Where do you/we stand these days in the 'dating' rituals??  How
are the rules changing over time?? Are you finding the guys still
wanting to pay or are they accepting of our offers to help out?
ARE you offering to help pay?  What about asking the guy out for the
first date, are YOU comfortable with this? are THEY?  What else is new
or different? What's still the same?

72 responses total.

I *hate* rituals.

I love rituals!  Well, I love pagan rituals.  I can't stand
the dating ones.  >8)

Ditto what Rob said!  =)  I almost fall over if a guy insists on paying, but
at the same time, he's a shoo-in if he holds the door, lets me go first, pays,
or opens my car door.  I love hopeless romantics...especially the ones who
know how to ballroom dance!  ;-)  I think it's okay for a female to take the
aggressive approach, though.  I am NOT going to wait for my phone to ring!

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 I think doors should be opened for women, but only if they want me to.
(learned that one the hard way!).
 The woman that accompanies me on a date does not have to worry about the
dinner check, opening doors, or anything. I call in the morning, but don't
expect *anything* in return. 
 I can't dance worth a damn, but I have lots of personality ;)

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depends on teh situation, and the guy.  When I was (a little) younger, I was
always insisting on not being put into roes, now I have to admit tha tI like
being treated like a "lady", so long as the guy doesn't mind that I, too like
to be teh "gentleman" (I like holding doors an dstuff)... 
(I was just thinking that I've let guys pay the bill before, but except when
I have been out with friends, or when I was with my boyfriend (ex) when he
was depositing his paychecks in my account have I paid fo ra guy... what a
hypocrite!)
there was something else I was going to say... oh well (oh yes, I love giving
red roses and othe rflowers to guys... I feel as though I've taken over a
ritual)

Lately, I've been having lunch on Wednesdays with a good male friend.  Even
tough we aren't dating, we always argue over the check.  I'm very stubborn
(NO...really?), so lately we've been taking turns.  =)  It works out very
well.  I don't demand that a guy is a chivalrous knight...I can hold my own
door, but I think it's romantic if they want to do it.  I just think it's
cute.  =)  Oh...omni...anyone can learn to dance.  Give me a couple minutes,
and I'll have you waltzing around the room.  <g>

I've warned my son that if he is out with a woman, and she 
presumes he'll be picking up the check, to be afraid.  Very
afraid.  She is probably a housewife in the making.

Tee hee!

Anyway, I am totally junior high when I am interested in someone. It's sad,
very sad. I look them up in the phone book to get an address/phne number. May
call number to hear the answering machine... will hang up immediately if a
live human voice answers. If I really have it bad, may drive by the person's
house... won't hink or anything, will just drive by (well my car honks,m
doesn't hink). Very sick, isn't it? I guess it is my way of getting to know
them more without risking the heartbreak, which always seems inevitable. If
I get to spend time with them, I analyze every word and gesture and try to
figure out what it means, if anything. I wish I could chill out and act like
a normal human being. No wonder my dating life is perpetually in the toilet.

There is sort of a "vibe" I look for, but it's pretty rare.  It's annoying
to meet somebody who I figure out is really compatible, etc., but there's no
vibe there.  

(Vibe?  ... er... Excitement, feeling, um... it's hard to pin down.)

It's a lot worse when one person feels it and the other doesn't.

Interestingly, I have done all of the things you describe, beeswing, as
recently as 3 years ago - when I was 26.  Honestly, I don't think they did
anything to prevent heartbreak; it might have been easier had it been
swifter.

Hmmm - probably not, come to think of it.  Heartbreak pretty much sucks no 
matter how it comes about.  I think one's options are reduced to either 
enduring it, avoiding romance altogether, deciding romance isn't 
important, or committing suicide.  Unless one gets lucky, that is.

  I dunno birdie, I can square dance, but I never learned to dance formally
because the number of dates/girlfriends I've had you can count on one hand.

I agree, anyone can learn how to dance (and it doesn't take a date or a
girlfriend!!)
I very definitely do "sneaky" things like learn their phone number adn where
they live, being on a campus means that ever time I walk by their building
at night I check to see if they're home... don't neccessarily visit...)
But hey, that's the fun of the chase to some extent  it's scary to do more

when hubby and i were getting to know each other, there was
no romance involved. we were just friends, and eventually we became best
friends. so, we never dated, we just 'hung out' and talked and did things
together. we each pid for our own food, beverage, admission, etc. occassionally
we would treat the other.

so, i have never been out on a formal date, and frankly the
idea doesnt interest me. although now that hubby and i are living together
and have merged property and finances, the point is moot. ;-)

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My ex and I had our first "date" on the last time we were together before we
broke up, wierd, huh?

<grins at beeswing>
When I met Jerod, I did quite a bit of detective work to find out his class
schedule and what buildings he'd be in at what time.  I'd often "bump into
him" after class.  (Usually after sprinting across campus).  He never asked
why I was always flushed and out of breath.  ;-)  I learned later that he had
done the same thing with my Color Guard practices.

My favorite opener is "So, when had we agreed to go out together?"
Well, not actually an opener, but let's say after meetiung two times or so.
Holding doors is merely a matter of well-behave and in this I don't
distinguish between both sexes, but it is
the women who take notice.
Not going Dutch is in Holland at least considered as
outdated.

When I first met my husband he would hold the door open for me, but it made
me feel like, he thought I wasn't able to do it for my self.  But now that
I want him to do it (even when I have my hands full) he won't.  He said that
he only did it ot impress me.  But I think a really man should hold the door
open, pay the check and by no meanss expect anything but a "Good night" and
an "I had a wonderful time to night" in return.

So this "really man" - is he allowed to express his feelings and desires to
his loved one?  Or must he wait at her beck and call?  I am not sure how to
take your last sentence, Carrie.

  I'm sure how to take it, because that *is* my philosophy on dating.

A real man is a man that isn't afraid to be honest to himself on
the firsthand, and second to the world around him.
The same goes for women.
If we're talking masculinity however, or femininety, that
is something else.

In this age of rape, sexual harrassment, eating disorders, and so on... I
could not care less who opens the door for me. If  a man opens the door for
I  just say "thank you"... it was a nice thing he did. If he does not open
the door, I don't care. I won't jump all over someone for opening the door
for me.  I have a female friend who opens the door for people regardless of
gender. Who opens the door is so trivial when there are more vital issues at
hand.

(Rape, sexual harrassment, and eating disorders are not exactly
new phenomena.)

Noo! You're kidding, remmers!

Ah, they are not bew, but are comeing out into the open. I just don't see the
point about arguing the door issue when there's life and death issues at stake
now.

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What if the person would be equally likely to hold a door for a man as well
as a woman?  You would not necessarily know that at the time he is holding
the door for you.  Maybe it is not because you were born female.

Yeah, I hold doors for people just because it's more polite than letting it
slam in their face.  I often don't notice their gender at all.

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It annoys me ot death when I am behind someone and they let the door shut
behind them, nearly knocking me in the head. Store doors are notoriously
heavy so as to slow down shoplifters. I don't care if it's a man or woman
in front of me... they see me behind them and let the door slam and I have
to do some blocking with my arm to avoid a concussion. They could stand there
for all of 2 seconds and hold the door until I can get to it.

Hmmm.  I guess I have never witnessed what Valerie describes in #31.

If a male friend gets to the door first, he usually lets me through.  If I
get there first, I let him through.  It just depends on who gets there first.
I just think it's sweet when they add that "After you..." to it.  =) 
Beeswing, door opening is never a major issue on a date with me.  Usually it's
stuff like "What do you like to do?"  "What's your major?"  Not "Who's going
to hold the doors?"  <eg>

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Hmmm... Now I just have to search for all males reading this item...  Aha!
The door police are born!  (Kind of reminds me of the Ontario margarine
police.)

I guess I agree with beeswing.  I don't see that someone trying to be polite
(however clumsily) is worth getting annoyed about.

On the other hand, if you were 6 foot tall and broad with a deep voice and
often, on first glance, mistaken for a male, then when someone holds the door
for you, you would feel honored, especially if it is because you are female.
I don't think it is a big deal, and I hold the door for anyone coming behind
me, just courtesy, but it sure does make my day sometimes...

 I guess then the safest thing to do is ask the lady what she prefers, and
then do it. (Didn't do that with Holly, and she clopped me for holding a door
for her, because didn't I know that she was a person capable of doing that
herself and on and on, then *clop* on the back of the head with the door, and
the obligatory 9 days of sulk).
  That incident cost me a steak dinner ;)

Sounds like courtesy is out of date. Which, I think, may be the question.
In my case it's been part of my upbringing, but I'm not a door thief,
I keep doors for anybody (I might as well put on a uniform and hold
up my hand, haha).

- Backtalk version 1.3.30 - Copyright 1996-2006, Jan Wolter and Steve Weiss