I have a problem (sorta common these days) anyway, The problem revolves
arounbd a program I am running called "Where in the world is Carmen San Diego"
 Carmen will only run with system 4.1 and finder 5.4 or better. 
Here is the problem. Carmen is 508K and My system is 300+ k thus making it
impossible for both these two to reside on the same disk.

My question is. can system be pared down to be only a certain size?
what is needed and what is not needed?? I know that I could probably
ditch the Image writer doc and the clipboard, but what else could be
dumped so thaI can have both these on one disk and won't have to be
switching disks like mad everytime that I play the game.

Any help will be greatly aprieciated.

160 responses total.

On the Utilites/Tools disk, which should have come with the computer,
there is a program which will make a start-up disk based on the most
basic system configuration and a finder file.  Then when you reboot 
using this as the startup, you'll be using the smallest amount of
memory possible.  Of course, you won't have things like printer
capability, DAs, or INITs.  You won't even have but a couple of
fonts which the system uses.  But you will have more memory available.

Although the minimal configuration includes only a system file and
a finder file, don't just drag and drop any system onto the startup
disk as you'll probably be taking along a system file that has
unnecessary goodies aboard like extra fonts and calendar and such.

If you're new to the Macintosh, Jim, I'd suggest you'd find the 
book, _The Macintosh Bible_ extremely helpful.  It's well written,
comprehensive, and gets updated frequently.

Jim, you need a hard drive. Almost all programs are designed now for 
use with hard drives, and all new computers come with them. You could
probably get a second hand one moderately cheaply (and there are scads
of computer gurus on grex to help you connect it - or even sell one to
you!).

 hmmm.. thanks mary and rane. I did buy a couple of noworking
external drives from the U. I am looking into getting a hard drive, 
but then the question shifts to.. How big and how much should I e{{x
expect to pay for one.

What's your computer?

Jim, I kow you have a Mac 512KE.  Adding a hard drive means adding a
SCSII port, not suported by the 512.  My advice would be to go to the
U of M Property Dispo.  They have a LOT of Mac plus computers they are
dumping for $250.  Take a system disk with you and make sure that the
machine you want will boot off both disks and that the screen looks OK.
The plus's have SCSII ports and you can get new external 40 M drives for
about $225.  I doubt you will need more than that on a plus.

You can also post an ad to see if anyone has a Mac Snap SCSII upgrade
that'll fit your machine.

  I think what I am going to do for the moment is to get one of these external
drives working,and work off that for now. I know that UM is dumping Macpluses
at 250... I was about to buy one when things at work got messy. Just my luck
i guess. I was told by someone (n8pqj) that I could add a non scsi hd to the 
mac. I just hope that things at work get back to normal before these things 
disappear.

  There were some non-standard hard drives for the Mac, with weird controllers
and software, but good luck finding one at this point.  You might try posting
an article in comp.sys.mac or misc.forsale.computers (or both), to see if
anyone still has one...

Too bad you don't have a PC, Jim (8->): hard drives are cheap, and come
on a card.

 shut up, rane  ;->

 I do have the software to install a HD, it's just down to the matter of 
buying one that works, and the last time that I checked Prop Disp, thet
were fresh out of HD's for Macs.

I have all the pieces, including the software, for a Hyperdrive that'll
work on your 512KE.  Unfortunatly the 20M MMF hard drive has found a new
residance in my old XT.  Give me a good working 20M MMF HD and it's all
yours for $20.  I'd even settle for IDE since I'm about ready to upgrade
the 4.7MHz XT to a 286.

 and what else Klaus, the broomstick of the wicked witch of the west???

where and how will I find this piece of hardware???

and better yet, what will this cost me???

mail me.

I was going to tell you that the 512 accepts an external 20MB HD, and
suggest you talk to n8pqj about it...and then I reread your #6. Anyway,
such drives are out there. Would you like me to ask on crlt:mac.notes,
on the UM conferences?

No, a 512 wont take a hard drive of any sort.  No controller built in.
Apple did make a 20M hard drive that plugged into the external floppy
connector though.  HD 20 is what it was called I belive.

r.e. #11  At this time, I think putting the Hyper Drive into your Mac.
would be more troble then it's worth Jim, now that I give the subject
some thought.  It would take several hrs of my time to install it and
then there remains the fact that Hyperdrive had problems with the things
when they were doing the mod.  Get a plus or SE and save your money for
the time being.  Maybe you can find a HD 20 somewhere, though I've never
seen a working used one for sale.  (Not to mention they are s-l-o-w, but
very reliable.)

  There were other drives besides the Apple one that worked... (several,
actually)...  Look through some old computer magazines.. Or post something
to misc.forsale and misc.forsale.computers - someone probably has one
sitting around, gathering dust...

 It is nice to have all this help. I truly appreiciate it. OK. does anyone 
have the time/capability to repair a m0130 drive that won't read???
I woeven pay for this. I have 2 actually that I got for 5 bucks
hoping that I could find someone that could make 1 working drive for
the mac i have. That would help somewhatI will deliver and pick up
thanks

I did ask on crlt:mac.notes, even without your permission Jim, and got
a response from someone with a HD20 that wanted to know what I'd offer.
I tested $50, but that's not enough to pry it loose (they are using it,
so it is more valuable to them than the "street price" - like my old
Zenith 151 is to me). Sorry.

 No problem Rane. I thank you for the effort. I am really not in the market
for a HD rather to get one of these nice little externals running until I can
cadge a MacPlus from the U (If I avoid the police and save my bread)
I was set back 2 days on the Image writer project, but now that the 
bloodsuckers have been paid, I can once again feather start saving again
for the Imagewriter (er, that was supposed to be feather my nest , but it
seems after 12 hours of playing taxi the only feathers seem to be in my
noggin) so again.... any offers to repair these things??? I will pay ypu
for your time and even drop them off at your pad, and pick it up when
it is done


 as for old Zenith machines, I have a H89 that I have no attachment to.
I'll reserve any further comment.

Why don't you open the drives up yourself and see what you can do?  They
are already broken, you can hardly make matters worse.  (The scews that
hold the case together are located under the self-stickum feet.)
Clean the dirt out of them, use alcohol to carefully clean the heads with a  
cotten swab.  Oil the motor's gears, but not too much!  Plug the drive into
your machine while it's opened up, boot the CPU and watch it do it's thing
when you insert a disk. (Note:  The Mac will not recognize the external
floppy if it's plugged in after being booted!!)  If you see the drive not
do something, try to figure out why and fix it.  If it seems to be working
fine, but not reading your disk, you may have to adjust the head posistioning.
There is a little screw that keeps the head drive stepping motor from turning.
Loosen this screw and rotate the motor slightly first one way then the other
while it tries to read your disk.  Lock the motor down when it reads reliably.

Not the best way to make a drive read, but it'll may get you by.

Yea, I've fiddled with a lot of these things, but I don't have the time
at this point in my life to fix yours.  Sorry.  

(BTW, I got a Mac + from UoM PD yesterday for my kids preschool for $200.
There were only a few +'s left.  Guy said they had sold over 100 of them
in the last 2 wks.  They did have a lot of 512's with Hyperdrives in em
for $125.  I also got one of the last mice and keyboards I could find.  
I got a "parts" 512 for $20 sans internal 400K drive, keyboard and mouse
while I was there.  Logic brd is fine, pwrsupply has a few smoked parts
on it.  I already sold the logic brd for $25 ;-/

Jim, if you have space at your place, I could work on them over
there - sted my place.

 sure. That'd be good TS. Mail me or call me.

 I got an offer in the mail today. I have a friend that will give me a set
of 1 MB chips from his old MacPlus for nothing. Question-- Will I be able to
put these into this machine? According to n8pqj (the former owner) It can 
be upgraded. 
  According to Computer Medic, the chips are soldered in. I don't know
what the actual truth is and I would like to know for sure.
Klaus, do you have a definite answer for this?

Your 512 will not be able to accept the memory out of a Plus.  The Plus
mother board is a major upgrade from the 128/512 models.  The Plus uses
8 bit SIMMS while the older boards use standard DIP packages soldered to
the board.
If your good with a soldering iron however....

 rats.

somebody mentioned soldering??? Is that the only problem, the physical
installation? serious question here.

No, it's the type of memory.  Though I've heard that an additional 512K
of memory can be soldered to the back's of the existing 512K to bring the
total to 1M.  However the PAL also has to be replaced with one having
slightly different code burnt into it, and wires tack-soldered to the
additional chips.
(You like to solder tsty? ;-)

 what is a PAL???

Talk to Bob (N8VIR, I think it is...?)

PAL stands for Programmable Array Logic.  In its unprogrammed state,
it is an array of logic elements.  When you program a PAL, you connect
some of the logic elements, so that the PAL performs a specific logical
function, such as address decoding.

Programming a PAL is a one-shot kind of thing.  Once it's programmed,
you can't change it.  If you want to change the logic function it
performs, you have to program a new one and replace the old one.

re #25, yup.

Jim, a PAL is an addressing chip, for your RAM memory. When I expanded my
Zenith 151 from 320K RAM to 640K RAM, I bought a PAL that let me replace
a lot of the 64K chips the computer came with with 256K chips. Danr's
explanation is certainly more elegant, but perhaps not as functional? 

My response is more general.  PALs can be used for much more than
address decoding.

OK, but I bet the one Jim is concerned with is that little bugger on the
board in his computer.

Is the anticipated mod on Jim's Mac just replacing some chips (soldered)
with other chips (soldered) and maybe some resistor changes and/or
a wire re-route?

 I have been informed by n8pqj that there is a board that I can buy that
will upgrade ze memory... if this is indeed the case, I will go with that
 I don't care for the soldering route myself...

  
   does anyone know the difference between a Plus and SE? 

SE has a more able power supply and  a fan to keep it cool.
SE has the power supply and space to alow mounting of a second
   floppy or a 3.5" hard drive inside.  Some had the super drive
   (400K, 800K & 1.44M)
SE has the keyboard and mouse on an ADB bus, like the newer machines.
SE is a tad bit faster than a Plus.

Other than that, they are pretty much the same.

The +'s can attach a HD externally, just plug-n-play.
Although that may have been obvious.

Re 36: There's one big difference you left out.  

The SE has a "slot", so you can plug 1 board into it.  This makes it
an open architecture, unlike the Plus.  We have an SE at work with a
big B&W monitor connected.  The SE driving a big monitor is
underpowered, admittedly, but it works pretty well.  The only hope
you have for that on a plus is via SCSI, and that slows it down even
more.

re 37: All Macs from the Plus on up have built in SCSI, so
there's no difference. Both can handle external HD's trivially.

Yea, I forgot about the slot.  Find yourself a SE030.  It's a more
able machine, though I'm sure a Plus would satisfy Jim's needs.

- Backtalk version 1.3.30 - Copyright 1996-2006, Jan Wolter and Steve Weiss