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Grex Mnet Item 6: Can you feel the noose getting tighter?
Entered by tsty on Tue Jul 16 07:42:46 UTC 1996:

How do YOU think the current el Presidente has done on individual
rights? Is Billy Boy honoring his Constitutional OBLIGATION to uphold
teh Constitution ... or is he doing the reverse?

17 responses total.

#1 of 17 by bdh on Tue Jul 16 09:39:58 1996:

You sure you got the right conference? Uh-huh.

#2 of 17 by bdh on Tue Jul 16 09:42:24 1996:

Oh, I get it, you are pissed off because he dropped support for
gays when he realized that the 10% figure was an urban legend.
I always figured he supported gays because he thought they'd give
better blow-jobs than Hillary.

#3 of 17 by void on Tue Jul 16 10:50:56 1996:

   the 10% figure isn't an urban legend. what the guttmacher institute study
found was that only 2% of gay males were comfortable admitting to german
people that they're gay.

   billy boy's not doing the best job in the world, but i'd still rather have
him than dole.

#4 of 17 by bru on Tue Jul 16 15:03:32 1996:

It is an urban legend, void.

#5 of 17 by goose on Tue Jul 16 17:13:53 1996:

Is not!

#6 of 17 by pfv on Tue Jul 16 17:26:13 1996:

I find myself (unfortunately) agreeing with void on the clinton/dole 
stand... And it is REALLY pissing me off.

The only justification I can find to ease my concious is the simple fact 
that Clinton is so goofy and ineffectual that Congress is gonna' simply 
roll over him (and cheering for Congress is damn near as scarey).

Each day I watch another polito-commercial I find myself hoping for that 
elusive "third-party" - The republicans keep picking extremists and the 
Dem's keep printing "Mo Money".. I suppose in the latter days of our 
great union/empire it is only to be expected, but GEEZ - where the hell 
has all the common sense gone?

I dunno, I guess life is complex enough without letting this get me 
down.. "whatta woyld" ;-/

#7 of 17 by void on Wed Jul 17 12:29:30 1996:

   re #4: no, bru, it is not an urban legend. the guttmacher institute study
defined homosexuality so narrowly that had equivalent criteria been 
applied to heterosexuals, a good number of them wouldn't have fit the 
category. in order to fit the guttmacher institute's definition of 
homosexual, people had to be (among other things): male, in a monogamous 
relationship for 10 years or more, out to their families for 10 years or 
more, have never had intercourse with a member of the opposite sex, and 
(i think) had to meet certain educational and economic criteria.

   secondly, if the 2% figure were truly accurate, then *every* 
homosexual person in the country would have had to show up at several 
marches in washington, along with some foreign gays, lesbians, and 
bisexuals. do the math.

#8 of 17 by bru on Thu Jul 18 04:59:21 1996:

I don't think there has ever been 5 million homosexuals in one place in any
march, I doubt there has ever been tha many people at any march for any
reason.

#9 of 17 by steve on Thu Jul 18 20:26:51 1996:

    Bruce is likely right about the number of people at any march,
not that that matters much.

    Something that really interests me about the gay-rights debate
is the seeming focus on the 10% figure.  I doubt that we'll ever
have a truely accurate figure.  However, I know that in my life,
an astonishing number of people I've known have turned out to be
gay or bi.  I've never tried counting them, but its felt to me
like 5% to 10% is a reasonably figure.  Not "common" perhaps, but
still ever present.

   ...And, what do the numbers matter, anyway?  Lets assume that
there really is only 2% of the population thats gay--does that
mean that their fight for the right to be treated as human beings
is any less important?  I think not.  I do find it amusing however,
that certain right-wing Christian organizations talk about the
numeric figures involved.

#10 of 17 by void on Fri Jul 19 08:31:15 1996:

   thanks, steve, for pointing out the futility of arguing over numbers, and
for injecting a little sanity.

#11 of 17 by eskarina on Fri Jul 19 14:37:39 1996:

Now that I think about it, I think I have actually met and talked to more gay
or bi people than I have met or talk to extreme right wing Christian people.

#12 of 17 by steve on Fri Jul 19 17:58:03 1996:

   I can believe that.  Gay/Bi/Lesbian folk are throughout the spectrum
of racial, social and political arenas.

#13 of 17 by pfv on Fri Jul 19 18:32:35 1996:

It also heaviliy depends on where you live. Let's keep a touch of sanity, eh?

#14 of 17 by bdh on Sat Jul 20 02:14:17 1996:

Most legitimate accepted scientifically validatable and replicable studies
come up with 2%+-.5%.  These include by the way a gay sociologist from
NORC.  The key is replicable.  What this means is that you apply the same
methodology to a population and get the same results.  Its 2% guys/gays no
matter how you cut or form the cookie.  Two Percent, less than jewboys,
less than'niggers'.

#15 of 17 by tsty on Sat Jul 20 05:28:16 1996:

what was that last "classification?"

#16 of 17 by tsty on Sat Jul 20 05:29:30 1996:

 ... and the next-to-the-last????

#17 of 17 by bru on Sat Jul 20 15:50:15 1996:

Thts the tsty influence.

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