| Grex > Agora46 > #181: Iraq needs more than just liberation (read $$$$) |
| response 25 of 81: | 
Aug 28 19:20 UTC 2003 |
A lot more medieval than most of Christianity.
| response 26 of 81: |
Aug 28 19:52 UTC 2003 |
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| response 27 of 81: |
Aug 28 22:26 UTC 2003 |
Re #19, if the CIA hadn't helped Saddam's Baath party to power all this would've never happened. Read the history of Iraq. Its full of manipulation, first by the British and then (and now) by the US.
| response 28 of 81: |
Aug 28 23:34 UTC 2003 |
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| response 29 of 81: |
Aug 29 00:24 UTC 2003 |
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| response 30 of 81: |
Aug 29 02:06 UTC 2003 |
No doubt it's emotionally satisfying to slam sj2 for the historical failings of the Indian government but how exactly is that relevant?
| response 31 of 81: |
Aug 29 02:31 UTC 2003 |
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| response 32 of 81: |
Aug 29 02:36 UTC 2003 |
Does that mitigate the severity of the US's failings or does it just give us leave to tell those uppity foreigners to shut up because they're no better?
| response 33 of 81: |
Aug 29 04:02 UTC 2003 |
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| response 34 of 81: |
Aug 29 14:29 UTC 2003 |
Someone car bombed a Shiite mosque during prayers today. 17+ dead, 100+ dead/injured. On the assumption that it wasn't Americans, my first though was it was Sunis, the sect associated with Saddam Hussein's admin.
| response 35 of 81: |
Aug 29 15:25 UTC 2003 |
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| response 36 of 81: |
Aug 29 17:40 UTC 2003 |
Re #31, #33: Turn that logic around, Dan. You've entered posts critical of the Palestinians. Shouldn't you be posting criticisms of the US as well, in the interest of fairness?
| response 37 of 81: |
Aug 29 17:49 UTC 2003 |
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| response 38 of 81: |
Aug 29 19:55 UTC 2003 |
Cross, besides what's said above, what happens or happened in India, is a)on a small scale compared to what's being discussed here, and b) affects India itself, unlike what we're discussing where it's affecting more than just US. India has never been the one putting on the mantle of big brother, and taking it upon herself to "protect" all other countries from their evil dictators. You're not quite comparing apples to apples here. Tod, by the 5 year gestation period, I mean that the Shariat believes that the woman can be pregnant for upto 5 years after her divorce, and then have a child. Don't look at me, that's what they belive
| response 39 of 81: |
Aug 29 20:27 UTC 2003 |
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| response 40 of 81: |
Aug 29 20:51 UTC 2003 |
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| response 41 of 81: |
Aug 29 21:31 UTC 2003 |
If you read my posts carefully, I am always been sharply critical of politicians everywhere. And I have never failed to admit the atrocities commmitted by Indian politicians too. Being an Indian, I know better than you the atrocities committed by them, be it Punjab or the back- stabbing of the Indian army by its PM in SriLanka. But I fail to see how does that justify what US is doing? Re #33, Cross, why don't you post a fact (not an opinion) I posted and I will try to dig the sources behind it. Of late, I've posted a lot of material from the RUPE's "Behind the Invarion of Iraq". If you question their sources, I would advise you to read their report and follow the sources they have mentioned in their report. "and all they wanted was an autonomous state ". Would you grant autonomy to Texas if they demanded it? Why would a sovreign nation not thwart designs of a separatist movement? I will tell you why its our business to butt in US-Pakistan relationships!! Because those missiles fired at our crafts in Kashmir by terrorists are Stinger missiles manufactured in the US of A!!! THAT IS WHY!!! From Patton tanks to F-16s, the equipment used by the Pakistani Army to fight us it supplied by the US of A.
| response 42 of 81: |
Aug 29 22:33 UTC 2003 |
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| response 43 of 81: |
Aug 29 22:41 UTC 2003 |
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| response 44 of 81: |
Aug 30 05:44 UTC 2003 |
When you couldn't argue on the US-Iraq issue, you shift the arguement to India/Kashmir. *sigh* Maybe you don't read what I write. So I will write again. I am sharply critical of politicians who screw people irrespective of their nationality. So, yes, I blame the Indian politicians for the mess but that doesn't absolve the US of the its wrong-doings. About Punjab, the state has no signs of a separatists movement anymore. The population participates in state and national elections now. Enough proof that the state chose to stay in the Union and the separatist movement had no mass support. Further, I am prepared to argue if you wish to defend the US's doings in Iraq/Middle-East. However, if you want to argue about India/kashmir/Pakistan, I suggest you start another thread; I will be glad to post there.
| response 45 of 81: |
Aug 30 08:09 UTC 2003 |
To summarize, sj2, your arguement is that prior to GulfWar-I (lets hope there isn't III, inshallah) Iraq had generally a modern ifrastructure (other than just about all municipalities dumping raw sewage in the rivers) despite the regime's practice of diverting funds towards its own ends (even a glutton can only eat so much). Such was probably the case. However, you seem to ignore the fact that subsequent to the temporary halting of active hostilities (the armastice in '91) a state of 'cause belli' (war) existed between Iraq and the US et al and technically existed up until the recent events. Thus the degradation in infrastructure (while at the same time personally benefiting) is clearly the fault of the former Iraqi regime's failure to live up to what it agreed to do. The fault/blame for the current situation is clearly that of the former regime not the US et al (and many of the 'et al' were more than happy to play off the book games for their own personal/national benefit). I also think it is fair to say that the US has no territorial ambitions in Iraq. Indeed, I'd say it doesn't even care that much about the oil as the vast majority of that is shipped to other nations (including India I might point out).
| response 46 of 81: |
Aug 30 17:18 UTC 2003 |
Ahh!! I see the light. While other nations are selfish and petty, its only the US that always heroically steps in to save the downtrodden and liberate them from misery. And the US does all this with a spirit of self-less devotion to the cause of humanity and democracy?? I am all choked and teary-eyed. Hang on, so why did this great nation systematically bomb the Iraqi infrastructure? http://www.rupe-india.org/34/torment.html Why did the US create the "Highway of Death"? http://www.digitaljournalist.org/issue0211/sloyan.html The media management? http://www.pearsoncollege.ca/media_criticism/02hreadgulfwar.html The massacre of fleeing Iraqi soldiers? Violation of International treaties and again destruction of Iraqi civic infrastructure? http://www.renaissance.com.pk/mjunrefl961.html Overlooking the disastrous consequences of the sanctions? http://www.gulflink.osd.mil/declassdocs/dia/19950901/950901_511rept_91.h tml Why did three heads of the UN Aid programme in Iraq resigned terming the sanctions as genocide? Can you explain these?
| response 47 of 81: |
Aug 30 17:46 UTC 2003 |
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| response 48 of 81: |
Aug 31 03:48 UTC 2003 |
(NB: Texas seceded from the Union circa 1860 and was not allowed to leave, just like the other States that seceded.)
| response 49 of 81: |
Aug 31 04:19 UTC 2003 |
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