Has anybody read "A Clockwork Orange"? If so discuss. I love the book and movie
and I'm interested in other people's opinions about the sociological,
psychological, and governmental implications of the novel.

40 responses total.

The book also involved the invention of a good deal of language.

A wonderful book!  At first the strange language gets in the way, but
you tend to pick it up quickly.  "...A CLOCKWORK ORANGE...'That's a fair
gloopy title.  Who ever heard of a clockwork orange?'"  Heh.

I didn't know the language was invented. In a class I was taking
we were told it was Slavic.

Can you imagine what it is like for a Dutch guy to read it in 
English! I helped myself by making a personal dictionary to help me out.
Which, alas, haven't got anymore. But by the place in the sentences
I could figure things out quite properly.
In answer to Laughing Bear (who loves little white dove, by any
chance?) I can say that used Slavic words to make them up. But apart from
that there were some words in which I recognized German and maybe even
some Scandinavian.
The story itself was what I thought ahead of its time.
Young gangs strolling the streets at night, killing and bashing
up people in the middle of the night.
The movie...I was only 18 when I saw it first at a scifi-
marathon. Kubrick did a hell of a job. Set me thinking and first..
I was shocked. The way they dealt with people.

You really needed to see the movie before reading the book. That helps a lot on
the vocabulary and languages. (Who is Little White dove? Is this something I
should know?

I have a 1963 book club edition of CO.  It has a Nadsat Glossary.  The
Afterword discusses the language of the book and says it is mostly
based on Russian (e.g. khorosho--good or well--becomes horrorshow),
although it also mentions "gypsy talk" (e.g., cutter for money),
rhyming slang (e.g. pretty polly for money="lolly"), word associations
(cancer for cigarette), schoolboy transformations (e.g., appy polly
loggy for apology), amputations (e.g.  sinny for cinema), and
portmanteau words (e.g. chumble for chatter-mumble).  I have no idea
how well the author of the Afterword understands Russian, but some of
the other slang mentioned seems fairly straightforward, if not
ingenious.

Thanks for telling me that. I never new there was so much thought put into that
language. Very interesting. :):):):):):):)

("*Running* [I think] Bear loved little White Dove" was part of the chorus
of a Top-40-type song in the late 50s or early 60s.  I'm pretty sure not
*Laughing* Bear.)

HMMM, Never heard of it. I don't love little white dove.

re to 5 and 8
You are right. But then again it was before my time.

I think the song was called 'Running Bear' and it was by Sonny James.

 Running Bear was recorded by Johhny Preston in the early 60's.

How about Fred Bear?

The archery item is over in the ing.cf.

HAHAHAHAHA

And Ted Nugent should be over in the music cf

I just picked up a CLockwork Orange yesterday It didn't take me too long to
start to pick up on all the new language.  I'm ashamed to say it, but I've
never seen the movie or read the book until I started it yesterday. I like it
so far.

re #17:
Try to rent a video of it. Malcolm McDowell made quite a convincing
contribution by playing Alex DeLarge (which a suiting name for
such a menace to mankind).
  _  _

the movie was a bit much for me.  book was as fascinating as disturbing.
yup, the language was one of the best parts.

I'm still trying to decide if the movie when it first came out in the
70's (seems to me it was rated "X" at the time) had more explicit sex
scenes than the videotape version does now?  Or is that just a false
memory magnified by teenage hormones?

The movie was rated X.  The sex/violence aspect earned the rating, not the
in/out aspect.  It's hard to say for sure, but I bet the video is not less
than the original as released.

On further memory check, I seem to remember an R version of the movie,
which is what made it to my town.  Maybe the video is of that version.

  In an interview with Pauline Kael(sp?) about her book of compiled film
reviews, she hammers Anthony Burgess for writing the strip/rape scene. 
She says readers/viewers were invited to enjoy the process.  

I'm pretty sure it was rated "X" when I saw it, as it was the first
"X" rated movie I ever went to...

re#22
Invited to enjoy rape?
No, I don't think so. To me it seems more likely to see it as
an illustration of the casuality in which these hoodlums
dealt with violence. (which includes sexual abuse). He meant
to show us that people can be into such thing for the mere kick of it.

I would tend to agree with the preceding.  I think that was the intent and
effect of the book and movie, to illustrate.  Some illustrations are
more jarring than others, however.  Stanley Kubrik's methods/intentions
could be questioned on this point (by some) but I think the novel was very
clear and the film true to the style and content of the book.

  Still, some of life's little examples get illustrated over and over and
over again in the movies, and others are brushed past.  I've never seen a
movie showing what a vile s.o.b. a person could become were they
constipated.  Physical assault however, is endlessly illustrated.  I still
need to see "Road To Wellville", I guess, for that constipated s.o.b angle.

There is an X version. I have the R rated version on tape. But I've 
seen the X rated version. There is not much of anything extra.

Is it not that the movie reached the current "cult-status" just for the
very fact of the more or less shocking details?
Though I wouldn't state that this was the intention of Stanley
Kubrick. But it's definitely another illustration of the enromous
skills and not to forget: predicamentary visions of S.K.

Kubrick had to get the idea of "ultra violence" across in movie form,
and I think he did an excellent job of making most people feel sick
about the acts themselves and about the society in which they took
place.  The irony of the book (and movie) is that society makes Alex
sick of violence...

It's not society that makes him sick of violence, that is
a secundary result of a general call for strong measures
to be taken against ultr violent youngsters. Remember PAvlov's
dog. As I recall it it was Ludovico's treatment that got
him so far. But note the political context in this.
Who wouldn't be glad to give up some democracy for safety.
Wouldn't you when you would be living in LA?

Also interesting to note in Kubrick's "Clockwork Orange," there is
hardly any blood.  I think the only two times that blood is shown
is when Alex cuts brother Dim's hand and later, when Alex is watching
films in the Ludvico lab, a man has a bloody nose in one of the films.
Compared to the films of today ("Total Recall," etc..) Kubrick's
"Clockwork Orange" seems, to me, harmless.

Also, when one thinks of the cyberpunk genre, 'Clockwork Orange' often pops up
for some reason.

Actually, "A Clockwork Orange" was on the U of M housing movie channel
a few nights ago, I managed to tape it, but haven't actually seen it
yet. 

Clockwork Orange always struck me as something out of a dream.

Yes, your worst nightmare

OH NO.

Clockwork Orange would be a tame dream for me.

Wouldn't dare to think of your wild dreams.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but recently I came to know that
this movie was adopted by skinheads as a movie suitable
to them. Where do I stand with me ideas about the movie
if the wrong people are abusing it for their vile
purposes?
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You can't help it if others use it for less-than-noble-purposes. You have to 
decide what the movie means for you, and not let some asswipes destroy 
your enjoyment of it.

Exactly.

The artist is never responsible for abuse by others if his
intentions weren't such.

- Backtalk version 1.3.30 - Copyright 1996-2006, Jan Wolter and Steve Weiss