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Grex > Enigma > #379: Lynne's "I aint got no baby" Diary. | |
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slynne
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response 95 of 160:
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Jan 10 15:48 UTC 2004 |
Which isnt to say that I believe that grex is all pixels on a screen or
that I put forth a false me.
I have noticed that sometimes people seem to treat grex like some kind
of therapy group rather than something like a party. I used to
participate in a therapy group and I shared very personal things in
that context but that was because I trusted the other people in the
group and because there were clear rules about how group members were
to treat what was said there. I think I pretty much present myself here
the same way I do in real life if I were at a party with people I didnt
know too well.
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anderyn
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response 96 of 160:
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Jan 10 16:49 UTC 2004 |
Ah, I don't go to parties with people I don't know too well. (My social life
revolves around a pretty small group, so I tend to expect things to be, hmmm,
intimate.) This is turning out to be a very interesting look at how different
people view this system and life in general. I don't mind teasing, but only
by people I know very well (at work for example, Andy at the desk beside mine
teases me, but I've known him for nineteen years and it's never beyond
comfortable bounds -- and fairly pc, because it's at work.)
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slynne
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response 97 of 160:
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Jan 10 17:36 UTC 2004 |
I cant fault anyone for being surprised about the different outlooks
that people have about bbs conferencing and life in general. And even
though janc says that anyone who couldnt anticipate valerie's reaction
to the parody item is stupid, I really was surprised by it. I guess I
as guilty of expecting others to have similar views about such things
as anyone else is around here.
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slynne
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response 98 of 160:
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Jan 10 17:37 UTC 2004 |
I want to share my thoughts about a recent post valerie made in coop
conference...
#1 of 1 by Valerie Mates (valerie) on Sat Jan 10 01:50:20 2004:
Some people have asked me why I deleted my old postings everywhere
on Grex. I deleted my old postings because of things that were said on
M-Net, not out of any desire to hurt Grex. On M-Net, they insist that
anything that is posted on Grex (or on M-Net, or anyplace else on the
Internet) is an open invitation to other people to use it in parodies on
M-Net. I do not wish to be parodied, and I do not wish to have my words
re-used by other people in any other way. So I am removing my words
in order to rescind an invitation that I had never intended to extend.
I do not wish to participate in M-Net's parody game, and if the only
way to opt out is removing myself from Grex, well, I think it's really
sad to have to do that, but so be it.
I shared the program that I wrote that lets people delete all of their
responses because other people had expressed the desire to remove their
words for the same reason.
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slynne
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response 99 of 160:
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Jan 10 17:49 UTC 2004 |
Ok. This post reminded me of something from the baby diary. valerie
said some mean things about a woman who was supposed to be Arlo's
teacher this year but quit just before the school year started. By
cooincidence I happen to know this woman and while I am not close to
her now, I was at one time. I wasnt sure how I felt about that.
naturally, valerie has a right to write about her life and her
thoughts and feelings about things even if those thoughts are not too
pleasant thoughts about someone I know. Did my friend give valerie
permission to be discussed in a negative way with a wide audience on a
bbs system? In a sense, I have to say that she did. All of do. If I
drive like an asshole on my way to work and cut someone off and then
flip them off, they may mention that to people they know. They might
blog about it someplace. They might even make fun of me. If I happened
to do such a thing to someone I know, they might even identify me when
they make fun of me or say negative things about me.
I respect valerie's decision to remove her postings from grex even
though I personally believe it is a huge over-reaction. Just like I
would believe a person has a right to shut themselves inside their
house with the shades drawn in order to avoid any chance of anyone
making negative comments about them online somewhere. Still, that
doesnt seem like a healthy attitude at all. Well at least not if it
goes on for a long time. As a short term response to being very hurt, I
suppose it could be beneficial.
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jaklumen
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response 100 of 160:
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Jan 11 09:47 UTC 2004 |
resp:95 It's really ironic-- the recovery cf is really slow and
relatively unrevealing in some ways... and yet agora can be quite
lively and very revealing in others. "Therapy group instead of a
party." Interesting. I think the thing is that people might forget
that this *is* a party, which anyone can join at *any* time, and not a
therapy group that is closed. I was saying in coop that maybe a
listserv group would fit such a latter need better. But... maybe
people forget. I'm not sure what Grex is to its users. It's not
exactly impersonal; some may really feel some trust and sense of
community, especially if they've met others in person.
But you have the realities of how vulnerable information can be out in
cyberspace. I'll admit I haven't always been very sensitive to just
how real that can be.
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slynne
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response 101 of 160:
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Jan 11 14:09 UTC 2004 |
No, it is not impersonal. I feel like I trust most people here. And to
be honest, the few people I dont trust I dont care about. I do feel a
sense of community too. I have a lot of friends I trust and feel
connected to too. But I dont always share my deepest most innermost
thoughts with them. I reserve those for my closest friends or my
handwritten diary.
Oddly, I really believe that using a medium like this as a sort of
therapy could be useful. I know that I find writing about my problems
to be particularly cathartic. It is just that doesnt fit with the idea
of open access. If you are going to let *anyone* come in,
well...*anyone* can come in. jep's divorce items were obviously very
useful to him. They were useful to me too in ways I am not going to
share in an open forum. However, he said things that could hurt him if
certain people ever became aware of them. It was not only possible that
those people would read the items, it was likely.
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slynne
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response 102 of 160:
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Jan 11 14:18 UTC 2004 |
I talked for a long time with one of my closest friends yesterday and
mentioned some of my thoughts to her. She had some interesting things
to say about teasing. She really wants to raise her son to be caring
and empathetic and all of those things mothers often want their sons to
be. But she also wants him to be resiliant to the inevitable teasing
that all kids experience. She isnt sure exactly how to go about that.
Personally, I am not too worried about it since she is very caring and
empathetic and loving and secure. I have a feeling she will raise a
child who has some similar qualities just by being herself.
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slynne
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response 103 of 160:
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Jan 11 14:25 UTC 2004 |
There is a very interesting article in today's New York Times magazine
about blogging and how some people view it.
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/01/11/magazine/11BLOG.html
I thought this bit was interesting:
"The new forms of communication are madly contradictory: anonymous, but
traceable; instantaneous, then saved forever (unless deleted in a
snit). In such an unstable environment, it's no wonder that
distinctions between healthy candor and ''too much information'' are in
flux and that so many find themselves helplessly confessing, as if a
generation were given a massive technological truth serum."
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anderyn
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response 104 of 160:
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Jan 11 16:06 UTC 2004 |
I will have to look at that article. Interesting. I think that this itme is
helping me figure out what I expected and wanted from Grex, and which wasn't
clear before, in a way... Thank you slynne, for pointing me to it. I think
that I was definitely seeing it as a rather intimate group whose members I
knew (the people who always post in agora, for example), some in person, and
some as personalities on the screen. I've never had any trouble feeling close
to people who are abstract on a screen (my friends johlt and micklpickl are
two very close friends whom I've met in person only after a lot of online talk
and who live very far away). But in the same breath, I also felt that it was
somewhat anonymous -- those people who I'd never met wouldn't know me from
Adam if I did meet them, so it was more okay to talk about things that I
wouldn't want to talk about to people I'd have to see and know they knew this
about me. Hmmm. This is very interesting and very contradictory. Feeling free
to state something somewhat intimate (such as my feelings about Rhiannon's
pregnancy) because (a) I trusted that the people I *did* know in real life
would not betray my confidences and (b) I trusted that the people I didn't
know would either not care or wouldn 't bother to track down the person who
said that. And as I have mentioned in coop, I really didn't realize that every
keystroke or entry on Grex was archived "forever". I thought that they would
be erased at some point, because once an item has been not responded to in
a while, it's pretty much useless imho. It felt like a living conversation,
not a dead archive. I felt safe saying things assuming that they would go away
eventually. And I also think I didn't realize that Grex is more than the
logins that I always see posting in agora -- there are always the same several
people who do, and I think I unconsciously came to the conclusion that those
were really the only people who read what I was saying.
I hope that this is clearer to you than it is to me. I'm writing out what I'm
thinking and seeing it for the first time as I type. So it's somewhat
incoherent.
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slynne
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response 105 of 160:
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Jan 11 17:03 UTC 2004 |
I find that to be the case a lot of the time. I mean I have written
about people in my real life online here and felt safe about it because
they dont read this and I dont expect anyone here knows them. But, I
still do it with the knowledge that what I write could be found by them
or repeated to them. It is hard to explain but I figure if that
happens, I'll explain what I was thinking when I wrote whatever I did.
Mostly, I am not so much concerned that they will be upset by what I
wrote. It is more that I have a way of embellishing stories or
remembering things inaccurately. I always get the general gist of
things but sometimes the details are wrong.
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anderyn
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response 106 of 160:
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Jan 11 17:11 UTC 2004 |
And I'm not terribly upset by most of what I've said online. Some of it was
written in moments of frustration and I wish I could scribble that, since it's
just stupid now. But oh well.
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slynne
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response 107 of 160:
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Jan 11 22:01 UTC 2004 |
A New Bed. A New Beginning?
Last Sunday, I had dinner at my aunt and uncle's house. They mentioned
that they were getting rid of a mattress and box spring and asked me if
I wanted it. I did. They were very nice and even lent their minivan to
me so I could move it. My parents were very nice and helped me with the
moving (it was heavier than I would have thought).
So now I have a "real bed". Well, it is really just a mattress and box
spring sitting on the floor but it is more conventional than the futon.
This bed, while very comfortable, is kind of weird. I have been
sleeping on a futon pretty much all the time since I was a teenager.
There were the waterbed years too but I never really liked that thing.
That kind of makes me laugh.
I guess because I have missed the whole get married and have kids
thing, there are areas of my life where I havent grown up. Ok, I
*still* have milk crate furniture which was all the rage when I was in
college. Oddly, the milk crate furniture itself doesnt bother me. It is
the idea that some part of me has resisted growing up. Of course, maybe
this is normal. In every important way I have matured and grown. Having
a milkcrate for a nightstand and a futon for a bed really doesnt mean
anything. Right?
So now I have a new bed. I feel that much more adult. I like it.
http://lynne.tblog.com/
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mary
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response 108 of 160:
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Jan 12 00:18 UTC 2004 |
Be careful, Lynne. Not too long after people get real beds
they start taking care of their weeds and overgrown yards.
Be afraid. ;-)
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slynne
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response 109 of 160:
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Jan 12 01:17 UTC 2004 |
uh-oh
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jaklumen
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response 110 of 160:
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Jan 12 01:24 UTC 2004 |
resp:101 Ok, I can go with that.
resp:105 Sure, even if they aren't likely to read it, better to plan
on the possibility they might.
resp:108 I didn't get either of those, but I think I am getting other
things. LOL This is reminding me of hand-me downs from the parents,
actually. They moved into a new house some months ago and some of the
things we got were some stuff for the bed. Headboard, footboard,
skirt, some nicer sheets, and comforter... I suppose it was an upgrade
of sorts. Also a long way from my single days five years back (I
think) when I had a mattress and box spring on the floor.
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slynne
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response 111 of 160:
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Jan 12 01:39 UTC 2004 |
Oh well, I guess I am counting the mattress and box spring on the floor
as "a real bed" ;)
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jaklumen
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response 112 of 160:
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Jan 12 12:35 UTC 2004 |
oh man apparently I have never lived!
hide a beds and futons have only been very temporary arrangements--
you know, staying with folks, in-laws, stuff like that.
You have got to describe this milk crate furniture a little more to me
because I am having trouble visualizing it.
Hmmm... this is totally off the subject some, but my sister in San
Jose and her husband figured out how to take my folks' old floor TV
and set an aquarium where the cathode tube was-- sealed the glass in
and everything. I've only seen a crappy picture and I'm dying to see
it one day in person.
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slynne
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response 113 of 160:
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Jan 12 13:48 UTC 2004 |
The milk crate furniture is just two milk crates with a board over them
to make a table of sorts.
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edina
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response 114 of 160:
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Jan 12 17:40 UTC 2004 |
I'd like to say that I live my life very much out in the open, but obviously
that isn't true. I filter a great deal of what I say, depending on the
situation. The best example is that I never mentioned I was having gastric
bypass until after I had had it . . .especially on m-net. When you are making
a huge change in your life that is considered controversial, the last thing
needed is some pubescent punk giving you smack.
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slynne
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response 115 of 160:
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Jan 12 18:07 UTC 2004 |
Heh. I can totally understand that. What is funny is that people were
so upset about the M-net agora conference being something that was
going on "behind their backs" while it is the more in your face
conversation disrupting stuff that bothers me more. I mean, if I were
to discuss something online here and someone wanted to make fun of me
about it. I would much prefer it if they did it out of the way where I
could choose not to have to deal with their Beevis and Butthead like
comments ;) "She said 'butt' huh huh huh huh" ;)
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jaklumen
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response 116 of 160:
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Jan 13 02:49 UTC 2004 |
Exactly-- it's why I chose to leave agora-- comments were starting to
get mean. It's one thing if people want to parody me-- and that *is*
parody. But when someone decided to make fun in what I thought was a
mean way of a time I was trying to get a job... and by the way, they
(the employer) decided to screw me over and not tell me about it (I
hate it when people can't be straight with me). So, it was time to
leave.
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jaklumen
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response 117 of 160:
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Jan 13 02:51 UTC 2004 |
That wasn't very clear. I was being made fun of in agora, to my
face. So... I left.
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slynne
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response 118 of 160:
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Jan 13 13:51 UTC 2004 |
That is exactly what I would do if I felt that the jokes were too mean.
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edina
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response 119 of 160:
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Jan 13 17:06 UTC 2004 |
I just filter what I post. I still want to play in the game, I just don't
want to wear a target on my back.
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