response 57 of 78:

Jul 13 18:44 UTC 1999

I think your conclusion is correct, though your premise is not, I think -
but like I said, I'd have to do some number crunching to show how much our
membership turns over.

response 59 of 78:

Jul 13 20:18 UTC 1999

What Ken said.

response 61 of 78:

Jul 13 21:58 UTC 1999

and remember that once, not too long ago, mnet had twice as much money
as grex has right now, and went through almost all of it in a period of 
maybe 15 months 

response 63 of 78:

Jul 14 01:27 UTC 1999

        I dial in.  If I had acces to full color internet and all that stuff
out there, I don't think I would Grex as much.

response 65 of 78:

Jul 14 12:46 UTC 1999

        Ken, you omitted my words "in part" in reference to the deep pockets
theory;  I'm saying I didn't think that GREX could meet it's bills regularly
without that core group.  If that's incorrect, then I'll concede.

response 67 of 78:

Jul 15 11:28 UTC 1999

Grex relied on the "deep pockets" theory to start up.  This lasted less
than a year, as I recollect.  The "deep" pockets were various founders,
who basically guaranteed that various things, like phone lines and such,
would "get paid" no matter what - if membership fees didn't cover it,
they would.  Most of the expenses were really quite small - I don't
think we were paying rent at the start, and the equipment was mostly
donated.  So the kinds of expenses the "deep" pockets incurred were much
more on the line of an extra magazine subscription, a ticket to see a
movie, or a minor auto repair, than anything that would have required a
2nd mortgage on the house, or aroused the interest of a bank inspector.

I don't believe grex has ever relied on deep pockets for any operating
expenses since.  The only time grex has needed "deep" pockets has been
for capital upgrades, and I believe all of those have been well
documented online.

We certainly have plenty of members who don't say much, and several
vocal non-paying people who participate here in coop.  But I think all
of the people that I can think of who could possibly claim to be a "deep
pocket" for grex have been deeply involved in discussions here in coop.
There isn't a "them" that's really paying for grex, there's only "us".
Most of this is really pretty obvious if you look at the budget reports,
who responds here, and the list of members.

response 69 of 78:

Jul 19 13:14 UTC 1999

The deep-pockets method of operation lasted rather more than a year.  I didn't
happen on Grex during its first year.  When I did, I went to board meetings
fairly regularly for a while, & several times over those months saw board
members - faced with budget shortfall - reach into those pockets.

response 71 of 78:

Jul 25 02:04 UTC 1999

        I don't know if/how this would work for Grex, it probably won't,
but I thought I'd throw the idea on the floor to be kicked around a bit.

        http://www.megapop.net/

        Basically, it's a company who has established POPs around the
country (in alot of major cities) and allow you to dial in from any one of
those places.  It's mainly for ISPs who want to increase their coverage
area, but I thought I'd throw it out for some more intelligent minds to
look at.

response 73 of 78:

Jul 28 03:15 UTC 1999

Where do you get $130 a month?  I think the average is more like $600 a
month.

response 75 of 78:

Aug 10 07:03 UTC 1999

regarding the idea of Grex running out-of-area dialins:  I just had 
a small fantasy about doing this for the Cleveland Free-net 
refugees.  I'm sure it's beyond our capabilities, especially since
we'd want to do it in the next six weeks.

response 77 of 78:

Sep 11 00:50 UTC 1999

Four of those weeks are gone; did someone mention it in grexohio?