Maybe I'm just a flake, but I'm curious as to whether
any of you have had a similar experience.  Have you
ever been in a church, temple, or even newage bookstore,
soothing music is playing, incense is wafting through
the air, and you suddenly get this feeling of overwhelming,
smothering, PEACE!?  Yes, yes, I know that this is one
of the functions of religion, balm for the soul and all that.
Sometimes I welcome it, but at other times it seems a
foretaste of death, being beyond caring, the need to strive
entirely gone.  Okay, have any of you encountered this?
Even if you haven't, you're welcome to psychoanalyze me,
if you dare...

204 responses total.

Brett...you are not a flake...just a victim of "Universal Love and
Light"    ARRRGH!!   I refer to it as the loo-loo la-la syndrome
usuallty found at New Age festivals and overpriced bookstores.
I think they are trying to lull you into a false sense of 
security so that you will open up your heart as well as your
wallet  or your purse.   Irritating isn't it?

I know this sounds like a paradox (it does to me anyhow) but I don't
ever really feel at peace or even happy unless I'm striving for something.
I don't ever feel at peace except when everything is at stake and the only
thing LEFT to do when everything else has been done is to make peace
with the situation.  I only feel at peace when I see where I'm heading.
My security comes in being unsure at each turn.
Does that make even a tad bit of sense?

Re: #1
Yup, I hadn't thought of it that way, but you're right.  A lot
of the places you run into "Universal Love and Light" are out
for a portion of your wallet as well.  And to think I've been put
off by religious institutions that say up front that they
want some cash from you.  At least they were honest about it.

Re: #2
This makes a bit of sense to me.  I don't court uncertainty, but
when I'm faced with it, I'm not happy unless I'm actively doing
something about it.  Sitting around waiting for things to take
their course drives me nuts.

I guess I find something a bit dishonest or unrealistic or self deluded about
"sweetness and light" religion, which seems to go with that sort of lulling
atmosphere.  I find a pragmatic approach, something along the lines of the
"serenity prayer", much more comforting.  And I want solutions, not platitudes!

I can't believe I'm reading this...THIS IS GREAT!!! Thank you Brett!!
This has been one of my major stumbling points with Paganism! I'm a Witch,
and I believe in Peace, AND love, but PLEASE get out of my face with that
sweetness and light!! Oi!
It is incredibly dishonest, and almost aquiesent to everything. "Oh, that's
ok, we *love* you..." I also love huggs, and kisses, but it's almost expected
that protocol at gatherings. I know many people that are uncomfortable with it,
and I really try to respect peoples space.

I'm a hug junky, but now and again I just want to be left alone, or someone 
doesn't feel right to me.  I'm too blunt to be tactful about it, I just say
"I'd rather not, sorry." But I really don't know how to interract with 
mundanes very well.  NOt much experience, thanks be given.  
I try to be gentle with people's preferred paradigms; they haven't given me
permission to change them, after all.  But sometimes it isn't easy to keep
my opinionated self to myself.

well, by all means, get them out in the open, at least when i'm around. 
differences if opinion are what keeps the world running, and me learning.

I agree dang, talking about the things we feel strong about is the 
only way to progress. (IMHO:)
And keeping in mind that opinions change, how can you lose!??
Kami, your lucky you haven't had to deal with mundanes much, where
do you live??!! For me the weekly outing to see Pagan people keepos
me going! 

It's not where I live, it's that I was not at all well sociallized before
I met the SCA, the pagan community, and fandom.  I have stayed where I felt
welcome as much as possible since then.

My problem is that I'm too middle-of-the-road.  Mundane folks
consider me a bit eccentric while those toward the other end
of the spectrum consider me too mundane.  Sigh...
My personal opinion is that I'm mad as a hatter, but I just
don't look the part.

The only way to stay sane in this crazy world is to be a bit mad.
Me, I was the token "conservative" at one place I went to school; I ate meat,
didn't jump on bandwagons, listened to the opposition, and even considered
voting for a really responsible Vermont Republican (tm) now and then...

Acctually Brent, some of the most bizzare people have to look
normal just to hide thier weirdness.
As well, it sounds like both you *and* Kami are being true to 
yourselves, and not joining the ever growing movement of 
"conformity to Unconformity"! Ugh, the shock tatics really bum me
out! Unfortunatly, I was one of those black wearing, loud and annoying
kids. Oh well.
I find that ussually when Pagans find you too mundane, it means you have a
well rooted grip on reality, and don't see faeries in every room. Keep 
your objectivity, be ready to accept, but that good sense will keep you 
"sane"
Has anyone had the experience of being in a magikal situation, that just felt
unreal?? I think sometimes people think the Craft is going to mean some very
sensory experiences, and it can happen, but my experience has been more subtle.

Well, I DON'T see faeries in every room, just the yard, the park, the arb,
my front room, and other bits and places.  Do you?  Really, they aren't all
"faeries", either.
I find black so drab, anyway.  I do the rainbows and full skirts stereotype,
but without the pachouli oil, and I did go through my excessive jewelry 
phase, just not THAT excessive, nor for that long.

But it does seem strange to be considered relatively sane... :}

the litany of me and my friends:  "what!?  us sane?!"

Re #14:  I figured you'd come up for air on that one.  I was
just waiting for you to catch up on your reading.  And only
a minor amount of capitalization.  Nice restraint.

I love black simply because I look damn good in it!! ;-)  But those
nouveau wiche types with the dead white face and the black nails and/or
lips drive me insane.  I mix my patchouli with cinnamon and I too went
the excessive jewelry bit....and still do at rituals....:->
Loo-loo lala's are goofy and make the resrt of us crazies look
moderately approachable.  Anyone got any sandlewood incense
for me?  I have probably just gathered up alot of bad karma....

(re #15:  i never use capitalization, except in some proper nouns.  don't
ask me why, but it's only on grex.  maybe i should start?  who knows.)

Dang or dang ;->    I get ragged on by *some people* for all my
ellipses.  Let's go start an item about why we type the way we do
and state if we want correction.  (I am giggling madly while I write 
this so don't any of you take this seriously).

i don't know arwen... (i don't want you to leave this item...) If Y'All
WAnT tO ... TYPE funny, ... that's FiNe with ((me))

TyPe FunnY?/  Now noT Wht yu mEan.....\

But is there anything really wrong with universal love?

Universal love is too often used as this giant band-aid, IMNSHO.
We need to recognize the Universal Dark as well as the Light

Ok...her comes my peace and love self...
Nothing is wrong with universal love, but it's not as easy as it sounds I 
think. And it doesn't have to be complacant and weak as it is often 
portrayed. I agree Arwen, it ussually is a big bandaid, on the finger, when
then  arm has been severed! But I don't think that love has to be tempered by
hate, perhaps a little  reality.

Ok...this is making better sense to me.  I want a world of
peace and happiness but I guess we have to make it peaceful
and happy. Yes?

I agree, Phaedrus.  I never meant to imply hate just a very
healthy dose of reality.  Yes, we have to make it happy and
peaceful for ourselves.

ahh, so reality is universal darkness?  :)

Dang.....close your eyes...that is reality. teehee

hmmmmm well there is another conference in which we discuss reality.

re 16 I love black too, as well as white, purple, blue, red, green, and gray.
      as well as many assorted tie-dies, but I get a real power trip from 
      black, and a real felling of cleanliness from white. Other colors have
      different effects.

re 27 is that all there is to reality though?

re fUnnY TypIng fine with me too.

No, canis...to fully understand reality, you should close your
eyes and then walk forward very fast.   When you hit something...
that is reality.

Ouch!  I just got a bruise from Reality!  Waaah!

don't know about you, but when i close my eyes, i don't see black. 
usually reds, yellows, greens, and blues.

Actually, the wildest thing to have happen is to close your
eyes and still "see".  It happens to me sometimes when I'm
just waking from a dream.  I open my eyes and see the room, but
when I close them, the dream just continues on where it left off.
This is really much more entertaining than watching random
flashes of color.

Yes, brett...I have experienced that as well.
Much fun.

ditto.  Sometimes I can stay half in and half out, so the dream continues 
while I get up and and hit the shower.   Doesn't work if I have to talk to
anyone, though, so I haven't done that in a longish while.

I've done that quiet consiously once. While I was in Japan. It happened like
this:   
        I was asleep, and at some time in the night I remeber seeing like a
        white light, and knowing that someone was communicating with me. In
        fact she was trying to give me directions through the trains to 
        where she was (big train system in Japan). Well at one point she 
        asked or I wanted to know what time it was. So I woke up rolled over
        looked at my watch and rolled back over closed my eyes and told her
        that it was 5:30am. It was so weird. It was weirder when I asked her
        about it and she said that she had, had a dream around the day I had
        mine. Interesting, eh?
I don't usually dream much, but alot of people tell me that I've been in there
dreams, even before they knew me. I can't remeber there dreams, though. I wish
I could help people with there nightmares and dreams. Well I'm open to 
comments.

wow!  neatness!  I've never done anything like that. I've been able to help
people with nightmares just by working on the room wards and general 
atmosphere, or feeding them lavender and chamomile, or minor trance work,
and I've done a bit of dream interpretation- entirely free form and intuitive.

What a wonderful experience, though.  Marvelously useful.  Be neat to get to
where you could do it on purpose.  Seems like a cross between "astral travel",
lucid dreaming, and "telepathy".  Hm.

Japan's an amazing place.  Loved it.  Want to go back, but not without a
guide- too scary otherwise.  Saw a  lot of wonderful shrines, especially to
the Fox goddess/trickster.  Prefer the north- now, doesn't that just figure?...

<arwen mutters damn yankee>
I have been woken up several times by "voices" in my dreams.
Once was when someone was breaking into my apartment.  I heard 
(clear as an astral bell) a voice say..."danger"  I sat up
in bed just in time to see my dog go flying off the end of 
the bed and attack someone in my living room.  They left abruptly.
(Basenjis may be small, but they can be nasty).  This is 
mostly remarkeable due to the fact that I sleep like the dead!
But Iwas grateful to have been woken up.  Iwas able to phone the
police and when they got there all they found were footprints.

Yankee?  You becha, sweetie.  Wanna start a war over it?  Nah, been done
before, hasn't it? <g>
Did the cops ever catch the asshole?  What were the other occasions?

I sleep lightly or heavly, depending. If I don't wanna wake up then you can't
wake me, but if I'm expecting it I wake up in an instant.

- Backtalk version 1.3.30 - Copyright 1996-2006, Jan Wolter and Steve Weiss