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| Author |
Message |
| 23 new of 115 responses total. |
rcurl
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response 93 of 115:
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Feb 20 05:07 UTC 1999 |
I suspect that in part unclear answers are given to unclear questions. There
are so many parameters about deductible contributions that it takes pages
to explain them even roughly. The IRS answer saying consult publication
so-and-so was the best answer. Form 1040 are a poor person's substitute,
especially for such ridiculously small amounts of money are are being
discussed here. I save all my receipt for travel on behalf of non-profits,
which are deductible expenses, and I *know* someone that was audited and
had to produce their receipts for toll road tolls, etc, to get the
deduction (I think it was just a test to see if the person had at least
some of such receipt related to the claimed expenses).
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pfv
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response 94 of 115:
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Feb 20 05:16 UTC 1999 |
Trusting in IRS answers is always a mistake: folks that have done
so were dragged into court - and LOST EVERY TIME..
The IRS is totally irresponsible: they do not have to tell the
truth; their "truth" can change in a heartbeat; and through it
all, the citizen is held responsible..
If you don't *KNOW* - that is, can win in any court - document the
hell out of EVERYTHING.
Does this need to be discussed further? Really?
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steve
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response 95 of 115:
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Feb 21 04:18 UTC 1999 |
I'm afraid Pete is right.
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keesan
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response 96 of 115:
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Feb 22 21:16 UTC 1999 |
The IRS explicity states that a cancelled check is sufficient documentation
for amounts under $250. United Way believes this, can't we? If people refuse
to believe the IRS and United Way, why are they believing Sue Dodea? I can
call her if anyone wants me to to ask where she got her information. The last
tax lawyer that I had any contact with was wrong.
If people who are itemizing on the federal income tax do not believe that a
cancelled check is adequate, they can request a paper receipt to staple to
their check. What percentage of grex donors itemize anyway?
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keesan
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response 97 of 115:
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Feb 24 19:41 UTC 1999 |
I talked with Mark last night. He showed me a page from the IRS stating that
nonprofits must be able to prove that donations of $75 or over were not for
services received, that may be where the $75 figure came from. He also said
that Ms. Dodea insisted on the paper receipts (if I understood correctly) as
a way of proving on paper where donations came from. Since the paper receipts
are being mailed to donors rather than kept by grex, this did not seem to me
to constitute proof of where donations came from, in case of an IRS audit of
grex. So I suggested that Mark keep photocopies of checks over $75, or better
yet of all checks. We therefore came up with a technological solution in the
form of getting him a photocopier that had been looking for a home. We
brought it over and installed it on top of the file cabinet and ran some pages
through to eliminate the dark smudges that were the result of toner getting
out during shipping (driving), and he can now photocopy all the incoming
checks before depositing them each month, at least six to a page. The copier
may also be usable for printing out grex user manuals (free until the toner
runs out). It will save Mark the need to go to the copy shop occasionally.
So we all seem to be agreed that donors do not need paper receipts for
amounts under $250, but grex is supposed to be keeping paper records of
donations of $75 or above.
I therefore propose that the rules be amended as follows:
All donors will be sent email receipts, informed that the IRS requires
paper receipts for amounts of $250 or up but that otherwise a cancelled check
is considered adequate proof of a donation in case you are itemizing on your
federal income tax, and that paper receipts will be mailed to anyone who
requests one.
The grex treasurer will keep photocopies of all donations of $75 or
more. Donors will be urged to write on their checks what they are for -
membership donations, other donations, or purchase of t-shirts, etc. At
his/her discretion, the treasurer may keep photocopies of all checks. Mark
felt that he would be held personally responsible in the case of an audit and
would like to keep as detailed records as possible. It is also to the benefit
of donors who plan to itemize to write on their checks what they are for.
Mark, please correct any of the above.
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tpryan
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response 98 of 115:
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Feb 25 05:30 UTC 1999 |
Then a e-mail form letter could go out upon receipt of check,
referencing the check and check number, and a lot people would have
cancelled check and an e-mail print-out if they want.
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dang
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response 99 of 115:
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Feb 26 16:12 UTC 1999 |
For the IRS, any kind of e-mail, printed or not, will be meaningless for
these purposes, I'm sure.
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tpryan
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response 100 of 115:
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Feb 26 17:19 UTC 1999 |
I am very sure that if I got an e-mail thank you refferecning
a check number, I would know that I could see that check & donation
go together.
I might even want to move the check from the bank statement
folder to the donations folder.
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dang
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response 101 of 115:
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Feb 26 18:10 UTC 1999 |
Aha, I misunderstood that it was for your purposes, rather than for the IRS.
Sorry.
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keesan
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response 102 of 115:
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Feb 27 04:25 UTC 1999 |
The IRS only requires the cancelled check, not a receipt of any sort.
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dang
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response 103 of 115:
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Feb 28 03:18 UTC 1999 |
Yes, Cindi, I realize that. However, if you don't have a canceled
check, for whatever reason, then you need a receipt.
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davel
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response 104 of 115:
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Feb 28 03:28 UTC 1999 |
Those who have checking through (say) UM Credit Union do not get cancelled
checks back. They can get a copy through the CU ... for a (non-trivial) fee;
I have no idea whether the copy would be acceptable to the IRS.
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devnull
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response 105 of 115:
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Feb 28 03:34 UTC 1999 |
I am quite happy to assume that a photocopy of the canceled check provided
by my bank counts as `other reliably documentation' if it doesn't count
as a canceled check.
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keesan
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response 106 of 115:
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Feb 28 16:55 UTC 1999 |
IRS Publication 552, Recordkeeping for Individuals.
Proof of Payment.
Generally, you prove payment with a canceled check or cash receipt. If you
do not have a canceled check becaue your bank does not return canceled checks
or if you make payments by credit card or electronic funds transfer, you may
be able to prove payment with an account statement.
---
I suggest that people who get cancelled checks back use these as proof of
donations, and people who do not get any written statement from their banks
or credit card companies, but who itemize on their 1040s, request a written
receipt from the grex treasurer. People who do not itemize and who do not
claim grex as a business expense do not need any proof of their donation.
For amounts over $249, people who itemize can request a written receipt.
People who itemize and have donated under $75 might still like a written
receipt if they don't have cancelled checks, so the $75 limit does not make
sense as a cutoff for sending receipts.
I suggest sending email receipts to everyone who donates, and people
who need a written receipt because they are itemizing and either do not get
cancelled checks (for any amount donated, including under $75) or they have
donated $250 or more, request one. I am sure Mark will be happy to send to
anyone who wants one, but the email receipt should point out that a cancelled
check is considered adequate proof by the IRS for amounts under $250.
----
Another interesting pointi n this publication:
Contributions from which you beneift. Generally, if you make a charitable
contribution that is more than $75 and is partly for goods or services, the
organization must give you a written statement that you should keep.
I suspect this is what Ms. Dodea was getting at. If someone spends more than
$75 on T-shirts or auction items, it looks as if grex is supposed to provide
a paper receipt (or is email written?) even if you don't want one. Mark, how
many people donated $75 or more for goods or services?
I suspect grex is also supposed to keep a copy of these written
statements for goods or services received.
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rcurl
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response 107 of 115:
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Mar 1 06:35 UTC 1999 |
Don't forget that that $250 point is not about a receipt per se, but a
particular statement that must accompany the receipt.
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keesan
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response 108 of 115:
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Mar 1 21:36 UTC 1999 |
Actually, if someone pays for only auction items with a check, it is not
'partly' for goods or services, so I suspect the written statement (email?
paper?) would be only if you sent in, say, $150, and got a t-shirt for part
of that and the rest was a donation. This is not too clearly worded.
How about a receipt policy that says anyone who wants a paper receipt can have
one upon request, for any reason, and everyone automatically gets an email
receipt that points out that a cancelled check is proof of donation for
amounts under $250 but that you need a written statement for donations of $250
or higher if you are itemizing, or a written receipt for any amounts that you
are itemizing if you don't have a cancelled check or bank statement as proof?
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cmcgee
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response 109 of 115:
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Mar 2 00:24 UTC 1999 |
How about a receipt policy that says everyone gets a paper receipt. Period.
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rcurl
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response 110 of 115:
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Mar 2 06:35 UTC 1999 |
Yea. Print on one side only so those that don't want the receipt can use
the other side for notes or doodles or something.
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aruba
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response 111 of 115:
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Mar 2 19:56 UTC 1999 |
Geez, I'm tired of this.
Re #106: 4 people spent $75 or more for goods (auction and/or Grex store
items) in 1998.
I guess I should call R. Sue. I predict that she's no more likely to back
down from her position than Sindi is.
For the record, my concerns are:
1. Keeping out of trouble with the IRS
2. Keeping our donors as happy as possible; some may be happier with more
paper, some with less
3. Minimizing the treasurer's workload
I think any reasonable policy needs to address all of these points. If you
find yourself formulating an opinion based on only some of them, please
reconsider it.
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rcurl
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response 112 of 115:
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Mar 2 21:16 UTC 1999 |
PIck a policy and implement it. I'd say, err on the side of being helpful
and cautious.
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cmcgee
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response 113 of 115:
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Mar 3 12:56 UTC 1999 |
Keep out of trouble with the IRS. Keep our treasurer happy. Keep as many
members as possible happy. Just do what you need to do, aruba.
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dpc
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response 114 of 115:
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Mar 3 14:53 UTC 1999 |
This matter is in your capable hands, aruba, as far as I'm concerned.
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keesan
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response 115 of 115:
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Mar 3 15:35 UTC 1999 |
Give people a choice of whether they want paper receipts, don't make it for
them. You are sending email receipts anyway. Do you want to send paper
receipts to 85 or so people every year, just in case one of them wants a paper
receipt but was too shy to ask for it? And does not get back cancelled
checks? The IRS specifically says you don't need a paper receipt unless you
are itemizing and eitehr it is for $250 or over and you dont' have a cancelled
check. The receipt for amounts $75 or more is only in cases where someone
is getting goods or services for their mone.
How about letting anyone who wants a paper receipt request it at the time they
send in their check, as well as asking if they want a paper receipt when
sending out the email receipt (and pointing out that they only need a paper
receipt if they are itemizing and don't get cancelled checks or are donating
$250 or more). And automatically sending out a written statement (and keeping
a copy) to anyone who sends a check for $75 which is partly for goods or
services received. And keeping photocopies of all checks received, which
should make the IRS quite happy. The would seem to satisfy all the writtenn
rules that I could find.
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