For any who are unaware, there are some net-news groups that might be
of interest to the readers of this conference.  I personally know of:
alt.magic
alt.pagan
alt.folklore.herbs (new)
     I'm sure there are more.  If you know of them, go ahead and put them
here.
     Peace,
     C

25 responses total.

Note, Chris, that should be alt.magick with a "K".  The alt.magic
group discusses prestidigitation, and doesn't appreciate it when
weirdos like us post there.

Also, there is a Pagan mailing list.  The address is:

        pagan-request@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu

Rather than all of us subscribing--which takes up too many resources--could
someone subscribe and then post the best of the postings to an item here?

I'm already on it, so I could try making the Digests available for
public consumption.

     OOPS!  Good thing I didn't subscribe, though I'd have figured it out
when TRN wouldn't find alt.magic.  Rob, if you could make the digests
available, that would be good.  I can pursue doing that through GEnie, which
gets newsgroup digests for those who ask on the Internet r/t.  I don't know
what's involved exactly yet, but if it's not too hard, I could do it that
way.
     Chris

Okay, the new Pagan Digest is available on-line in /u/robh/pagan/pagan76.
To read it, from the Ok: prompt type:

        !more /u/robh/pagan/pagan76

Or without the ! from the grex% prompt.

Great, Rob!  Thanks.

Another pointer-response:  The same directory now contains another
dighest, this one number 78.  !more /u/robh/pagan/pagan78 to read
it.

Before anyone asks about issue 77, the file pagan76 was actually
issue 77.  Sorry about the confusion.

Anyone reading alt.pagan right now. Alot of bickering as usual, but of 
paerticular interest is a discussion of the Norse tradition. Very cool,
they're getting into the subject of seperatism and "bloodlines" etc...
It has gotten of course quite nasty! But alot of good info is flying.
Any insights?
-phaedrus

you have more patience than I, to wade through the flame wars, 
"I know secrets but I won't tell you what they are", and assorted bullshit on
alt.pagan.  Please pass on anything substantive that actually shows up.  I 
have some notes on runic magic, etc. if you want me to pass them on.

Kami,
PLease do. I had thought for a while that runes were for divination only. 
More and more I'm getting the idea that it's more than that. Is that so?
Peace,
phaedrus

yeah! I'm going to put the baby down so I can type with both hands, and if I
don't time out first I'll try to summarize a couple of classes.

Phaedrus,
Kami seems to have lost the thread so if you don't mind I'll try to answer
your question.

Indeed, the runes are used for much more than divination.  I actively 
practised runic magic for three years before I ever did any divination with
them!  There are a number of groups who work with rune magic in this
country including: The Ring of Troth; The Rune-Gild; and the Asatru Free
Assembly which have groups called 
"Kindreds" here and there.  I have corresponded with them but have never 
joined or attended their rites.  One of their ranks is a prolific young man
named Edred Thorsson.  

Edred has written a number of books including: "A Book of Troth"; "Rune 
Might"; "At the Well of Wyrd"; "Futhark"; and "Runelore" (by both Weiser and
Llewellyn Press).  The system put forth in these books is a very effective 
and intellectually stimulating (as Runic lore can be very convoluted and 
complex).  I have read them all several times and would recommend them to
anyone interested in a 
MODERN runic magic system,.... with a few words of caution....
Edred and his lot have gotten themselves in some hot water with the rest of
the Neo-Pagan community for some questionable activites, mostly having to do
with performances of some rites that have links to the Nazi era rune 
practices.  

The Norse Neo-Pagan Community has got it's hand full in trying to distance 
itself from Nazi Skinhead groups and racist ideas.  I finally became too
uncomfortable with this and turned to Celtic practises instead.

Good luck to you....   
Fox

Here I am again...
I wanted to mention a couple of other good sources for Runic Studies.
"Leaves of Yggrasil" by F. Aswynn, "Rune Magic" by D. Tyson, "Rune Games" by
M. Osborn & S. Longland, and "Runes and Their Origin" by Moltke.

Aswynn's book is particularly good for giving a more female approach to 
Germanic religion (which is pretty masculine in it's focus).  In my opinion,
stay away from Ralph Blume's (sp?) books, they're full of Christianized crap.

The groups that I mentioned above are very hard to get into and don't
seem to be interested in giving advice.  If you want some experienced help
with Norse religions try contacting: World Tree Grove, ADF, Box 10036,
Cranston, RI 02910.

Fox

Oops. Wandered off of the item topic a bit..(sheepish grin)
We can carry this one to Runes (Item 23).
Fox

Well, Ragnarok itself is Christianized crap.  No religion would have
even sub-mortal gods die as part of the end.  In fact if one reads
the description of Ragnarok, it sounds a lot like the Christian end
of the world.  Why?  Because it is.

why is this not suprising that Christianity would polute most old pagan
religions when they sent in sojers & priests  (occationally difficult to tell
one from the other) in to pagan lands W/ swords, saying, co"convert, or die"?

re: #10.  Sory. forgot all about it. sigh.
re: #15- maybe.  the Celtic gods seem to be often dying, being transformed,
traveling to other worlds and, in the case of some heroes, being unable to 
come back, etc.  Gods are not static in their existence.  Moreover, some
Native American and South American religions seem to have tales of an 
apocalypse.  Just because the Xstians picked up an idea and ran with it, maybe
even transported it, doesn't mean they're the only ones to have come up with
it, or that it's invalid.

re:#14- uh, right.  good idea.

You're right on track Kami!  I want to respond to #14 about Ragnarok but
fear that it will get too far off topic for this area.  So I'll start up an
item (probably #29) called comparitive mythology to discuss it.
Hope to see ya there...
Fox

Coming back to the alleged topic...  Those with Internet access can
use Lynx to get in touch with a new Pagan net resource in the UK.
Enter Lynx, then use the (G)o command and enter...

        http://tardis.ed.ac.uk/~feorag/html/plhome.html

It's interesting, even if we can't go to any of their meetings.  >8)

hmph.

heh

Scoff, Scoff!
/

meeep!

Enough Drift.  I admit I've done it too, but it is time to return to
the original topic.  I think I'll have to go back a few lines before
I can actually do that but... *Vidar, stop drifting!*

Re#17: Okay, so maybe it did happen.  But since Thor's hammer, Mjolnir
can resurrect as well as slay, would the surviving Gods be stupid enough
to leave the other Gods dead?  Something like that makes the story sound 
like bullshit in the first place, even if it is not Xtianized perversion.
Ragnarok is used to explain why people stopped practicing the religion,
though the real reason is that these pagans married with Xtians (ick)
and comprimised until they themselves finally became Xtians (the very
thought disgusts me).
        As to the other races being destroyed, I scoff at that!  They
are only described as gone, because no one believes (sorry if I'm
getting a little Tolkeinesk here) in them.  Secondly, the Gods and
the Jotuns were both hyperintelligent species.  In fact, though the
orginal gods were human in form, their children were mostly Half-Giants.
Destroying the dwarves?  How is that possible when it was the dwarves who
created the weapons for the gods?  Destroying the Svartalf (Dark elves)?
The lived on Asgard, and Ragnarok never mentions anything that could have
killed them off, except Muspellheim's fire.  Muspellheim engulf itself and it's
inhabitants? After almost completely destroying Yggdrasil the ash tree of life?
 Why would that happen?

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