|
|
| Author |
Message |
| 25 new of 64 responses total. |
keesan
|
|
response 25 of 64:
| 
Mar 7 16:20 UTC 1998 |
Thanks, Mary, finally a logical explanation. People also like horror movies
and lots of TV violence, all of which they know won't hurt them. Are live
sopranos more popular than recorded ones, since there is a chance of failure?
It is always nice to hear from people with different opinions, and good
reasons for them, it gives me new ways to think about the world. But I still
prefer cellos and tenors. Maybe I dislike high notes because as a second alto
they made us sing the G above high C, and it hurt as well as sounding awful.
My throat seems to tense up when I hear them. Same when I hear high
instrumental sounds, except piano, nothing like the human voice.
|
orinoco
|
|
response 26 of 64:
|
Mar 8 00:06 UTC 1998 |
It's not so much the high pitch that bothers me about operatic soprano voices
as it is the tone. I don't really know how to describe it.
|
albaugh
|
|
response 27 of 64:
|
Mar 8 04:39 UTC 1998 |
Like a sheep bleating? ;-)
|
rcurl
|
|
response 28 of 64:
|
Mar 8 05:57 UTC 1998 |
I don't share Mary's "high-wire act" explanation. On the contrary, a
soprano sings so naturally and unforced that it is an exquisite vocal
exploration of the upper registers. I get that "high brow adrenaline rush"
as readily from a basso as from a soprano (and everything in between).
It is, in fact, somewhat disparaging to consider the soprano voice as
somehow less natural than any other.
|
mary
|
|
response 29 of 64:
|
Mar 8 11:56 UTC 1998 |
My sense of the high notes being more fragile extend not just
to voice but also to the highest register of individual
instruments. Like when James Galloway goes for that
octave leap in during the final bars of Londonderry Air when
his already way up there. It's like, "Whew, he made it."
|
mary
|
|
response 30 of 64:
|
Mar 8 11:57 UTC 1998 |
Too many typos. Need sleep. ;-)
|
keesan
|
|
response 31 of 64:
|
Mar 8 17:38 UTC 1998 |
Why don't any radio stations play high soprano before 10 am?
|
rcurl
|
|
response 32 of 64:
|
Mar 8 21:34 UTC 1998 |
Does Gallway think "Whew, I made it"? I doubt it. But I acknowledge that
there are limits to what an instrument or voice can do, and when
performers play near those limits - and not all performers can - the
audience is often impressed. But for the best performers, performing at
those limits still strikes me as effortless.
Which reminds me to ask, since you are a string performer (I used to know
this when I played the violin as a child, but I forget): what is it called
when you play a note an octave higher (I think) by just barely touching
the string? It came up recently as a physics question. One plays the
fundamental of the string normally, but another harmonic when just
touching the string, and I can't recall which harmonic - and its name,
musically. Our daughter now does this on the flute by blowing differently.
|
davel
|
|
response 33 of 64:
|
Mar 8 21:48 UTC 1998 |
This response has been erased.
|
mary
|
|
response 34 of 64:
|
Mar 9 00:01 UTC 1998 |
Boy, don't know, Rane. On the cello each string as a true harmonic
which sounds the note two octaves above the sound of the open string
and one octave above the fretted point directly below the harmonic
position. But I don't know of any special name other than true
harmonic. False harmonics are played elsewhere (not the center of
the length of the string), are difficult to pull-off, and well
beyond anything I'd attempt without a net. ;-)
|
faile
|
|
response 35 of 64:
|
Mar 9 06:19 UTC 1998 |
The only instrument with reliable harmonics other than the middle harmonic
is the bass. (And I'm really not just asing this to stroke my own ego... I
promise) That's only because the string is so darn long-- there's the octave
harmonic, in the middle, then above that, there's a fifth, then the double
octave.... depending on the instrument, it is possible to get up to the
seventh of a given fundemental. Then, because the octave harmonic rings so
true, even when the string isn't touched (poor bowing can cause teh fifth or
the octave to sound, rather than the true pitch), there is a harmonic half
way between the nut and the octave.... and there are some fals harmonics that
I wouldn't attepmt without at least a disclaimer in teh program warning
pregnant women and small children that there are health risks involved.
|
rcurl
|
|
response 36 of 64:
|
Mar 9 08:37 UTC 1998 |
My daughter demonstrated the four octaves she can reach on the flute by
the way she blows. Three are octaves, but the highest has to be keyed
to be an octave. She does not know what note it is unkeyed (I shall
attempt to measure it....).
|
keesan
|
|
response 37 of 64:
|
Mar 9 18:53 UTC 1998 |
re #35, are you saying that the strings will vibrate even when you are bowing
some other string? (Do you two ever get any sleep? 3:37 a. m.?!) How much
progress has been made in synthesizing sounds of real instruments? IN theory
you should be able to add in all the harmonics, but it sounds rather
complicated if unbowed strings are also involved.
|
rcurl
|
|
response 38 of 64:
|
Mar 9 19:33 UTC 1998 |
The best electronic "pianos" simulate other instruments quite well by
including all the harmonics. The effect of other string going into
sympathetic vibration occurs on all undamped string instruments, but
is most noticeable on the piano when pedalled. The effect is used
intentionally by composers. I cannot say for sure if this is included
in the pedal mode of electronic pianos. The coupling is hard to design
so is very different for different instruments (and is probably part of
the difference between violins that make them "better" or "worse").
|
faile
|
|
response 39 of 64:
|
Mar 9 20:27 UTC 1998 |
There are a couple places on the instrument with really strong sympathetic
vibrations, and the lowest string has a nasty tendancy to sound somewhere else
in the overtone series, just to be nasty, particularly if one isn't careful.
But often, a note will cause another string to vibrate if it is in the
overtone series of that note. (an example is that the D string will
occasionally vibrate when an A above it is played....)
(Sure I sleep.... and to me, its an hour earlier...)
|
keesan
|
|
response 40 of 64:
|
Mar 9 22:41 UTC 1998 |
How do other parts of an instrument affect the overtones, such as the sounding
boards of pianos, the cases of violins (stringed instruments)?
Is that what you mean by 'a couple places on the instrument?'
|
orinoco
|
|
response 41 of 64:
|
Mar 10 03:41 UTC 1998 |
That, keesan, is the $16,000 question.
First off, both the air inside an instrument and the material that the body
is made out of will resonate. The larger the hollow cavityu inside the
instrument, the better the air inside is at resonating to low pitches; the
smaller the cavity, the better it is at resonating to high pitches.
The solid material will resonate better to different pitches depending on its
dimensions, and also on the material it's made out of. (This is why the metal
body of a banjo gives a much higher tone than that of a guitar - it's smaller,
and metal tends to reinforce high pitches better)
It gets more complicated, though, because the shape also matters. This is
why so much effort is put into bending wood to make violins and guitars the
proper shape - yes, it would be possible to make a wooden box of the same
volume, but there would be slight differences. And as if that weren't bad
enough, different materials conduct vibrations at different speeds, and
sometimes even the same piece of wood cut with or against the grain will ahve
entirely different properties.
In other words, it's damn complicated, and nobody really knows.
|
rcurl
|
|
response 42 of 64:
|
Mar 10 07:10 UTC 1998 |
That's actually the $16,000,000 question - for some violins, for example.
It all developed by trial and error, reinforced by a lot of people with
the skills and understanding - and "ear" - to hear what most people would
find most pleasing.
|
albaugh
|
|
response 43 of 64:
|
Mar 10 17:42 UTC 1998 |
If a composer wants the string player to play harmonics, the notes are to be
written with little o's over them (this is from recollection, I haven't
consulted my book on this in ages since I've never had the need! :-).
Re: flute's 4th octave: From middle C to 3rd space C the flute is breathy,
has a unique sound, can't be played particularly loud. From 3rd space C to
2nd ledger line C is nominal flute range for most players. High C to double
high C is for experienced players, with the upper range already shrill. A
4th ocatave above that is of no practical use. Being able to play notes in
that range (through harmonics or whatever) is a novelty/skill, but not likely
to be often employed! :-)
|
keesan
|
|
response 44 of 64:
|
Mar 11 01:02 UTC 1998 |
Larger speakers also play the low notes louder, and it helps if the speaker
is dense enough not to resonate at certain frequencies, or if it does not have
any dimensions which are multiples of others (which also reinforces certain
notes). And if you are trying to block sounds, a larger wall cavity helps,
along with thicker wallboard. Metal blocks lower sounds well, perhaps this
is related to its vibrating at higher pitch? [I meant block low sounds.]
|
mary
|
|
response 45 of 64:
|
Apr 5 14:43 UTC 1998 |
A friend is getting married next Friday. She is a Buddhist and
not much into "things" for their home. She is also an accomplished
musician and her fiance is just beginning an affair with the piano.
So what to get them?
On the advice of another Buddhist I visited Jewel Heart's store on Ashley
and was totally captivated by something called Tibetan Singing Bowls. What
an incredible instrument. You simply hold these old and tarnished brass
(I think) bowls on one hand while dragging a wooden dowel around the rim
with the other. There is a bit of technique involved but I found that
after a few minutes of getting to know each bowl I was able to get each to
vibrate and produce the most unusual sound - a clear and deep tone which
seems to fill the room, coming from everywhere. Amazing stuff. I
understand that in Tibet and Nepal the monks play these as a form of
meditation, often in chorus, and the experience is quite profound.
Has anyone else ever heard or played a singing bowl?
|
keesan
|
|
response 46 of 64:
|
Apr 5 16:12 UTC 1998 |
We used to use the same technique on goblets filled with water to different
depths, to produce different pitches. You rub the rims with a wet finger.
There is also a 'glass harmonica' on a similar principal.
|
orinoco
|
|
response 47 of 64:
|
Apr 6 02:50 UTC 1998 |
I've heard a tape of those singing bowls, courtesy of raven, but I've never
actually played one.
|
srw
|
|
response 48 of 64:
|
Apr 6 17:31 UTC 1998 |
I have never been to the Jewel Heart store, but I did visit their
website http://jewelheart.org/, when I linked it to the HVCN Religion
Infocenter. They have a page for their store, too. It looks like an
interesting place. I love the sound of a glass harmonica, but wonder if
the sound of Tibetan Singing Bowls, though made on the same design
principle, might be different in some way.
I think I may have heard a recording of them once, but the memory is
vague.
|
keesan
|
|
response 49 of 64:
|
Apr 8 02:00 UTC 1998 |
It sounds like the bowls are not filled with water. Perhaps they are heavy
enough to resonate without having to add water. Are they lower pitched than
the glass harmonica or wine glasses?
|