Grex Agora46 Conference

Item 190: fuck the FTAA

Entered by oval on Sun Aug 31 14:10:52 2003:

http://brasil.indymedia.org/pt/blue/2003/08/262137.shtml
download the .mov!

De Amerikaanse ambassadeur in Brazilie is op 28 augustus tegen een taart
opgelopen.

Hoje, dia 28 de agosto, s 17:30, no Palcio do Itamaraty, no Rio de Janeiro,
um ativista da organizao poltica e recreativa Confeiteiros Sem Fronteiras
tortou o co-presidente da ALCA, o embaixador americano Peter Allgeier.

from indymedia.org:
On August 28, an anti-FTAA activist pied American Embassador Peter Allgeier,
co-president of the FTAA, during a press conference in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil.
[photo | video] The activist, a member of Bakers Without Borders, released
a note protesting the negotiations of the FTAA. The FTAA will concentrate
wealth, increase poverty, and destroy labor, consumer and enviromental rights,
said the note.

The protest also focused attention on the disregard Brazil's government has
shown for a September 2002 unofficial plebiscite in which over 10 million
people voted "No" to the FTAA. Last month, President Inacio Lula da Silva said
at a meeting with George Bush that negotiations will proceed and should finish
by 2005. Brazilian social movements and NGOs protest the continuation of
negotiations. The pieing comes just two weeks ahead of a WTO meeting in Cancn,
which will be met with massive protest. 

23 responses total.

#1 of 23 by tod on Sun Aug 31 14:49:58 2003:

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#2 of 23 by cross on Sun Aug 31 17:31:37 2003:

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#3 of 23 by goose on Sun Aug 31 20:42:04 2003:

I didn't see where to download the .mov.


#4 of 23 by happyboy on Mon Sep 1 01:29:35 2003:

allen ginsberg proposed that all the world leaders get into a
boxing rink nekkid and slug it out with socks full of shit.

i think socks full of shit is a more appropriate tool for
polititians than a sumo diaper.


#5 of 23 by oval on Mon Sep 1 15:05:12 2003:

actually i heard the pie was filled with shit and vomit.



#6 of 23 by russ on Mon Sep 1 23:00:56 2003:

"MY GOD, THAT'S MOOSE-TURD PIE!  It's good, though."


#7 of 23 by tod on Tue Sep 2 16:37:44 2003:

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#8 of 23 by oval on Wed Sep 3 17:01:23 2003:

"Free Trade Area of the Americas"

The FTAA is an expansion of NAFTA, a Proven Disaster

# Its being negotiated without Citizen Input
# The FTAA will undermine Labor Rights, Push Down Wages and cause Job Loss
# It will hasten Environmental Degradation
# The FTAA will hurt Family Farmers
# It will lead to privatization and extreme deregulation of Essential Services
# Corporations will be given outrageous rights to sue Governments
# The FTAA will jeopardize consumer safeguards
# It will spread the use of genetically modified organisms (GMOs)
# It will deny access to lifesaving medicines for millions of people
# The FTAA will make the rich richer and increase poverty throughout the
hemisphere 

can also read some here:
http://www.citizen.org/trade/ftaa/



#9 of 23 by tod on Wed Sep 3 17:17:16 2003:

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#10 of 23 by pvn on Thu Sep 4 06:35:29 2003:

The current administration reps are apparently in PRC right now.  I
gather from the government press over there that the issue of 'floating'
the RMB is an issue.  I don't get this at all.  Supposedly it is a bad
thing that the PRC keeps tight control over the RMB allowing it to float
in a range of less than 1% and maintaining it a 8.26 RMB/$US exchange
rate.  Supposedly it is good for the US for it to float.  I don't get
that.  Supposedly it would be a good thing if the $US was worth less.
I go over there to visit and I am supposed to be happy that things are
more expensive?  Plus the benefit to the PRC with a controlled currency
was for example it was able to withstand the asian bust recently - so
floating it would be good for them?  Why would they want to do that? 
Why would we want them to?  I don't get this one.


#11 of 23 by gull on Thu Sep 4 13:56:20 2003:

It's pretty simple.  Letting the RMB float would make it easier to sell
goods manufactured in the U.S. in China.  Bush needs to win at least
part of the labor vote to win the next election.  Get it?


#12 of 23 by gull on Thu Sep 4 13:57:15 2003:

(Actually, that's a bit of an oversimplification.  The issue isn't so
much selling American-made goods in China, it's making the Chinese goods
more expensive in the U.S. so American-made goods can compete here.)


#13 of 23 by pvn on Sat Sep 6 06:59:58 2003:

re#11: That doesn't make sense.  If the RMB goes up, our goods are more
expensive making the average PRC citizen less likely to be even able to
buy.  IF the RMB goes down everything we buy there is more expensive so
how does that benefit the US citizen?
re#12: Hah. Now I understand.  It is protectionism wearing free-trade
clothing.

If the chinese worker is willing and able to build a cheaper mousetrap
of equal quality and pay to ship it here such that the US citizen will
buy it then where is the problem?  If it is not of equal (or better)
quality then the US citizen won't buy it.  I mean I dunno about you but
I tend to buy what I think is the best deal for the bucks.

Where does it benefit either the PRC or the US citizen to change what
seems to be working pretty well.  They are happy building the stuff and
we are happy to buy whatever.  What disadvantage to the US consumer is
there in the PRC exchange rate controls?  


#14 of 23 by tod on Sat Sep 6 13:24:17 2003:

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#15 of 23 by bru on Sat Sep 6 21:25:16 2003:

problem is if they do make it cheaper and better, and they drive the jobs out
of the auto plants, who is going to be able to buy the car?


#16 of 23 by drew on Sat Sep 6 21:32:58 2003:

Just about everybody else? Depends on how much cheaper in terms of hours of
take-home pay required to purchase.


#17 of 23 by scott on Sat Sep 6 23:34:23 2003:

Depends on the time-frame.  If nobody in the US has a  job, then there's no
market for cars, even if they're cheap Chinese cars made with prison (slave)
lahor.

That's one of the classic stories of US free-market industry, actually. 
Henry Ford gave his workers well-above-average salaries, and as a result his
workers were able to afford Ford cars.  


#18 of 23 by gull on Sat Sep 6 23:42:03 2003:

Cheap, shoddily made goods will always drive more expensive but
well-made items out of the marketplace, because there are always a lot
of people who can't tell the difference.  Look at tools, for example --
even Craftsman tools are poor-quality junk made in Asia, these days.


#19 of 23 by drew on Sun Sep 7 02:08:22 2003:

Auto workers cannot comprise the *entire* market for cars - or even a large
fraction. As they expect to buy other things as well with their paychecks (ie,
food, housing) and the car company has other expenses besides labor, there
has to be income from outside the group of auto workers.


#20 of 23 by carson on Sun Sep 7 05:45:25 2003:

(sure there are.  in a simple economic system, it could include the very
food sellers and landlords you cite in your third sentence.  alternatively,
it also could include those damn tax-avoiding rich people that aren't
paying their fair share for government expenses.)


#21 of 23 by tod on Sun Sep 7 15:15:20 2003:

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#22 of 23 by gull on Mon Sep 8 15:03:05 2003:

All SUVs look like shiny toys to me.  What's your point? ;>


#23 of 23 by tod on Mon Sep 8 16:49:08 2003:

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