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Grex > Coop11 > #84: outgoing internet access for non-members | |
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| Author |
Message |
| 25 new of 127 responses total. |
mary
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response 30 of 127:
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Mar 17 17:21 UTC 1999 |
Ack, aruba's response got in and I didn't know it.
I volunteered in vain. ;-)
Opening it up to dialin users would be a nice way
to test this out.
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aruba
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response 31 of 127:
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Mar 17 18:36 UTC 1999 |
Re #28: I guess it's a secret.
I suppose we could have more than one validator, but there would have to be a
central place where validation info is stored. I'm not sure how picking up
the mail would work, too.
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prp
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response 32 of 127:
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Mar 17 19:57 UTC 1999 |
GIF ?
FSF ?
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prp
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response 33 of 127:
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Mar 17 20:13 UTC 1999 |
Re system load: As I rember there are about five dial-in users and sixty-five
network-in users. Thus if restricted to dial-in users, system load should
not be a problem.
Re verification: Given the dial-in restriction, you have effectively limited
this to locals. As you have monthly meetings, in person verification is
possible. No new software required.
Re troublemakers: A public file with the id's, name's and address's of
verified users might keep it to a minimum.
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remmers
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response 34 of 127:
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Mar 17 21:59 UTC 1999 |
I'd object to a public file of names and addresses on right-to-privacy
grounds.
There are well-established procedures for validating members for
outgoing internet access. We could simply use the same procedures for
non-member verification.
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keesan
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response 35 of 127:
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Mar 18 01:47 UTC 1999 |
How about giving out a few free memberships to anyone who can demonstrate that
they are unable to donate $6/month for a paid membership? And require them
to provide the same id as all other members. (dial ins only).
You can ftp at the library, we have done it, faster than on grex.
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rcurl
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response 36 of 127:
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Mar 18 01:52 UTC 1999 |
I would not support that. The minimum dues are already very low, but
still represent a committment of support. I would have no objection
to *others* donating the $6 for the penurious to become members.
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aruba
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response 37 of 127:
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Mar 18 05:04 UTC 1999 |
Re #33: Grex currently has 11 dialin lines.
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fadedx
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response 38 of 127:
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Mar 18 10:03 UTC 1999 |
i think your $6 a month is perfectly fair, in fact i just started this
service about a week ago and tommorow i'm sending in my $.
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aruba
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response 39 of 127:
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Mar 18 14:28 UTC 1999 |
Thanks!
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devnull
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response 40 of 127:
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Mar 18 14:57 UTC 1999 |
Re #35: That seems like a reasonable alternative to me; I'm not sure whether
I prefer to give the poor free membership, or give everyone within the local
calling area outgoing access. I do think the latter has the advantage that
only people who really care about grex will be able to vote, which may be
a win.
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keesan
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response 41 of 127:
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Mar 18 16:28 UTC 1999 |
I got the impression that only people who were both members and cared about
grex bothered to vote anyway.. What was the 'turnout'? (I forgot).
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hhsrat
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response 42 of 127:
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Mar 18 22:36 UTC 1999 |
Some users even within the Ann Arbor area cannot dial in due to the way
they're wired, so limiting this new feature to dial in users only will
be excluding some people.
Personally, even though I'm not a dial in user, I'd like to be
"verified" or "validated" or whatever.
Would this be feasible?
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prp
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response 43 of 127:
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Mar 18 23:58 UTC 1999 |
Re FTP at the AA Library: It very rarely works, even if you've purchased
one of their disks. I've thought about volentering to help them, but they
have a lot of computers.
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aruba
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response 44 of 127:
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Mar 19 01:32 UTC 1999 |
Re #42: You can certainly become a member, for $6/month.
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keesan
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response 45 of 127:
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Mar 19 10:57 UTC 1999 |
re 43, maybe we downloaded from a website using lynx, not ftp? It wassome
long file that Jim wanted to play with.
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devnull
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response 46 of 127:
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Mar 19 17:49 UTC 1999 |
Re #42: Yes, it is excluding some people. It might be reasonable later
to consider allowing anyone in the US to be verified and get outgoing access,
but I think starting with the people who can connect to the modems directly
is best.
(I have concerns about international people because the legal systems in
other places will be different, and we may start having to worry about vandals
more.)
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prp
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response 47 of 127:
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Mar 19 21:46 UTC 1999 |
Another problem at the library is the 30 minute time limit. Just enough
time to find what you want, but not enough to do anything with it.
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richard
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response 48 of 127:
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Mar 19 23:38 UTC 1999 |
The first line of the preamble to grex's bylaws states:
"IT IS THE OBJECTIVE OF THIS ORGANIZATION TO PROVIDE AN OPEN-ACCESS
CONFERENCING SYSTEM"
To my way of thinking, "open-access" is access that is not denied without
good cause.
Grex should draft a user contract that all users who want full membership
would be required to sign and provide along with validation. This
contract would explain grex's goals, and what is considered unacceptable
and acceptable behaviour and use of grex. It would state that the user
agrees that grex staff has the right to restrict or rescind member
priviledges of any user who engages in unacceptable activity. It
would state that grex is financed by voluntary contributions and that the
user agrees to consider contributing and to accept future snail mail or
email solicitations to that effect.
Any user willing to sign that contract, and provide validation, should be
given full membership. Grex could do a mass snail mail once a year,
sending (not stamped but pre-addressed to grex) envelopes to all validated
users. This would cost a few bucks but grex could get a bulk postage ID
so it wouldnt end up being that much (might be sixty bucks to send a
couple hundred letters which could bring back hundreds of dollars).
This would move grex much closer to being truly open-access, and make it
closer to the communal experience it should be. No tiered access, no
qualifications for membership other than that you are willing to sign your
name and make a verbal committment.
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prp
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response 49 of 127:
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Mar 20 00:12 UTC 1999 |
What are the official Grex attribute bits? Looks like:
1. Officer -- Obtained by being elected.
2. Staff -- Obtained by ?
3. Member -- Obtained by paying.
4. Verified -- Obtained by whatever.
That gives twelve possible combinations, given that officers have to be
members.
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hhsrat
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response 50 of 127:
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Mar 20 02:36 UTC 1999 |
re #44: I would be ever so happy to become a member, however, at this
time, I just can't afford it. Maybe once school's out for the year and
I don't have to pay for school lunch anymore ...
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rcurl
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response 51 of 127:
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Mar 20 03:46 UTC 1999 |
Re #48: it is somewhat unusual for a member-based charitable non-profit
organization that is financed by contribution of dues to start asking
members to sign declarations, which cannot be enforced any more than
the current netiquette rules are enforced. Validation of members is
already done too. I don't think anything would be accomplished by
adding impediments to members contributing dues.
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mdw
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response 52 of 127:
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Mar 20 09:04 UTC 1999 |
The difference between a vandal in india, colorado, or ontario is mostly
non-existant, they are all equally hard to deal with.
Do you people have *any* idea how many people would like to use grex to
be able to telnet into, then out of?
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scott
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response 53 of 127:
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Mar 20 12:43 UTC 1999 |
Staff is appointed by Board.
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albaugh
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response 54 of 127:
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Mar 20 16:20 UTC 1999 |
OK, is this something that the membership votes on? If so, let's get on to
a vote, and bury this issue "for good" (for awhile, of course). I'll be
voting NO.
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