Friendships... We all have [or have had!? :-)  ] them throughout our
lives.  I know for me, at least, its been much easier to feel comfortable
having good male friendships since I've discovered bbs'ing back in
the mid-80s. I've really learned a lot about others, male AND female,
but also more about myself...

Anyway, I guess I'll try not to ramble too much right now--but after
spending some time rethinking my values, goals, family issues, etc as well
as spending a lot of time reading, reaching out for ideas and discussions
with others, I've had some interesting conversations around the
topic of 'friendships'.

Please share some of your insights around how your same sex friendships are
special and/or different from friendships with the other sex. Feel
free to share insights and special things about those friendships, too. Also
feel free to share thoughts about how your friendships have changed over
the years, assuming they HAVE changed over the years!?

11 responses total.

Mine have definitely changed over the years!  When I was younger, I looked
at friends in a needy way.  Sure it was give and take, but I wanted a lot!
Now, I look at people (all people) as potential friends.  IMHO, friends share
aspects and parts of their lives, give me insight into my own, but still
retain their individuality.  I think it helps that I have learned to live with
myself and not be so needy.  I have reached a point in my life where, though
I really enjoy being around people, especially friends, I also need time to
myself.  When I have had time to myself, I can give more of myself to others.
Now I find that simpler is better and giving (whether a word of comfort,
actual help or just an ear that listens) makes me feel good.

In my case it was more or less the opposite.
Always on the ready to lend an understanding ear, to give advice and 
help others out.
But, somehow this was stronger within relationships than in regular
friendships.
Nowadays I've become a little bit harder towards others since way
too many people took advantage of my naive (and therefore
volnurable) nature.
The best in all this is that that the few good friends that really
appreciated me for the person I am are still around and the
so-called FFF's have disappeared. Being selective has helped
me a lot, no matter what gender my friends are.
So, I cannot be friends with everybody, nor do I want it.

An interesting aspect of your question Denise, is how same sex friendships
differ from opposite sex friendships.  The first thing that came to mind is
that it is easier to feel love and show my love for a same sex friend then
an opposite sex friend.  I can let myself become aware of loving a female
friend earlier in the relationship without worrying about how that love will
be interpreted or taken.  

As I get older, it becomes more difficult to make good friends.  When I was
in high school, college, a young mother. or even in graduate school, it was
so easy.  I was surrounded by people with similar interests, values, etc. 
Now, it is more difficult, for some reason.  I do keep friends I value.  I
am still friends with my first best friend made in Junior High School even
though I live in Michigan and she lives on the island of St, Barts.

I don't know friends shouldn't change but they do people change we just keep
going. Of course making friends gets harder once we learn what we expect from
our friends, if expect little you'll make more friends, sometimes. Sometimes
you just have to cling to past ones and hope people don't change.

If you do not change, you do not grow.  and go stale!  for me learning 
is the only reason i came here, to earth.  and as i learn, i change.
How can i ask my friends to *not change* when i am continuosly changing?
hippocracy  does not go well with friendship. anyway, a friend in need only,
is no friend.  what i mean is that if you are my friend whenever you *need*
me, i better say *no thanks*, i am better off alone.

what do we strive for in a friend.  why shud there be any expectation?
why shud there be a qualifying marks for a friend to pass the test?
if i can afford to failat times, why cant the friend?


??????

Argh. I'm really divided on this one. Although I understand the natural
dislike of people who are *only* your friend when they're stressed and need
you, I have a coulple of my friends who are next to almost always in need of
someone supportive, and I wouldn't think of dropping them fro the world.
Basically, it's just a matter of would they do the same for you if you were
stressed and they weren't. If the answer to that is a decided yes, then the
best thing is to be there for them. Even if they never end up helping you,
then they're still out there helping onthers. And that's what's really
important.

I agree that It's not about whether the person needs you so much as , 
are they there when they don't need you?  If they're having a long bad 
patch, are they there for others when they can be?  

If the bad patch is lengthy I also want to know whether it's by choice. 
Life is pretty hard for everyone at one time or another, and more often 
than some than for others; but some people seem to insist on having 
disasterous lives...and that's pretty hard on the people who care about 
them.  It's not kind, but when I encounter someone on a self-destruct 
path, I steer clear.  

I know how life can be, so I give people the benefit of the doubt -- but 
I've been there and I know it doesn't get better if you lay there and 
feel sorry for yourself or keep making bad decisions and expect other 
people to bail you out.

Then again, that's because once someone is my friend, I'm very 
determined to be there for them when they need me.  I like to be the one 
people feel safe with, I like to be the one who can help with comfort or 
solutions.  I feel very, very good when I look at the ways my friends 
have grown and prospered and am able to feel that I might have 
contributed to their happiness in some small way.  If people are 
determined to be helpless, the payoff won't be there.  (Yes there is 
*always* a payoff to friendship -- always.)

In a way, I almost find it _more_ rewarding to be in a friendship with a
person who needs help or support.  There are times when hanging out together
and sharing jokes is plenty, but feeling like someone _needs_ your help can
also be nice.  Which, I will be the first to admit, is a somewhat greedy
sentiment, and there are times when I've consciously had to try to keep a
friendship on the 'hanging out' side of things just to keep it from going away
when both of us are happy.
Of course, I've been on the other side of the coin too, and there are
definitely times when it's easier to fish for sympathy than it is to have a
real friendship with someone.  Which is also a Bad Thing, and something that
for a while I had to work to avoid.  Now, thankfully, I'm finding myself doing
it much less often.
Regarding same-sex/different-sex friendships, the differenes I've noticed tend
to be due more to the difference between males and females: it's not that it's
different being in a friendship with someone of the opposite sex, it's that
it's different being in a friendship with a girl.  Personally, I find guys
much harder to confide in or be close to, and much easier to just hang out
or pursue common interests with.  Even still, I find myself just hanging out
with girls a lot more often - something good for a whole lot of taunting in
middle school, but nothing I've really considered unusual.

Well, since girls have been some sort of aliens to me for a long time; at
least for the time I was at school I regarded them as styrange and
incomprehensible. Fortunately that all has changed. But I concur there is a
difference in the friendships between men-men and women-men.
(Hey, who hasn't seen "When Harry met Sally?")
Confiding I only do with people I trust, and think they are to be trusted,
regardless what sex they are. Certainly I hope they do the same with me.
Let me tell you a story abvout true friendships and how I found out by being
in misery.
Six years ago the love of my life dumped me for a much younger man, who was
more reachable than me in that period since with quite some distance apart.
No, we weren't married.
She was at university in one city and I in Amsterdam.
The result was we dedicated our weekends entirely to ourselves.
Well, when she dumped me it just came out of the blue. The week earlier she
had told me she had never somebody as much before as me. (a cry for help; a
guilt creeping up for sleeping with that other guy? the last attempt to keep
this relationship?)
I was devastated and in shambles. This plot became for the next months the
center point of my existance and kept on talking about it to all my friends.
The real friends kept on supporting me without question and the not so real
friend gradually all began to keep their distance.
The real friends I still got, and the rest...
But, now you mustn't think it was only based on my demand..no because both
guys still are my friends and have in the meanwhile been in the shit
themselves. NOt necessary to say that I was there to support them (one lost
a girl and his job in fairly the same period; the other had to spend in
hospital for more than four months because of heart problems).

Friendship:... so many qs and so many expectations.  do these not combine
to kill the relation.  Suppose you are devastated, and you wish that the
person you had helped regain composure, shud come forward and help you.  and
when (s)he does not show up, you are sahttered all the more.

If we think closely enough, is there any chance that given enough time we
would not be able to cope with our own stresses?  i am yet to find out.
It so seems that this was the friend who brough you out of the dungeon, but
was it really possible without oneself realizing what a farce one was in? 
the friend is there, just to talk, while away the time, but it is you who has
to think positive, not the friend.  unless you eat, you will stay hungry.

Yes, it really is swell, if you are sought after as a cathartive.  It seems
good that people come to you to purge their stomachs (read minds) off all the
pessimism etc etc.  But are you being a friend?  May be you are making them
dependent on you.  yes there is but a hairline difference between a
dpendable/dependent friend.  Please do not make them parasites.  if you really
luv your friend you must set them free, to learn for themselves, to seek
whatever they are seeking.  what do you do to them when you make them depend
on you, ?pause and think.

I agree that it is difficult to decide when to leave them free and when to
advance a helping hand, because the threshold of each individual is different.
But what is a friend who does not know where this demarkation is?

??????????

I see the role of parents as a warn backup place, but the children are 
free and not pressed by me, and then you may expect they ask you what 
you would do. But of course start early to build a warm and stable 
marrige with deep love and then all you like, but without unseen work.

I missed that as young man.

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