her into giving 
him custody of their kids.  That's more of a problem than I've got.  
This item is full of worse items than I've got.

I'll be calling my lawyer this morning to see what we can work out.  


#79 of 413 by gull on Thu Oct 9 13:54:00 2003:

I'm sure you can work out something.  It's in their best interest to
give you a payment plan you can live with.


#80 of 413 by scott on Thu Oct 9 15:29:53 2003:

Re 77:  Yeah, I've decided it's a really nasty cold rather than the flu. 
Although I did manage to get up to 99.8F last night... and this morning after
being awake most of the night I felt like death warmed over.  Well, more like
death as a cinnamon bun, microwaved too long and then allowed to sit on the
counter until it's become too solid to eat.  Yeah, that's what it felt
like.  :P


#81 of 413 by keesan on Thu Oct 9 16:08:28 2003:

They told me not to worry about fever unless it went over 101.  If you have
the same cold I had it takes about 5 days to get to the runny nose stage
(after the stuffy head and sneezing stage) and another 5 days of runny nose
and mucus (gradually getting better).  It helped a great deal to stay
overheated and rested.  Viruses don't replicate well at high body
temperatures.  Wear a hat and warm socks, stay under blankets if you can. 
Jim was taking a lot of hot baths which helped him for a bit each time.


#82 of 413 by happyboy on Thu Oct 9 16:47:48 2003:

my fave treatment for a cold:  fluid and exercise

my fave treatment for the flu: PIZZA.


#83 of 413 by remmers on Thu Oct 9 22:53:08 2003:

What does the pizza do for you?  Stress control?


#84 of 413 by beeswing on Fri Oct 10 02:14:08 2003:

Breakup with the guy.


#85 of 413 by scg on Fri Oct 10 02:23:32 2003:

My car still hasn't shown up. :(


#86 of 413 by keesan on Fri Oct 10 03:28:14 2003:

My palms and soles are now a bit numb, not just tingly fingertips.  2 more
months of this.  Could be a lot worse.


#87 of 413 by happyboy on Fri Oct 10 05:07:17 2003:

re83: exactly!


#88 of 413 by michaela on Fri Oct 10 10:16:01 2003:

Imminent breakup with the boy if things don't get better SOON. Last weekend
left me optimistic, but it's been a long, bumpy road.


#89 of 413 by lynne on Fri Oct 10 14:34:51 2003:

Bad week for relationships, I see.  Sarah:  is distance a major factor in
the problem(s) y'all are having?  Sorry to hear, bees.


#90 of 413 by edina on Fri Oct 10 14:40:05 2003:

I was thinking the same thing - it must be a bad week and you'll excuse me
while I stand on this side of the room.


#91 of 413 by eskarina on Fri Oct 10 17:14:01 2003:

IBB the Red Wings game I didn't watch last night turned out to be 
really good.  I should have just pretended that I am physically capable 
of grading papers and watching hockey at the same time.  ;)

IAB as a simple result of sleep deprivation and having spent such a 
large amount of time grading this week.


#92 of 413 by edina on Fri Oct 10 18:40:38 2003:

IBB concert tickets for a show I really want to see have already gone on sale
and sold out!!!  Bloody e-bay!


#93 of 413 by slynne on Fri Oct 10 19:27:54 2003:

I wonder if I have the same cold as Scott. I have been sick since 
sunday. I cant sleep at night because the sneezing and coughing are 
keeping me up. Well I can sleep a little bit until the NyQuil wears off.
I missed two days of work this week and made my co-workers listen to me 
hacking the other three. bleh. I am really tired of being sick. 


#94 of 413 by glenda on Fri Oct 10 19:58:24 2003:

I have been fighting a severe headache that pain killers only take the edge
off (and only when taking much more than recommended), and gastric upset for
almost 2 weeks.  I get the nausea that usually warns of low blood sugar, but
the very thought of eating makes me want to gag.  I force myself to eat
(having low blood sugar means eating regularly even if you don't want to) half
the time I feel even more nauseated.  Makes going to classes with intense note
taking requirements real fun.


#95 of 413 by edina on Fri Oct 10 20:10:46 2003:

I'm bummed because there is very little dignity vomiting in a public toilet.


#96 of 413 by scott on Fri Oct 10 20:24:04 2003:

My cold has gotten a nice chest cough, but overall it's much better.  Finally
had a decent night's sleep last night.


#97 of 413 by slynne on Fri Oct 10 20:25:24 2003:

Oh man. I think edina wins! public puking is terrible. 


#98 of 413 by jaklumen on Fri Oct 10 22:16:27 2003:

(wondering out aloud for a moment: why do some say 'man' and 
others 'boy' when referring to an SO?)

IBB because one of my recent job interviews sent a rejection... had 
talked with my vocational coach about the importance about asking more 
questions about the company, esp. to show interest.


#99 of 413 by michaela on Fri Oct 10 22:45:40 2003:

Lynne - the distance makes it easier for him to work through his issues but
harder for me to work through mine. :-P We're trying to find middle ground.


#100 of 413 by lynne on Fri Oct 10 23:17:59 2003:

Re 98:  Because the term "boyfriend" strikes us as embarrassing and silly,
once past the age of about 16.  So we grasp desperately at other nomenclature,
none of which is particularly good.  Still, I refuse to get married just 
because the English language is lame.  :)


#101 of 413 by michaela on Sat Oct 11 03:46:56 2003:

Re #98 - "the boy" always struck me as cute, and I hate a lot of the other
terms. He used to refer to me as "the grrl", so it makes sense.


#102 of 413 by krj on Sat Oct 11 04:56:15 2003:

The state budget has sprung another $900 million hole, which means
more midyear budget cuts and more layoffs at work.


#103 of 413 by happyboy on Sat Oct 11 08:36:10 2003:

r88: "why does this always happen TO ME?!"


#104 of 413 by eskarina on Sat Oct 11 18:05:33 2003:

IBB lately I've been bummed a lot.  I'm working 7 days a week and getting paid
for 2, and its wearing on me hardcore.  I guess an essential part of student
teaching is being very busy and very poor.  And wishing one was really in
college again... I don't have as much time to see people, and the little time
I get to spend with friends doesn't always live up to my expectations as far
as the connection and how much fun we have.  I haven't had enough time to
exercise this week, which means less endorphins which is translating to a less
happy Anna.  I think I'm way less unstable than I was the first couple of
weekends, though.

I'm tired of this dull sense of frustration.  Ugh.


#105 of 413 by tod on Sat Oct 11 19:16:22 2003:

This response has been erased.



#106 of 413 by murph on Sat Oct 11 22:54:59 2003:

#104: where/what level are you student teaching?  My girlfriend's in a fourth
grade classroom right now and (sort of) surviving.  Comes home at four and
works on lesson plans until 11 at night every day.

How's your cooperating teacher?  Cara's has never had a student teacher before
and is a little, um, territorial.


#107 of 413 by i on Sat Oct 11 23:17:34 2003:

From quite a few family & friends who've done it, my understanding is that
teaching is considerably harder/longer hours the first few years.  (After
that you've got files of reusable lesson plans, experience with what works/
what doesn't/how long it takes, knowledge of all the mistakes to grade the
papers faster, etc.  Plus (hopefully) decent fit & relationships with the
other teachers & admin's, better personal finances, & bit of seniority (in
case of cutbacks).

IBB our main server threw a hard drive.  Now when to do the surgery and how
much to trust the "rebuild RAID array while server is up" feature?


#108 of 413 by jaklumen on Sun Oct 12 01:28:23 2003:

resp:101 fair enough-- Julie has a key chain with a pic of her on one 
side and a hand-made sign the other that says "Jon's Best Girl."
(Of course, I have two great girls in my life.) 


#109 of 413 by beeswing on Sun Oct 12 03:06:59 2003:

re 107: Yep. True. I've been teaching junior high for over 2 months and
I'm already aware this is NOT the job for me. Well, more that the age
group isn't. 


#110 of 413 by tsty on Sun Oct 12 08:35:47 2003:

jr. HS is like corralling feral cats. 
  
i'm presuminmg 5th-8th grades.
  
9/10th grades and  up can be rewarding
  
hardest job i ever enjoyed - might go back. 



#111 of 413 by lynne on Sun Oct 12 14:17:33 2003:

IBB it's 10:20 am on Sunday and I've already been at work for 1.5 hours.
Revenge (in the form of outlet mall shopping) will be mine!


#112 of 413 by remmers on Sun Oct 12 14:40:22 2003:

I remember what I and my peers were like in junior high school.
I wouldn't want to be around me at that age.


#113 of 413 by beeswing on Sun Oct 12 15:06:29 2003:

Exactly. And I'm in a catholic school. You'd think this would mean the
kids are more disciplined. Nope... it means the parents are not teaching
the kids manners and right behavior at home, and they expect us to do it
for them. Sorry, but I can't teach 100 7th and 8th graders how to act
like civilized human beings. I can teach them English and History, though.

My plan is to move on to greener pastures as a school librarian.


#114 of 413 by happyboy on Sun Oct 12 19:15:37 2003:

why can't you teach manners and right behavior?


#115 of 413 by aruba on Sun Oct 12 19:47:45 2003:

<tries to picture remmers as a rowdy junior high school student.  fails.>


#116 of 413 by happyboy on Sun Oct 12 19:53:50 2003:

<imagines remmers as a junior high RAGTIME RENEGADE>


what a RASCAL he musta been!


#117 of 413 by gull on Mon Oct 13 01:02:33 2003:

Re #109: My dad taught 6th grade for a while and didn't like it.  He 
switched to 5th grade, which he found a lot more pleasant.  ("It's still 
okay to like your teacher at that age," he said.)  Now he's switched to 
being the school librarian, and he's really loving that.


#118 of 413 by richard on Mon Oct 13 01:09:14 2003:

IBB one of my favorite local coffee shops is going out of business and I was
there for its last day, which was today.  This was a mom and pop coffee shop
run by a local couple and their college age daughter, a cool place where they
had local jazz bands play for free and had art shows, where local artists
could hang their paintings and art on the walls.  It was a community gathering
place that had a lot of local flavor.  So what happened?  The building that
housed this coffee shop was sold, and the new owners had another prospective
tenant who was willing to pay twice the rent that this couple that owned it
were paying.  They couldn't afford to pay double the rent and their lease
wasn't renewed.  So who is this new tenant thats going to pay twice the rent?
Yep, you guessed it.  Starbucks.  The corporatization of america continues.
There are plenty of Starbucks around here as it is, and I like Starbucks
coffee, but do they have to target for take over every local coffee shop that
does good business.  I mean of course Starbucks can pay twice the rent, they
charge twice as much for their coffee and cappucinos!  Its sad that there are
now fewer and fewer locally owned mom and pop places anymore, and everything
decent location is being taken over by big multinational corporations that
can pay twice the rent.   


#119 of 413 by michaela on Mon Oct 13 03:09:31 2003:

Re #114 - because teachers aren't getting paid to do the parents' jobs. This
is a HUGE complaint between parents and teachers. It's not a day care or a
school of manners. If parents wouldn't raise their children to be beasts,
teachers would have it a lot easier because they'd spend less time teaching
manners and more time teaching subjects.


#120 of 413 by scg on Mon Oct 13 03:23:27 2003:

I was reading an article in one of the Seattle "alternative" papers about
Starbucks' growth, and was intrigued by some comments from a Starbucks
executive.  He explained that Starbucks is trying ot fit into its customers'
daily routines, rather than making their customers fit Starbucks into their
daily routine.  If crossing the street to get to Starbucks wasn't in the
cusotmer's daily routine, he said, it shouldn't have to be.  Thus, having two
Starbuckses across the street from eachother was justified.

I think this would make a great advertising slogan.  "Starbucks: not worth
crossing the street for."


#121 of 413 by happyboy on Mon Oct 13 07:02:12 2003:

re119:  "because teachers aren't getting paid to do the parents'
         jobs."

wanna bet?  well, not paid *well* anyway.  you gonna straighten
those parents out, are ya? 


#122 of 413 by gull on Mon Oct 13 14:41:02 2003:

I'm slightly bummed that the new injectors haven't made my VW any easier to
start in cold weather.  I suspect the engine is just worn to the point that
the compression is too low for good cold starting.  However, since this is
mainly a summer camping vehicle for me, and starting is acceptable in warmer
weather, I figure I might as well drive it as-is until it's time for a new
engine.


#123 of 413 by drew on Mon Oct 13 19:00:05 2003:

Try a block heater?


#124 of 413 by gull on Mon Oct 13 19:52:25 2003:

A block heater would help, I'm sure.  I couldn't use it easily at home, but
I tend to camp places that have electricity so it could be helpful in that
situation.  However, I so rarely camp in cold weather that I'm not sure it's
worth the considerable hassle of installing one.


#125 of 413 by michaela on Mon Oct 13 21:46:17 2003:

Re #121 - what I meant was that teachers are paid (not well) to teach subjects
and be role models. While they may end disciplining and teaching manners to
spoiled brats, they shouldn't HAVE to, and some parents (who are alerted to
their child's hellish behaviour) have an "I don't care... you spend eight hours
a day with them... YOU teach them manners" attitude.

If parents would do their jobs, the teachers could do THEIR jobs more
effectively and would probably stick with the profession a lot longer. That
was my point.


#126 of 413 by russ on Mon Oct 13 23:55:08 2003:

IBB a really comfortable pair of shoes that were also nice-looking
has completely bit the dust, and I have no idea where I can find
anything like them despite watching for years.


#127 of 413 by happyboy on Tue Oct 14 00:26:07 2003:

re125: get use to it or quit.


#128 of 413 by scg on Tue Oct 14 16:23:46 2003:

re 125:
        I'll counter that by saying that those who are good at their jobs (in
general; this is in no way unique to teachers) are those who are good at
dealing with the environment that's there, not just the environment they'd
like to exist.  I have seen some teachers handle that sort of situation
wonderfully.


#129 of 413 by rcurl on Tue Oct 14 17:00:58 2003:

I don't think that "counters" #125. In fact, it supports it. The fact reamins,
the teachers have to "handle that sort of situation", but you'd have more
teachers doing it effectively if parents did their "job" more effecitvely.


#130 of 413 by happyboy on Tue Oct 14 17:52:29 2003:

  well i guess we'd better start totally changing american
culture then.


#131 of 413 by rcurl on Tue Oct 14 17:53:29 2003:

Is that the solution you recommend for every problem that America faces?


#132 of 413 by happyboy on Tue Oct 14 18:03:07 2003:

yep.


#133 of 413 by mcnally on Tue Oct 14 19:31:15 2003:

  re #131:  It seems to me that Rane is the one advocating for a substantial
  change in American habits and happyboy is the one recommending dealing with
  things as they are, rather than as we'd like them to be. 


#134 of 413 by remmers on Tue Oct 14 22:53:06 2003:

If Americans always dealt with things as they are, there'd be no United
States.


#135 of 413 by rcurl on Tue Oct 14 22:57:06 2003:

Some people seem to think that improvements are either undesirable or
impossible. Why must we settle for "things as they are"?


#136 of 413 by scg on Wed Oct 15 03:37:23 2003:

I'd say that actually changing things is working with the environment, while
complaining that something can't be done because the environment hasn't
changed isn't.


#137 of 413 by russ on Wed Oct 15 03:37:32 2003:

IBB I've been trying to spider the web sites of spammers to
drive up their bandwidth bills, but every site I've gotten
to has already been taken down before I can do my part. ;-)


#138 of 413 by jaklumen on Wed Oct 15 03:39:10 2003:

IBB it will probably be a week until I can get a C-PAP machine.  Red 
tape...


#139 of 413 by beeswing on Wed Oct 15 03:41:32 2003:

Sarah pretty much said what I was trying to get at. I will teach the
subjects required. I will give them extra help if they need it. I will
grade their work fairly. But I can't be a parent. 



#140 of 413 by glenda on Wed Oct 15 10:36:24 2003:

Re: 138, don't count on getting it that fast.  When STeve got his he went in
for the sleep study which determined that he needed one.  Then he had to set
another appointment for another sleep study to determine which pressure
setting was needed.  He had his stroke at the end of September 2001.  He got
the referral to the sleep study program in mid October, he finally got the
machine in January.  And that was with his neurologist playing interferance
to get him through the system faster, before having another stroke.


#141 of 413 by eskarina on Wed Oct 15 12:44:44 2003:

Re 106:  I am student teaching in the small town of Holt, Michigan, 
which is just south of Lansing.  I am in a classroom with 4 Geometry 
classes and an Algebra 2.  I am in a building with grades 10-12 in it, 
and we have students of every grade level in every single one of our 
classes.  My "focus class", or the one that I am the main teacher of 
from the beginning of the year until I leave, is 3rd hour geometry.  
They're fun.  They're smart, if not always well behaved.  We've also 
had more time to work out our kinks with each other than the other 
classes which I haven't taught much (I taught 2nd hour for two weeks).

My cooperating teacher is cool (and I don't just say that because he's 
sitting on a desk 5 feet away ;) ).  In some ways my student teaching 
placement is idyllic... I'm in a school where I really like the 
educational environment, and the math department is really cool.

How is Cara's CT territorial?


#142 of 413 by flem on Wed Oct 15 16:53:11 2003:

IBB I spent ten minutes this morning checkign out local computer jobs.  Guess
I'll be stuck with this job for a while.  :\


#143 of 413 by gelinas on Wed Oct 15 16:53:52 2003:

IBB the AA News is still publishing C. Potter's "reviews."


#144 of 413 by remmers on Wed Oct 15 17:00:30 2003:

The AA News used to have a worse critic than Potter.  Can't remember
his name though.


#145 of 413 by scott on Wed Oct 15 18:11:44 2003:

Didn't get the Albion gig.


#146 of 413 by slynne on Wed Oct 15 18:38:42 2003:

I dont really understand why the AA News keeps Christopher Potter on 
staff. I havent ever met a single person who liked his reviews except 
for a couple people who like him because his tastes are exactly 
opposite from their's. i.e. if he likes a movie, they hate it. If he 
*really* likes a movie, they *really hate it.


#147 of 413 by tod on Wed Oct 15 23:20:24 2003:

This response has been erased.



#148 of 413 by other on Thu Oct 16 00:51:05 2003:

147:  That's generous of you...


#149 of 413 by gelinas on Thu Oct 16 02:12:08 2003:

It's insulting to Mr. Stern.


#150 of 413 by other on Thu Oct 16 05:14:33 2003:

Comcast seems to have shut me down again.  I'm still waiting for an accounting
of the money I've paid them already.  At this point, I will be cancelling my
cable service, but retaining the broadband service.


#151 of 413 by russ on Thu Oct 16 13:23:55 2003:

Christopher Potter's reviews always told me whether I wanted to see
something or not.  Whether I agreed with his tastes was irrelevant
to that crucial issue.


#152 of 413 by lynne on Thu Oct 16 16:10:51 2003:

I am really really grouchy because after having my advisor tell me to include
a specific manuscript in preparation with my postdoc application, giving him
a sample packet on Saturday of the materials I intended to send, and working
my ass off to get everything together and sent off yesterday, I came in to
an email this morning informing me not to include said manuscript and
reprimanding me for wanting to.  In addition to an email instructing me to
run additional pointless controls (examining fluorescence response in pure
water and organic solvents because the results in buffer weren't good enough
to reflect the environment in a cell.  But, you know, organic solvents are
a *great* mimic of intracellular conditions.  Rrrrgh!)


#153 of 413 by michaela on Fri Oct 17 08:53:17 2003:

I had to reformat my hard drive and reinstall Windows and all of my programs
and such. This has been utter hell.


#154 of 413 by gull on Fri Oct 17 13:39:30 2003:

Unfortunately it's routine maintenance for Windows systems.  After two
or three years they start to suffer from creeping cruft and get slower
and slower.

(For a humorous look at this, see
http://www.doc.ic.ac.uk/~sue/475/cruft.html)


#155 of 413 by michaela on Fri Oct 17 19:41:19 2003:

Well, this was due to a bug that got in, despite pop-up blockers, Norton
Auto-Protect, Spybot, etc. *sigh*


#156 of 413 by richard on Sat Oct 18 02:53:46 2003:

IBB I ordered a book from a third party seller through amazon.com.  I was
expecting it in the mail, and I got an email directly from the third party
seller saying they didn't carry the book in stock.  So if they didn't ahve
the book, why were they listing it on amazon? Probably so they could get
my name and address, which they now have obviously, to put on their
mailing list.  They re-credited the money back to my credit card but it
still doesn't make it any less annoying.  Plus I was looking forward to
reading that book too...  :(
,


#157 of 413 by tod on Sat Oct 18 14:18:12 2003:

This response has been erased.



#158 of 413 by vidar on Mon Oct 20 12:37:45 2003:

IBB every time I go to perform at the Erebus Haunted House, my mood 
falls and I can't help but think about someone close I lost some years 
back.  So I spend the night contemplating a pilgramage to her grave.


#159 of 413 by tod on Mon Oct 20 15:18:01 2003:

This response has been erased.



#160 of 413 by scott on Tue Oct 21 02:50:20 2003:

Less than two weeks, and I've already finished the 900+ page new Neal
Stephenson book.


#161 of 413 by gull on Tue Oct 21 13:41:32 2003:

I've been waiting for over two months now for an import CD I ordered
from Amazon.com.  The estimated delivery date is now "Oct 24 - Nov 13".
 It hasn't shipped yet.


#162 of 413 by krj on Tue Oct 21 16:40:11 2003:

Ewwww.  I had a similar experience this summer with amazon.co.uk..
My new rule is: if Amazon US or UK doesn't say "ships in 24 hours" or
"ships in 3 days," I go looking for a source in the originating country,
unless I'm feeling *really* patient -- hopefully a source which has 
the disc in hand.


#163 of 413 by gelinas on Tue Oct 21 23:57:26 2003:

IABB I didn't update my calendar to reflect the rescheduling of the Grex BOD
meeting.


#164 of 413 by other on Wed Oct 22 00:06:47 2003:

likewise


#165 of 413 by michaela on Wed Oct 22 04:22:10 2003:

DAMMIT. A fabulous few weeks after the boy's major bout of depression, and
now the depression is back... no warning, just BAM. He's gone from loving and
sweet to snapping at me almost overnight.

Fortunately, I JUST went through this, so I know what to expect, but that
doesn't make it easy. I wasn't ready to deal with another bout so soon. I
wanted to be happy for a while. :( I feel bad for him because he hates it as
much as I do, and he knows how much it affects me, but he still won't take
his damn medicine because he hates taking medicine. *sigh*

I would have been fine with it popping up again if it had just WAITED. :(


#166 of 413 by keesan on Wed Oct 22 13:53:02 2003:

Does the medicine have side effects?


#167 of 413 by edina on Wed Oct 22 14:20:39 2003:

Would he take medication if he had diabetes of high blood pressure?


#168 of 413 by happyboy on Wed Oct 22 15:13:44 2003:

good question.


#169 of 413 by mynxcat on Wed Oct 22 16:24:32 2003:

This response has been erased.



#170 of 413 by mynxcat on Wed Oct 22 18:02:58 2003:

Michaela - is he bipolar?

My hair is too damned short!


#171 of 413 by other on Wed Oct 22 21:25:21 2003:

IBB I'm all geared up to get done some things I've been putting off for 
too long, but I can't do it now because the cello lesson my next-door 
neighbor is giving would be really badly affected by power tools.


#172 of 413 by jiffer on Wed Oct 22 22:39:11 2003:

IBB my life is overwhelming me right now.  I want a quiet vacation in the
middle of nowhere, with no electricity, no phones, nothing! just nature, a
few hungry bears, and other flea infested animals.  


#173 of 413 by mcnally on Wed Oct 22 23:00:56 2003:

  I can recommend some good USFS cabins in SE Alaska..  If you want grizzlies,
  though, you'll either have to go further north or over to the mainland.


#174 of 413 by tod on Wed Oct 22 23:04:42 2003:

This response has been erased.



#175 of 413 by mcnally on Thu Oct 23 00:19:41 2003:

  Talk to Special Agent Smithers, he'll get you a 10% discount on the cabin
  and a skiff to get back and forth to town..

  In real life, unfortunately, the only serious crime I was ever involved in
  (as the victim) I proved totally useless as a witness.  


#176 of 413 by glenda on Thu Oct 23 01:35:56 2003:

Can I come with you, jiffer.  Three 300 level computer science classes plus
Calc II with History thrown in for fun is leaving me little time for anything
else, including eating, sleeping, and talking to my family.


#177 of 413 by goose on Thu Oct 23 02:15:46 2003:

IBB Elliot Smith aparently committed suicide.


http://www.pitchforkmedia.com/news/03-10/22.shtml


#178 of 413 by michaela on Thu Oct 23 07:20:20 2003:

Sindi - the only side effect he reports is a lack of creative juices, which
sucks since he's a writer and musician.

Brooke - I'm not sure. He REALLY hates taking daily medication. It's the
routine of it that bothers him. I'm used to taking my daily pill, but he never
gets used to it. He was on it for three months a couple years ago, and it
helped, but the fact that he had to take it every day started to grate on him
and override the benefits. :-P


Mynxcat - no, he is not bipolar. He suffers from Major Depressive Disorder,
which is a lighter version and lacks the manic periods (thank god).

Back to Brooke - I'm really not sure what he'd do with diabetes or high blood
pressure medication. He'd probably take it since it's not something he can
"ride out" like the depression. He knows the depression is just as biological
as a heart defect, but it's that damn stubborness about daily medicine. I love
him, but I want to slap him. ;)


#179 of 413 by bru on Thu Oct 23 11:18:19 2003:

not wanting to take medication is apparently common.  I know I hate taking
medication even for a headache, and my daughter is the same way.

Unfortunately, sometimes you need to take medication.


#180 of 413 by anderyn on Thu Oct 23 12:53:55 2003:

They'd suck to be me. I'm on three daily medications. I can't take them all
at the same time, unfortunately, but I've got it down to taking the one at
waking up time and the other two at bedtime. That seems to work and I don't
forget. Since they're blood pressure/thyroid related, I can't forget them,
or just not take them.


#181 of 413 by keesan on Thu Oct 23 13:57:44 2003:

Sometimes losing weight, or cutting down on salt, can eliminate the need for
blood pressure medicines.  My mother discovered that if she never ate sugar
she did not need epilepsy  medication.


#182 of 413 by anderyn on Thu Oct 23 14:02:19 2003:

I've done the cutting down on salt and lost some weight, but I have to watch
it because my Dad had a stroke at forty-four, so the meds are probably going
to be a constant. This is not a big deal, really.


#183 of 413 by edina on Thu Oct 23 15:10:18 2003:

It's better than a stroke.  ;-)


#184 of 413 by aruba on Fri Oct 24 00:22:10 2003:

I used to hate routines too, because my parents spent so much time on them,
and it seemed like wasted time.  But mostly because it felt controlling, and
I hated to be controlled.

I got over it by realizing that taking care of myself and providing
structure for myself is a way of, if you will, being a good parent to
myself.  Not taking care of myself is being an abusive parent to myself.

But, I was in my thirties before I accepted that.


#185 of 413 by rcurl on Fri Oct 24 01:07:24 2003:

I know what people mean by hating "routines", but one has to admit that
they save a lot of mental uncertainty and time. I think the answer is to
use the mental processing and time saved by routines to do new nonroutine
things. It is only sad when the routines themselves become the purposes of
one's existence. 



#186 of 413 by beeswing on Fri Oct 24 03:56:26 2003:

I'll start an item about routines...

IBB I just realized my haircut looks a lot like Ellen Degeneres's. Feh. 


#187 of 413 by mynxcat on Fri Oct 24 13:37:30 2003:

I think Ellen degeneres is hot. And her hair's pretty cool.


#188 of 413 by jiffer on Fri Oct 24 20:27:15 2003:

Glenda and I are in the same boat.  I have the vacation time, I just 
don't have the time without school.  Unless you count Xmas time (no 
thanks), or the week of Masters (golf tourney), I guess I will have to 
wait till May to get in that Vacation.  At which time I am sure I will 
be visiting AA instead to see if some of my friends have new additions 
to their family by then. 

IABB the dress I am making for my neice is not behaving, stupid 
velveteen.


#189 of 413 by anderyn on Mon Oct 27 00:17:02 2003:

My grandmother was taken off life support today. Don't know how long she'll
last.


#190 of 413 by jep on Mon Oct 27 00:25:35 2003:

I'm sorry, Twila.


#191 of 413 by keesan on Mon Oct 27 01:12:00 2003:

I don't know anyone else who has both a grandson and a grandmother.  I hope
your grandmother is not in pain and that you are taking this okay.


#192 of 413 by other on Mon Oct 27 03:45:21 2003:

I seem to have misplaced $5 today.  Either that or I spent it and can't 
remember where or on what.

In the time it took to make a simple salad this evening my back caused me 
so much pain I had to sit down and ask my niece to finish setting the 
table for me.


#193 of 413 by jep on Mon Oct 27 14:38:46 2003:

I'm feeling pretty sick today.  I'm at work, but have warned my manager 
I might not make it through the day.


#194 of 413 by tod on Mon Oct 27 16:49:07 2003:

This response has been erased.



#195 of 413 by glenda on Mon Oct 27 17:50:10 2003:

STeve is home sick today.  He was sick yesterday.  He was going to make his
wonderful chicken cataccicori (I know I murdered the spelling on that) for
dinner yesterday, but felt so lousy that he finished the chicken soup he made
on Saturday while Staci and I ordered pizza (Damon was out gaming with
friends).


#196 of 413 by goose on Mon Oct 27 20:11:41 2003:

IBB I took some Tylenol3 last night and still slept terrible due to my
neck/back muscle being pulled.  Oddly enough Excedrin helped.


#197 of 413 by jep on Tue Oct 28 02:29:52 2003:

I was sick Saturday (tired, achy), then felt fine yesterday.  This 
morning I felt terrible (diarrhea, bad stomach), and also (strangely) 
couldn't get enough to eat.  I had lunch at 11, then again at 1:30, 
and have felt fine ever since.  I hope it lasts this time!


#198 of 413 by keesan on Tue Oct 28 02:42:28 2003:

Try a hot water bottle for pulled muscles, or a hot bath.  Aspirin relaxes
muscles too.


#199 of 413 by goose on Tue Oct 28 13:58:21 2003:

Ahh..maybe it was the asprin in the Excedrin.


#200 of 413 by gelinas on Tue Oct 28 14:07:16 2003:

(Aspirin, ibuprofen and naproxen are non-steriodal anti-inflammatories
(NSAID); acetominophen is not.  The first three can help heal muscle-pulls,
sprains, etc, while acetominophen merely dulls the pain.  Sodium naproxen
is the active ingredient in Aleve.)


#201 of 413 by richard on Wed Oct 29 07:12:48 2003:

IBB I got my new drivers license in the mail (the old one expired this
month), and the picture came out lousy.  They only took one picture, and
they should have taken three or four and chosen the best one.  It'll be a
pain in the ass to have the picture taken again, and I'll have to pay more
money to get a new ID issued.  But it is either that or have this horrible
picture of myself in my wallet for the next four years  *sigh*


#202 of 413 by rcurl on Wed Oct 29 07:25:45 2003:

You should be pleased - people will look at it when you present it for
ID and say something like "you look MUCH nicer than that picture". Think
what they would think if the opposite were true....


#203 of 413 by michaela on Wed Oct 29 08:05:31 2003:

Heh. :)

The SoS offices in K-Zoo let you see your picture on a little monitor so you
can approve it. If you hate it, they'll take a new one. I'm in love with that
service since my last picture would have been horrid.


#204 of 413 by scott on Wed Oct 29 13:18:03 2003:

The Ann Arbor office has that little monitor, too.  Trouble is, I was so
blinded by the flash I probably would have approved a photo of Saddam Hussein,
let alone the crappy photo of me that ended up on the license.


#205 of 413 by gull on Wed Oct 29 14:05:46 2003:

I deliberately didn't smile for my picture this time.  I figure when
some cop pulls me over and looks at my license, I'm sure as hell not
going to be smiling, so the picture might as well match.


#206 of 413 by other on Wed Oct 29 14:50:15 2003:

I pulled a "Flash" and held up a mask of Nixon in the instant the picture 
was taken.  Unfortunately, they looked at the picture and, quite puzzled, 
decided to take another.


#207 of 413 by mynxcat on Wed Oct 29 15:26:15 2003:

They don't let you chose the picture you want in Ohio. And I change my 
hair so much, I rarely ever really look like my picture anyways.


#208 of 413 by tod on Wed Oct 29 16:34:08 2003:

This response has been erased.



#209 of 413 by keesan on Wed Oct 29 17:47:08 2003:

I got about 2 hours sleep due to pills that I have to take through Friday.
Tried to sleep again after taking the next pills (before they took effect)
but it sounds like someone outside has been sawing up a tree with a chainsaw
and dumping the results into a truck.  I can sleep Sunday all morning.


#210 of 413 by i on Thu Oct 30 03:21:57 2003:

The hard drive which appeared to die in our main server has, after being
swapped out, worked perfectly.  Ditto the server, leaving us wonder which 
component(s) actually failed - after well over a year of uptime, too, so
diagnosis may well be impossible. 

While torture-testing the "failed" drive this morning, another drive on
the same SCSI bus failed...and that failure persists.


#211 of 413 by aruba on Thu Oct 30 04:24:03 2003:

It's the solar flares.


#212 of 413 by mcnally on Thu Oct 30 08:30:48 2003:

  The solar flares definitely messed up the ISP I'm working for these days.
  They knocked out our link to the (Canadian) mainland, cutting us off from
  the rest of the world for most of the afternoon.

  On top of that I'm told I missed a fine display of northern lights last
  night.  I went out to look around midnight but either I was too early or
  I need to go someplace with a better view of the northern sky.


#213 of 413 by jep on Wed Nov 5 03:51:47 2003:

I hit a deer this evening.  No one was hurt, but I did a lot of damage 
to my car.  I'm not sure if it'll be totalled.  AAA claims (over the 
phone) said probably not but the tow truck driver and police officer 
said probably yes.  The front end is smashed in, the hood is bent, the 
windshield is smashed, and the air bag went off.

Over the weekend I had $550 of repairs done to the car.  It is a 1992 
Taurus; tpryan sold it to me 2 years ago.


#214 of 413 by goose on Wed Nov 5 04:11:59 2003:

I'm sorry to hear that John.  I know that when my Jeep was crushed by a tree
(and subsuquently totalled) AAA gave me some of the money back for repairs
that were just done on it.  I did have to provide receipts.  Dealing with the
total loss unit was not a very pleasant experience, but it was partially due
to the guy I was dealing with being fired mid-process.  Overall I've been
quite happy with AAA and making claims.


#215 of 413 by jep on Wed Nov 5 04:22:28 2003:

Three years ago, I totalled my Mercury Topaz due to black ice.  It was 
a 1989 Topaz, three years older than the Taurus.  I seem to have a 
thing for killing cars that are 11 years old.

Goose, when the Topaz died, that's when I bought your old car.


#216 of 413 by other on Wed Nov 5 05:10:09 2003:

Impression:

Broad-based right paracentral mixed disc protrusion at the L3-L4 
level results in recess stenosis.

Grade I anterolisthesis at the lumbosacral junction secondary to 
bilateral pars interarticularis defects of L5.  This results in 
moderate neural foraminal compromise bilaterally.

Concentric annular tear within the posterior aspect of the L4-L5 
disc.

   :(  :(  :(


#217 of 413 by willcome on Wed Nov 5 05:17:29 2003:

Hi! I'm willcome here!


#218 of 413 by tsty on Wed Nov 5 10:17:28 2003:

and welcome as well ... welcome to grex!


#219 of 413 by i on Wed Nov 5 11:38:02 2003:

Re: #213
Ouch...but glad you're not hurt.  Meg's gotten fast & generous pay-outs
from AAA when her cars have been wrecked - keep us updated ('specially
since i just renewed with them...:).

Re: #216
Even allowing for my medical illiteracy, that doesn't sound too good.
How's the treatment prospects?


#220 of 413 by mary on Wed Nov 5 13:12:06 2003:

Re: #216  Ouch.  Looks like a lumbar-lami on the 
horizon.  Bummer, Eric.


#221 of 413 by remmers on Wed Nov 5 13:38:00 2003:

Yep, slipped disc.  Those are not fun, and you have my sympathies.
(Saw similar medical language when I had mine a year ago.)


#222 of 413 by scott on Wed Nov 5 14:04:39 2003:

re 216:  Ouch!  Sorry to hear that, Eric.


#223 of 413 by edina on Wed Nov 5 14:25:42 2003:

John, glad you're ok.  Eric, feel better soon!


#224 of 413 by aruba on Wed Nov 5 14:56:03 2003:

I'm glad you're OK too, John.  And Eric - that sounds like what I had; at
least the L5 part.  Is the pain in your leg?


#225 of 413 by jiffer on Wed Nov 5 15:21:10 2003:

Ew! Ouch Eric!  Good luck with healing. 

IBB for minor reasons, mainly that my microbiology test may be upped to 
the 14th instead of the 26th....We had to vote in class concerning 
this.  I need my procrastination time! And this time I wasn't 
procrastinating that much.  Grrr, so I seem to still be 
procrastinating.  Don't get an education.  


#226 of 413 by gull on Wed Nov 5 15:48:32 2003:

Re #213-214: Remember that the insurance company's first offer is just
that, an offer.  It's subject to negotiation if you can show that a)
cars like yours are selling for more than they're offering you for
yours, and b) that your car was in good condition.  You will have to be
persistent, though.  Insurance companies don't make money by being generous.


#227 of 413 by mynxcat on Wed Nov 5 16:28:13 2003:

We underwent a reorg here. Reorgs are never good. Apart from that the 
internet nazis have blocked my personal email site. Bastards


#228 of 413 by rcurl on Wed Nov 5 17:09:58 2003:

AAA gave us the NADAguides.com value for our car that got totaled - and
then also reimbursed us for our deductible after they pried that out
of the at-fault driver. This was pretty fair - especially since we had
paid less than the NADA value for the car at the time of purchase. 


#229 of 413 by tod on Wed Nov 5 18:23:27 2003:

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#230 of 413 by mcnally on Wed Nov 5 19:32:27 2003:

  That can be pretty annoying.


#231 of 413 by jep on Wed Nov 5 19:40:27 2003:

NADAguides.com says my Taurus is worth about $1800.  If AAA gives me 
that (minus my deductable) I will be very pleased.  When I totalled my 
Topaz, I got about $600, I think, and that was after they waived the 
deductable.

The body shop where I had my car towed said it will almost surely be 
totalled because an airbag, itself, costs around $1500 to replace.

re resp:226: I tried to dispute about the Topaz, but got nowhere at 
all.  I was plenty persistent but it did no good.  I thought I was 
supposed to get enough to replace the car with a comparable one.  It's 
not easy to find a car for $600 that one would be willing to drive.


#232 of 413 by gull on Wed Nov 5 20:52:13 2003:

It's not easy for $1800, either.


#233 of 413 by other on Wed Nov 5 22:46:23 2003:

I have a slipped disc (l3-l4), a ruptured disc (l4-l5) and bone 
damage to the vertebra (l5).

What's a lumbar-lami?  Fusion of vertebrae?


#234 of 413 by rcurl on Thu Nov 6 02:02:10 2003:

http://www.esurgeon.com/scripts/content/treatmentoptions/back-decompressive
lum
barlaminectomy.html


#235 of 413 by other on Thu Nov 6 02:36:31 2003:

Thanks, all.  Fortunately, though I have regular back pain and 
cannot stand up for twenty minutes at a time without considerable 
discomfort, I do not have leg pain or numbness.  Yet.


#236 of 413 by bru on Thu Nov 6 04:10:30 2003:

jep, what happened to the deer?  Was it killed or did it run away?  If killed,
did you get to keep it for processing?


#237 of 413 by michaela on Thu Nov 6 10:08:10 2003:

IBB I've had severe insomnia for a week. I'm about to try melatonin since the
usual stuff is only keeping me asleep for three hours. :( This is really
starting to aggravate me.


#238 of 413 by tsty on Thu Nov 6 10:51:18 2003:

damn, other ... taht really sucks. was tehre some incident in the past
that mght ahve contributed to your current grief? 
  
i have a littel numbness in middle-toes, now and then. nothing in my
past, though, that would indicate a current problem.


#239 of 413 by jep on Thu Nov 6 13:52:37 2003:

re resp:236: Bruce, the deer was killed.  Someone stopped to see if I 
was all right, then politely asked me if I minded if he took it.  I let 
him take it and he came back with his sister, and they took it away.  I 
don't know how to process a deer and also, since I live in an 
apartment, wouldn't have any place to store the meat anyway.


#240 of 413 by edina on Thu Nov 6 14:28:40 2003:

Yum, venison.  I do love venison.


#241 of 413 by gull on Thu Nov 6 15:09:29 2003:

Bumper-tenderized!

The old beater Volvo I recently bought hit a deer a few weeks before I
bought it.  The damage was limited to a smashed right front turn signal,
which the previous owner replaced before selling me the car.


#242 of 413 by keesan on Thu Nov 6 15:12:49 2003:

The deer was not damaged?


#243 of 413 by gull on Thu Nov 6 16:37:32 2003:

It ran off, so apparently not seriously.


#244 of 413 by aruba on Thu Nov 6 16:49:30 2003:

John - I've always wondered what it would be like to be in an accident where
the airbag opens.  Do you think it helped prevent you from being hurt? 
Could you see over it, and could you still steer?  (My car predates airbags,
so forgive me if these are dumb questions.)


#245 of 413 by gull on Thu Nov 6 16:56:41 2003:

I've never been in an accident with airbag deployment, but from what I've
heard they don't stay inflated like in sitcoms.  They inflate, and almost
immediately deflate through vents in the bag.

I'm curious about John's experiences too, though.


#246 of 413 by bru on Thu Nov 6 17:21:39 2003:

there is a place outside of clinton you used to be able to take the deer to
and they would process it for you for a fee.


#247 of 413 by jep on Thu Nov 6 18:45:06 2003:

About the airbag... no, it didn't do me any good.  I did get a slight 
welt, about 4 inches long and resembling a scratch, from the airbag 
deploying.  My 7 year old, sitting in the front seat next to me, was 
completely uninjured.

The airbag went off with a "bang" and a little bit of smoke, and 
afterward, briefly made me think the car was on fire.  The police told 
me that 90% of reported car fires in accidents are from the airbag 
deploying and are not really fires.  I didn't realize the airbag had 
gone off until I had the car stopped.  It was later that I sorted out 
my impressions of the accident and tied the "bang" sound to the 
airbag.  Accidents are confusing because a lot of unfamiliar things are 
happening all at once.  (The crash, the fate of the deer, the airbag 
going off, making sure my kid and I were all right, the damage to the 
car, making sure we got out of the road so we wouldn't get hit by 
another car, etc.)

The airbag inflated, deflated, and then hung from the center of the 
steering wheel.  It was not in the way of me steering.  It definitely 
wasn't an obstruction for me seeing out of the car.

If I make it to where the car is stored right now before they take it 
away, I'll try to take a few pictures so you can see what the airbag 
looks like after it was deployed.


#248 of 413 by jep on Thu Nov 6 19:20:19 2003:

I have not been a believer in air bags in the past, and am not one now 
after my experience of Tuesday night.

I think driver-side air bags are enough of a danger to enough people 
that they should not be standard equipment on vehicles.  If I were 
given the choice, were I to buy a new car, I'd choose to not have an 
airbag.

Passenger side air bags *kill* children.  I definitely don't want a 
safety device on my car which might kill my son.  If I get a newer car, 
I'll be trying to find someone who can disable the passenger side 
airbag for me.  I'd prefer not to get a car that new.

On my old car, the air bag shouldn't have gone off.  A newer car has 
sensors which would have prevented the air bag from deploying for that 
type of accident.  How are those sensors going to work on present-day 
new cars when they're 10 or 15 years old?  I wouldn't bet on them 
working very well.

Once the air bag goes off, the car is essentially ruined.  The assessor 
told me it costs $1500 just to replace the airbag, once it's gone off.  
Insurance companies typically total the car, even cars only a couple of 
years old, *just* because the airbag went off, according to the man who 
originally towed my car.


#249 of 413 by happyboy on Thu Nov 6 19:27:06 2003:

did you have those *deer whistles* on your bumper?

they cost about 7 bucks (no pun intended)


#250 of 413 by tod on Thu Nov 6 19:49:29 2003:

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#251 of 413 by rcurl on Thu Nov 6 20:33:48 2003:

"Deer whistles" have been tested, and they do not work to prevent car-deer
collisions.

It has been shown from analyses of accidents that air bags save many more
lives than they cost. Children that are so young they might be injured by
an air bag should NOT be seated in the front seat. (I think I also read
that air bags are being given smaller charges to compromise on the chances
of injury by the accident vs by the airbag, but of course older airbags
are not being recalled.) 



#252 of 413 by tod on Thu Nov 6 20:59:37 2003:

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#253 of 413 by slynne on Thu Nov 6 22:04:42 2003:

Resp:248 - if the car is totalled because it costs too much to replace 
the airbag and since you dont like airbags anyways, why not just fix 
the car and *not* replace the airbag


#254 of 413 by cmcgee on Fri Nov 7 00:27:25 2003:

I was in a collision that crunched the driver side of my car and the front.
Airbag went off, saved me from the windshield and was replaced along with the
panels when the insurance company had the car fixed.  


#255 of 413 by bhoward on Fri Nov 7 00:46:21 2003:

My mom was in a very similar accident a few years ago.  Some idiot kid
triggered a multicar collision that resulted in several totalled cars
including hers.

The one thing that saved her life and saved her from serious injury
was the air bag system.


#256 of 413 by happyboy on Fri Nov 7 01:53:09 2003:

re251: SOURCE PLZ.


#257 of 413 by jep on Fri Nov 7 03:37:50 2003:

re resp:253: The person who decided the car should be totalled told me 
he'd counted $5500 in damage before he stopped.  About $1500 of that 
must have been the airbag.  I'm not much interested in putting $4000 
or more into a 1992 Taurus with 140,000 miles.

I'd be interested in a source for resp:251, too, if it's available and 
you don't mind, Rane.  I'm inclined to believe you on statistics... 
but am also inclined to distrust airbags because they *are* such a 
danger to children and small adults.  Whether they're a good thing 
overall or not, the fact is, the risk to my son goes up a lot if he 
rides in the front seat of a car that has an airbag, compared to one 
that does not have one.



#258 of 413 by rcurl on Fri Nov 7 03:55:26 2003:

For example,

http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/people/injury/airbags/208con2e.html


#259 of 413 by gelinas on Fri Nov 7 04:00:21 2003:

I thought happyboy was asking for a source about the futility of deer
whistles.


#260 of 413 by rcurl on Fri Nov 7 04:12:21 2003:

He didn't say which assertion. For deer whistlesm try
http://www.usroads.com/journals/rmj/9705/rm970503.htm


#261 of 413 by gelinas on Fri Nov 7 04:52:24 2003:

I like the taped dog-barks. :)


#262 of 413 by keesan on Fri Nov 7 05:26:10 2003:

Isn't the back seat safer to ride in, with or without airbags?


#263 of 413 by tsty on Fri Nov 7 09:12:50 2003:

 ...ant reach teh brake pedal ....


#264 of 413 by gull on Fri Nov 7 14:01:56 2003:

Re #262: 
"We want to make sure parents are clear: Old air bag, new air bag, no
air bag, kids are safer in the back seat properly restrained," said
Ellen Engleman, chairwoman of the National Transportation Safety Board.

http://www.sptimes.com/2003/08/27/Worldandnation/New_air_bags_safer_fo.shtm
l


#265 of 413 by tpryan on Fri Nov 7 19:20:25 2003:

re 213 and followup.

        John, good to hear you are okay.


#266 of 413 by jep on Sat Nov 8 04:49:46 2003:

Thanks!


#267 of 413 by scott on Mon Nov 10 18:00:33 2003:

Had cat-owner friends staying here over the weekend, and my nose started
running.  All those years of being a cat owner... and I always had a slightly
runny nose.  Huh.  


#268 of 413 by glenda on Mon Nov 10 19:00:31 2003:

IBB we just got a call from the Drs office.  Staci has mono.  Now I have to
get STeve and Damon in to get checked (I probably won't need to be checked,
I had it in high school).  And I get to figure out how to keep HER rest.  She
is bummed because Huron Players (she does backstage tech stuff) is getting
ready to start rehersal and set up for theater competition.


#269 of 413 by tod on Mon Nov 10 19:27:54 2003:

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#270 of 413 by happyboy on Mon Nov 10 21:09:55 2003:

oooooOOOOOOOOO00000000!!!!!!


#271 of 413 by glenda on Mon Nov 10 21:29:11 2003:

We kind of wondered when she would get it.  Seven of her friends have had or
have it during the last few months.  The friends that we refer to the cuddle
puddle, rather than the "Hi, how are you, we should get together for a movie
sometime" friends.  I knew it was just a matter of time, but hoped...


#272 of 413 by dewshine on Mon Nov 10 22:26:39 2003:

I have mono.

 Woo.


#273 of 413 by tod on Mon Nov 10 22:35:41 2003:

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#274 of 413 by happyboy on Tue Nov 11 01:04:04 2003:

*cuddle puddle*


    heh.


NEW PORNO TERM!!!!


#275 of 413 by other on Tue Nov 11 02:33:19 2003:

With all her concubines, how could she even begin to guess the source...?


#276 of 413 by dewshine on Tue Nov 11 02:39:10 2003:

  ::laughs::



#277 of 413 by other on Tue Nov 11 02:44:00 2003:

you're only laughing because i love you.


#278 of 413 by dewshine on Tue Nov 11 02:48:32 2003:

 Amen to that.

 (And for the record, I love you too ;P)


#279 of 413 by tsty on Tue Nov 11 09:31:00 2003:

/sniff 


#280 of 413 by happyboy on Tue Nov 11 17:01:15 2003:


/**cudddle puddle**


#281 of 413 by jaklumen on Wed Nov 12 03:30:21 2003:

The flu that's been going around caught up with me-- should have 
expected it as members of my extended family (in town) had been sick 
and then my daughter ran a fever a few days ago.  So I'm taking some 
extra vitamin C (in addition to my usual supplement the psychiatrist 
ordered) and seeing if taking an echineacea(sp?)/goldenseal supplement 
will help.  Also drinking more fluids... chicken broth, water, 
grapefruit juice-- stuff like that.


#282 of 413 by tsty on Wed Nov 12 11:08:22 2003:

no fu sht?
no flu shot?


#283 of 413 by edina on Wed Nov 12 15:13:22 2003:

Because a flu shot prevents every type of flu.


#284 of 413 by jiffer on Wed Nov 12 17:44:18 2003:

And what a lot of people call the flu is typically not the flu. 


#285 of 413 by keesan on Wed Nov 12 17:59:53 2003:

Flu shots only prevent what their makers decided is/are the most common flu(s)
for the current year.  Each year we get a new mutation.


#286 of 413 by rcurl on Wed Nov 12 18:25:10 2003:

Some protection is better than no protection at all. However your choice
should depend upon your risk. There is some risk from the flu shot itself.
But some people are at greater risk from flu that others. So - place your
bets. I get the flu shot.


#287 of 413 by tod on Wed Nov 12 18:48:02 2003:

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#288 of 413 by jep on Wed Nov 12 18:52:57 2003:

I'd mentioned that I hit a deer and totalled my car.  Now I'm dealing 
with the insurance company.

AAA offered me $900 for the car; $1150 minus my deductable.  I said 
that wasn't enough.  They offered me $1200 ($1450 minus the 
deductable).  I said you cannot buy a running car for $1450.  I said 
KBB.com evaluates my car as being worth $2000.  They said I can't use 
KBB.com because they don't sell cars.  I protested that that's how 
people *decide* what to charge for cars, and asked what my options were.

They said to get them 5 ads for similar cars and they'll consider 
whether they should give me more.  I found 5 ads for 1992 Taurus's, for 
$3000, $2500, $2200, $2000 and $1800.  Supposedly they're supposed to 
give me an average of what similar cars sell for.

They said they will now take up to 2 more days to evaluate my car 
again.  If they give me $2050 (the average minus $250), I will consider 
myself ahead of the game.  If they give me $1800, I will consider it a 
fair settlement.  If they stick with $1200, I will be bummed.

I'm also bummed that it's taken over a week (accident was last Tuesday) 
to get the dang insurance settled.  It's not the worst thing in the 
world, but it's annoying.


#289 of 413 by tod on Wed Nov 12 19:00:22 2003:

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#290 of 413 by rcurl on Wed Nov 12 19:12:03 2003:

I'm amazed that your insurance company is going along with haggling over
the payment. 

When we had a car totaled, it took several months to get the insurance,
which I would expect in any case. They have to get the police report,
to start with, and then inspect the car themselves, etc.


#291 of 413 by mynxcat on Wed Nov 12 19:57:10 2003:

When I had my car totalled, I got my payment within 2 weeks. And this 
includes the time that the first check was lost in the mail, and they 
issued me a second check. I have been led to believe that that is a 
pretty normal timeframe. And I got about $3200, after my deductible, 
which was higher than what I'd paid for the car, to start with


#292 of 413 by edina on Wed Nov 12 20:23:10 2003:

Gary's insurance paid out in about 3 weeks.  He was in a brand new Jetta
within 4 weeks.


#293 of 413 by keesan on Wed Nov 12 21:16:48 2003:

People on chemotherapy are instructed not to get any vaccines because there
is a chance of getting infected by the weakened virus used in them.


#294 of 413 by jep on Thu Nov 13 00:40:31 2003:

Yes, there are still some 1992 Tauruses out there.  I was driving one 
of them until a week or so ago.

I'm surprised I seem to have found an effective means of disputing the 
payout for my wrecked car.  (If I have indeed found means.)

Why would it take months to get a claim completed?  It took about a 
week to get my check, the last time I had a totalled car.  What would 
someone do who didn't have another means of transportation while they 
waited for their claim check?  It seems to me that could be quite a 
problem.


#295 of 413 by mcnally on Thu Nov 13 01:07:42 2003:

  Try reasoning the other way around..  Imagine you're an unscrupulous
  insurance company with a strong financial interest in keeping your
  payouts as low as you can get away with.  Now imagine you've got a
  customer who didn't have any other means of transportation and for
  whom being carless was creating a serious problem.  What do you think
  would be an effective way of getting him to accept a lowball payout?


#296 of 413 by keesan on Thu Nov 13 01:31:29 2003:

Do you have to pay higher premiums after you wreck a car?


#297 of 413 by jep on Thu Nov 13 02:30:52 2003:

I probably will this time, since a collision with a deer is considered 
to be your fault.

Three years ago, my rates didn't go up because the other driver was at 
fault.  I'd slid on some black ice and stopped; she'd slid and crashed 
into me.


#298 of 413 by keesan on Thu Nov 13 04:13:34 2003:

I have a library book on Roadside Michigan, which devotes several pages to
roadkill.  Apparently there are a lot of roadkilled snakes and turtles because
the like to crawl out onto the warm asphalt in the morning to raise their body
temperatures.  Raccoons are the most common roadkill in S. Michigan (I would
disagree - I see more squirrels).  And the author says it is difficult to
avoid deer because they suddenly dart out onto the road.  Coyotes are now
found in Lansing and the ones that got this far east apparently come from a
line of ancestors that learned to avoid cars, and you don't see them
roadkilled.  I wonder if they teach their kids how to cross the road.

Occasionally there is a roadkilled vulture  - they feast on roadkill.


#299 of 413 by charcat on Thu Nov 13 07:04:22 2003:

I hit a 4 point buck tonight with my 92 taurus, scared me to death but not
much damage to the car (can't open the passenger's door), couldn't find the
deer I hope it's not hurt too much. 


#300 of 413 by fitz on Thu Nov 13 10:24:18 2003:

It's open season on '92 Tauruses.  Huzzah!  Go get 'em, deer.


#301 of 413 by bru on Thu Nov 13 12:14:08 2003:

92' taurus must be deer magnets.  Need to take one up north to the cabin
during hunting season for bait.


#302 of 413 by rcurl on Thu Nov 13 15:54:13 2003:

One factor that delayed our insurance payment was that the car was totaled
in Ohio and the paperwork went through the Ohio State Farm system before
it got to ours in Michigan. The local Ohio police were also very slow in
getting their report to our insurance carrier. I presumed that this sort
of bureauocratic bungle was par for the course. 



#303 of 413 by gull on Thu Nov 13 18:52:56 2003:

Re #289: As someone who is currently driving around an '86 Volvo, I'm
amused by that question.

Re #295: This is why it's a good idea to have a car rental rider on your
collision insurance.  If you're actively costing the company money while
waiting for them to pay up, they're a lot more likely to work out a deal
with you quickly.

Re #302: State Farm also consistently has one of the highest rates of
consumer complaints about slow payments, fraudulant actions by
adjusters, etc.  You might want to consider switching insurers.


#304 of 413 by tpryan on Thu Nov 13 19:23:47 2003:

re 288.  Looks like you did some good research.  Also consider
presenting them with the recent repair bills.  New brakes on 
a car should make a difference between an $1800 car and a 
$2200 car.


#305 of 413 by jep on Thu Nov 13 23:06:49 2003:

re resp:299: Now there's a coincidence!

re resp:301: Shall I inquire about keeping the car, Bruce?  You could 
tow it to your hunting cabin and see if any deer are fooled.

re resp:304: As this was suspension work, I think the repair bill might 
reduce the perceived value of the car, not increase it.  I did mention 
I just had $550 in repairs done on the car.

My claims adjuster called; she'd promised to be back in touch in 2 
days, but requested to be given until Monday.  Maybe she'll be kind to 
me.  I said okay, but added that it's costing me a lot to drive my old 
pickup truck.  It's costing AAA, too; the car is at a lot somewhere, 
they're paying for storage for it, and they can't take it anywhere 
until they settle up with me.


#306 of 413 by tod on Thu Nov 13 23:10:45 2003:

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#307 of 413 by russ on Fri Nov 14 01:36:40 2003:

My good modem bit the dust, and it's something like a week
to get through the RMA system.


#308 of 413 by richard on Fri Nov 14 05:47:19 2003:

IBB Art Carney died this week at age 85.  If you ever saw the classic
Honeymooners tv show, Carney was Jackie Gleason's sidekick.  He was
Gleason's second banana for year on the Jackie Gleason Show and the
Honeymooners.  Later he originated the role of Felix Unger in the Odd
Couple opposite Walter Matthau as Oscar.  He also won an academy award for
playing the lead in "Harry and Tonto", a wonderful movie about an old man
who travels across country with his cat.

Coincidentally, the original 39 episodes of the Honeymooners are being
reissued as a DVD set this week.  If you are a student of tv history, and
great comedy, this is a must have.  And not the least because of Art
Carney, who was Ed Norton, and stole every scene he ever did on that show.
Gleason as Ralph Kramden and Carney as Ed Norton were later memorialized
in cartoon form as Fred Flinstone and Barney Rubble.

Art Carney RIP.  He was one of my favorites.


#309 of 413 by tsty on Fri Nov 14 07:14:49 2003:

wow- my '92 taurus is wirth *taht* much!!! time to sell!!!  i suppose i
oughtto replace theexhaust manifold first, though.


#310 of 413 by bru on Fri Nov 14 14:52:07 2003:

Take it hunting first!


#311 of 413 by aruba on Fri Nov 14 15:52:38 2003:

Re #308: Not to take anything away from Art Carney, Richard, but it was Jack
Lemmon who played Felix Unger in The Odd Couple.


#312 of 413 by mcnally on Fri Nov 14 17:16:10 2003:

  Art Carney apparently was in the Broadway production of "The Odd Couple"
  until he had to pull out due to drinking problems..  Or at least that's
  what one of the obituaries I came across said..


#313 of 413 by tod on Fri Nov 14 17:32:57 2003:

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#314 of 413 by tpryan on Fri Nov 14 19:08:26 2003:

        Interesting that the Michigan Outdoors/Practial Sportsman shows
mentioned that the averge cost of a deer taken in firearms season
costs on the order of $1,600-$1,700 each.  (after license, travel,
lodging, etc).  Almost as much as a '92 Taurus.


#315 of 413 by goose on Fri Nov 14 19:15:43 2003:

RE#313 -- Explain please?


#316 of 413 by tod on Fri Nov 14 22:19:11 2003:

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#317 of 413 by remmers on Fri Nov 14 22:26:18 2003:

Re 311, 312:  Right, Art Carney originated the role of Felix Unger
on Broadway.  Jack Lemmon played the character in the movie.


#318 of 413 by tod on Fri Nov 14 22:28:42 2003:

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#319 of 413 by remmers on Fri Nov 14 22:35:50 2003:

And in the TV series.


#320 of 413 by aruba on Fri Nov 14 22:50:24 2003:

Ah, thanks for the info about Art Carney on Broadway.  My apologies for
correcting you, Richard.


#321 of 413 by scott on Fri Nov 14 23:24:15 2003:

Stupid Red Cross website... I'm on a short course of prednisone, so I checked
the website to see if I could still donate blood.  The website claimed that
medications were generally not a problem, here are some exceptions.  
Of course after getting to the donation center and sitting around for 15-20
minutes I finally get asked about medication, and get a quick "oh, of course
you can't donate now".  Bahstadss... fix your damn website.  I'm happy enough
to donate, but I'm getting pissed at the organization.


#322 of 413 by remmers on Sat Nov 15 15:02:26 2003:

A mediocre movie from the 1970s about the life of Scott Joplin
had an excellent performance by Art Carney as John Stark, Joplin's
publisher.


#323 of 413 by scott on Sun Nov 16 18:37:24 2003:

One of the side effects of prednisone is depression... I suspect that's why
I'm in such a bad mood today.  :(


#324 of 413 by happyboy on Sun Nov 16 19:17:09 2003:

depression is a little bit different than a bad mood.

you're not thinking about opening a vein or anything, right?


#325 of 413 by scott on Sun Nov 16 19:25:05 2003:

Nah.  It's an uncharacteristic sort of bad mood, but nothing worth worrying
about.


#326 of 413 by keesan on Sun Nov 16 20:39:19 2003:

One of the causes of depression is continued overcast weather.  May I ask what
the prednisone was prescribed for?  I have taken it for fleabite allergy as
well as lymphoma.  In my case it caused no depression but lots of agitation
and difficulty sleeping.  The fleabite pills came as a 7-day kit in which you
decreased the dose each day so as to avoid sleepiness when discontinuing it.
I had extreme fatigue for two days after discontinuing a very high dose (100
mg) but the fleabite dose is only 5-10 mg.


#327 of 413 by glenda on Mon Nov 17 00:50:34 2003:

I took it for an dermitological allergic reaction.  I took it for about a week
and noticed no side effects at all.  Staci took it for 3-4 days for poisin
ivy, she had a very bad case which got infected, again no side effects.


#328 of 413 by scott on Mon Nov 17 02:10:49 2003:

Persistent cough after a really nasty cold a few weeks ago.  The prednisone
was prescribed to reduce the inflamation in my throat.


#329 of 413 by keesan on Mon Nov 17 02:49:26 2003:

Also try gargling salt water to disinfect.


#330 of 413 by scott on Mon Nov 17 13:28:03 2003:

Shouldn't be any infections, since it's been several weeks since all the other
cold symptoms ended.  


#331 of 413 by tod on Mon Nov 17 22:45:22 2003:

This response has been erased.



#332 of 413 by willcome on Tue Nov 18 23:44:08 2003:

He sucked in Hamlet.


#333 of 413 by jaklumen on Thu Nov 20 21:34:54 2003:

resp:303 I will agree with the comment about State Farm-- I switched 
to Progressive when they jacked my rates after a few accidents.


#334 of 413 by jep on Fri Nov 21 03:08:35 2003:

The accidnet bummer-ness continues; I lost the title for the car and 
had to order another one.  It'll be a couple of weeks before I get the 
money from AAA.


#335 of 413 by beeswing on Fri Nov 21 03:40:34 2003:

Exhausted. Sad.


#336 of 413 by scott on Sat Nov 22 14:06:36 2003:

Went running yesterday and me knee didn't like it all.  Hope it's fully
recovered by tomorrow.


#337 of 413 by scott on Sat Nov 22 19:13:09 2003:

Decided to tear apart my office and rearrange everything, but in the process
found that the big butcher-block desktop needed to be reglued in the middle.
So now I'm going to have an incredible mess and no office for a day while the
glue cures.


#338 of 413 by richard on Sun Nov 23 04:28:56 2003:

#335...trish, why sad?


#339 of 413 by beeswing on Tue Nov 25 00:10:38 2003:

School was wearing me out, on top of relationship troubles. 

Feeling better now. :/


#340 of 413 by scott on Tue Nov 25 02:01:29 2003:

Welcome back, bees.  Seems like you've been absent lately...  


#341 of 413 by beeswing on Tue Nov 25 04:19:03 2003:

Yeah. My brain is pretty much the consistency of fried eggs by the end
of the day. Much to think about these days.


#342 of 413 by tsty on Tue Nov 25 05:26:15 2003:

ham and .... ?


#343 of 413 by tod on Tue Nov 25 16:55:56 2003:

This response has been erased.



#344 of 413 by remmers on Tue Nov 25 17:04:29 2003:

(I assume you're referring to Meg Geddes' turkey recipe.  I haven't
seen Meg around these parts for a mighty long time, but it's possible
that the recipe is to be found somewhere in the cooking conference.)


#345 of 413 by tsty on Tue Nov 25 18:16:11 2003:

or many m-b0x gen.cf incarnations.
  
last saw meg at a small-bar-rock-n-roll palace on michinga
avenue in detroit .. oh, say, 4 months ago. she's doing web
stuff for rockers.


#346 of 413 by remmers on Tue Nov 25 18:56:23 2003:

I bump into Meg at the grocery store now and then, but never online. :(


#347 of 413 by gregb on Tue Nov 25 18:59:25 2003:

I'm bummed for mutiple reasons:

1) Hospital bills from my Ma's eye surgury
2) Paying for a car that got trashed, and now a replacement.
3) Spent a weekend trying to upgrade a friend's PC with WinXP and
   couldn't get any of his USB/WiFi stuff to work.


#348 of 413 by jaklumen on Tue Nov 25 22:43:48 2003:

Well, I *did* get a job for the holidays, but it's stalled thanks to a 
farking background check.  Grrr...


#349 of 413 by jaklumen on Tue Nov 25 22:45:40 2003:

To be more specific, I started, because my boss really needed someone, 
but the mall management wouldn't let me continue without the 
background check.


#350 of 413 by happyboy on Tue Nov 25 22:49:08 2003:

hey, are you gonna be one of those hillshire farms
sausage and cheese hostesses?!


#351 of 413 by other on Tue Nov 25 23:03:47 2003:

A shopping mall is requiring background checks?  For what kind of 
position?  If it's retail, then what is it in your background that 
caused you to fail it?


#352 of 413 by happyboy on Wed Nov 26 02:43:54 2003:

was it that time you wagged yer sausage at the mall?


#353 of 413 by jep on Wed Nov 26 14:09:57 2003:

I'm bummed because I have a cold.  I don't feel too bad from it, but 
have a heavy cough.

Also, I slept about 3 hours last night, for no particular reason.  I do 
fine on 5 hours, but 3 makes for a hard day.


#354 of 413 by gull on Wed Nov 26 14:38:58 2003:

Re #351: I didn't get the impression he'd failed it, just that he was
sort of stalled while waiting for it to be completed.


#355 of 413 by flem on Wed Nov 26 16:01:55 2003:

The only mall-type thing I can think of that might require a background
check would be some sort of Santa/Elf thing.  They will cheerfully check
the background of anyone who might come into contact with children these
days.  


#356 of 413 by other on Wed Nov 26 18:17:24 2003:

Or a security position, is what I was thinking.


#357 of 413 by other on Wed Nov 26 19:11:35 2003:

IBB 
http://www.aclumich.org/modules.phpname=Downloads&d_op=getit&lid=12
puts focus on me individually where it should be focusing on Grex.


#358 of 413 by gregb on Wed Nov 26 19:17:53 2003:

I kept getting a 404 (not found) error.


#359 of 413 by other on Wed Nov 26 21:46:11 2003:

Oops, left out a ?
http://www.aclumich.org/modules.php?name=Downloads&d_op=getit&lid=12


#360 of 413 by jaklumen on Thu Nov 27 02:21:01 2003:

resp:354 resp:355 exactomundo, Santa.  I've done the gig before, and I 
was doing an excellent job.  The background check just needs to go 
through.  The boss is coming to our apartment with the paperwork-- she 
really wants me to be back to work.


#361 of 413 by other on Thu Nov 27 05:27:41 2003:

Someone I knew through a gig I do, but who has moved on and was just 
in town briefly, and whose name I cannot remember, introduced me to 
a friend of hers when we randomly met this evening while I was out 
shooting pool with other friends.  The friend was absolutely 
stunning and I think I have no way of actually arranging to meet her 
again.  :(


#362 of 413 by willcome on Thu Nov 27 07:28:00 2003:

whore


#363 of 413 by i on Thu Nov 27 14:03:25 2003:

Re: Background Checks
My impression is that retail losses to sticky-fingered employees are
*much* higher than what you'd need to cost-justify background checks.


#364 of 413 by gull on Fri Nov 28 15:06:02 2003:

The question is whether a background check would actually predict how
likely someone is to steal merchandise.  I knew a guy who had a
succession of low-paying retail jobs, all of which he stole from, but he
was never prosecuted, just fired.


#365 of 413 by i on Sat Nov 29 01:17:34 2003:

I wouldn't call it a "background check", but there is the technique of
calling a few former employers listed on his resume to verify basics &
ask a few "would you hire him again?" sort of questions...


#366 of 413 by bru on Sat Nov 29 02:27:32 2003:

Most places won't answer such questions anymore.


#367 of 413 by mcnally on Sat Nov 29 03:45:32 2003:

 I was under the impression that most employers would still answer
 questions where the answer was factual, rather than one that called
 for an opinion -- e.g. reporting that the employee was dismissed is
 safe but giving a personal opinion of the employee's performance 
 is discouraged lest it expose the previous employer to a suit from
 a litigious and vindictive former employer.


#368 of 413 by jep on Sat Nov 29 04:09:11 2003:

I have been told by employers that they (and other employers) will 
only answer questions about dates of employment.


#369 of 413 by bru on Sat Nov 29 04:22:53 2003:

In some instances, telling someone that an employee was fired can result in
a lawsuit, even if they were fired.


#370 of 413 by aruba on Sat Nov 29 04:24:12 2003:

On what grounds, I wonder?


#371 of 413 by anderyn on Sun Nov 30 04:16:47 2003:

I know my office will only say that we were employed there, or are employed
there, not any other information. 


#372 of 413 by jep on Sun Dec 7 05:34:23 2003:

The Brunswick company has this year stopped making Flexible Flyer 
sleds with runners on them.  Naturally, this is the year my child has 
asked for a runner sled.

Hopefully the sleds are still available in stores such as Dunham's.  I 
saw them a few weeks ago.  I guess I'll be out looking tomorrow.  


#373 of 413 by keesan on Sun Dec 7 15:09:38 2003:

Kiwanis has used sleds so let us know if you need one.


#374 of 413 by gull on Mon Dec 8 16:11:28 2003:

I didn't like runner sleds as a kid.  The snow where I lived was always
too soft for them.  The best sled I ever had was a plastic toboggan.  Of
course, it was impossible to steer, but crashing into trees is part of
childhood. ;>


#375 of 413 by gregb on Mon Dec 8 17:12:32 2003:

I know all about sleding into trees.  I did my sleding at my Aunt's 
place.  She had a hill in the back yard that ended in a cluster of small 
trees.  If you didn't turn in time, you'd run right through them, 
invariably ripping some fomr of clothing.  I messed up three pairs of 
pants in one Winter.

Ah, those were the days.


#376 of 413 by jep on Mon Dec 8 21:05:57 2003:

re resp:373: Sindi, how much is Kiwanis charging?  Are the sleds in 
good shape?


#377 of 413 by keesan on Mon Dec 8 23:35:43 2003:

I have no idea as I have not gone there.  They usually have cheap sleds.


#378 of 413 by beeswing on Tue Dec 9 02:25:03 2003:

Muscles aching. I feel like I've done heavy lifting and had shots in my
arms.

Throat pain. Coughing. 

No fever.

I was fine this morning. By 1:00 I was spacing out and feeling weird.


Might have I acquired the influenza that has been running amok and I did
not get a shot for?


#379 of 413 by keesan on Tue Dec 9 02:51:39 2003:

Sounds like you have what Jim had and it will last a couple of weeks.  He also
had no fever.  He had partial laryngitis for a few days.  Try hot baths.  You
will feel tired and probably need to take some time off work in order to get
better faster.  I don't think this is flu.  There are lots of different
viruses going around right now.  


#380 of 413 by beeswing on Tue Dec 9 03:02:22 2003:

Thanks.

Alas, time off is not an option. Getting the kids ready for exams and
I'm being evaluated this week.


#381 of 413 by gelinas on Tue Dec 9 03:03:51 2003:

Hmm.... then you should be able to take some time off in about a week,
when the kids are all out sick with what you've got. ;/


#382 of 413 by beeswing on Tue Dec 9 05:10:00 2003:

Too late. We had 19 kids out today and 2 went home with fevers.


#383 of 413 by gelinas on Tue Dec 9 05:11:49 2003:

Ah.  So you all got it about the same time.


#384 of 413 by albaugh on Tue Dec 9 20:10:45 2003:

The wife of a former colleague and current "town mate", apparently in good
health to look at her, died suddenly on Sunday.  She was only 48. 
Unbelievable.  :-(


#385 of 413 by slynne on Tue Dec 9 21:35:32 2003:

condolences


#386 of 413 by tod on Tue Dec 9 21:47:44 2003:

This response has been erased.



#387 of 413 by richard on Wed Dec 10 02:19:58 2003:

IBB former Illinois Senator Paul Simon died today of complications from
heart surgery at age 75.  Senator Simon was one of the few unabashed
liberals in the Senate who never tried to be anything but what he was.  I
worked for Senator Simon when he ran for President in 1988, in Atlanta and
in Iowa.  He wore a bow tie and repeatedly ignored his own political
advisors who said he looked nerdy and old fashioned wearing a bow tie, and
that he should wear regular ties.  Wearing regular ties wasn't part of who
he was, and Simon was a man of great integrity, and he wasn't going to
change his look or his views to satisfy other people.  Simon's bow tie
became the symbol of his campaign, and appeared on his campaign buttons
and tshirts.  

I met Senator Simon and thought he was one of the most genuine, most
decent of any politicians/lawmakers that I have known or seen.  I was
proud to work on his campaign.  Senator Simon's last public act was this
past Thursday, when-- critically ill-- he spoke directly from his hospital
bed in a telephone interview and endorsed Howard Dean for president.  It
was that important to him to make this clear before he was too sick to
express himself or had died.  

Senator Paul Simon RIP.  A great american.


#388 of 413 by happyboy on Wed Dec 10 02:27:58 2003:

that's sad.


#389 of 413 by jep on Wed Dec 10 02:53:59 2003:

re resp:384: My condolences to her friends and family, Kevin.  It's 
shocking when someone as young as that dies suddenly.


#390 of 413 by albaugh on Wed Dec 10 05:50:12 2003:

It is truly sobering.  They have 4 kids, young middle school through just
graduated from high school.  I don't know details.  I admit to the weakness
of wanting to know details, looking for answers, as if there are any.  
An auto wreck one can at least fathom.  Having lost a mom on Christmas Eve,
I know how painful this will be to them.  For those who believe in such
things, prayers for God's healing would be appreciated.


#391 of 413 by twenex on Wed Dec 10 14:53:50 2003:

Bummer. My condolences.


#392 of 413 by dcat on Wed Dec 10 17:53:01 2003:

the 4-6 inches of snow that fell last friday is all gone, victim to
Pittsburgh's sun (!!) and the rain that fell last night.


#393 of 413 by remmers on Tue Dec 16 19:17:19 2003:

I'm bummed that I've been unable so far see any of the second half
of HBO's "Angels in America", due to other commitments.


#394 of 413 by edina on Tue Dec 16 19:24:35 2003:

time for Tivo, John.


#395 of 413 by remmers on Tue Dec 16 19:36:44 2003:

You're probably right.  I've been thinking about that.  We have
a VCR, but VHS quality stinks.


#396 of 413 by willcome on Tue Dec 16 23:03:18 2003:

It's available via Bittorrent, at
http://69.93.27.226/~suprnova/torrents/762/angels.in.america.chapter.6.hbo.
hdt
v.xvid-sfm.[BT].torrent, if you're into that sort of thing.


#397 of 413 by tod on Tue Dec 16 23:08:25 2003:

This response has been erased.



#398 of 413 by willcome on Tue Dec 16 23:14:52 2003:

Don't ask me.


#399 of 413 by gull on Wed Dec 17 14:32:33 2003:

Re resp:395: VHS isn't so bad if you're willing to run in SP mode.  Of
course, SVHS is even better, but seems to have mostly fallen out of the
market.


#400 of 413 by remmers on Wed Dec 17 15:32:46 2003:

Maybe I'm just fussy, but I don't care much for VHS quality even in
SP mode.  Can't hold a candle to broadcast or DVD.


#401 of 413 by gull on Wed Dec 17 16:18:16 2003:

I have Comcast cable, so my picture is lousy no matter what.

(I've also noticed that "DVD quality" varies widely.  I've watched some
DVDs that had pretty obvious compression artifacts.)


#402 of 413 by krj on Wed Dec 17 16:21:12 2003:

Car repairs on the Taurus with 225,000 miles came in $250 more than I 
had guessed, due to a need to replace the oil pan gasket.  

Ah well, if it runs another 10,000 miles I'll come out ahead, 
comparing repair costs to replacement costs.



#403 of 413 by charcat on Thu Dec 18 04:38:46 2003:

I'll do the charcat high milage tauras chant-dance for ya ken (hey ya hey ya)
oh yea I'm bummed I've got a cold (I hope)  =^-.o^=            


#404 of 413 by gull on Thu Dec 18 14:41:58 2003:

Re resp:402: Good luck!  I'm always impressed by people who get cars up
over 200,000 miles.


#405 of 413 by gull on Thu Dec 18 14:44:19 2003:

(Hey, just think...13,000 more miles and your car will have travelled
the distance from the earth to the moon!)


#406 of 413 by rcurl on Thu Dec 18 17:05:11 2003:

Re #404:...especially without any major engine work. My old Subaru got to
over 180,000 without major engine work, but succumbed to rust. Give some
credit to the engine manufacturers!


#407 of 413 by edina on Thu Dec 18 17:10:33 2003:

I drive a Volvo - I'm 13K away, 12K as of next week.


#408 of 413 by gull on Thu Dec 18 22:59:18 2003:

My Volvo has about 180,000 miles on it.  I say "about" because the
speedometer head has been replaced once, and the vehicle speed signal is
intermittent.  The actual milage is probably higher.


#409 of 413 by jep on Fri Dec 19 04:59:36 2003:

My beloved green Schaeffer Prelude ballpoint pen, for which I obtained 
green ink a couple of years ago, has stopped working.  When I turn the 
bottom, the ink ball doesn't move out, and so I can't write with my 
pen any more.

Worse than that, it seems I can't get another one.  I went to both 
OfficeMax and Staples today and they didn't have them.  Staples (where 
I got it) doesn't even *have* Schaeffer pens.

I did a search for "Schaeffer pen".  The Schaeffer company was bought 
by Bic some years ago, but as of a couple of years ago, it still 
existed as a division.  Apparently it's been merged out of existence 
or something.  The BIC WWW site, bicworld.com, doesn't list any 
products under the name "Schaeffer".


#410 of 413 by willcome on Fri Dec 19 05:11:16 2003:

I'm glad I don't have neurotic attachments to things quite that silly.


#411 of 413 by jep on Fri Dec 19 05:36:25 2003:

It was a false alarm; the company is called "Sheaffer".  I can even 
have my pen repaired.  (It's covered under a lifetime warranty.)  Yay!

Silly it may be.  I have very few attachments to objects, though.  I 
think the world can tolerate that I love my pen.  I use it constantly, 
all day, every work day.  It is obviously time I get a backup or two.

The Sheaffer Prelude ballpoint costs about $30.  They make fountain 
and roller ball pens, as well as ballpoint pens like mine, and they 
also make retractible pencils.  I got my first Sheaffer pen and pencil 
set several years ago, and then didn't use it for a few years.  Since 
I started using it, I really miss it when I have to use another pen.  
That first pen was stolen from my desk and I was unhappy when writing 
for several months before I obtained another.

When you find something that really suits you, you don't want to give 
it up.  My pen really suits me.


#412 of 413 by russ on Fri Dec 19 05:56:03 2003:

It's been almost a full year since the last update of Waiting For Bob.
I guess it's not coming back.


#413 of 413 by tod on Fri Dec 19 23:37:26 2003:

This response has been erased.



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