You are not logged in. Login Now
 0-17   17-41   42-66   67-90       
 
Author Message
25 new of 90 responses total.
lilmo
response 17 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 4 21:39 UTC 1999

Re resp:15 - Yes, that's correct.  I wanted to be clear, b/c the last time
I saw that analogy, someone had displayed it in such a manner that it was
clear that he was included in it.  He thought it was amusing, and so do I.
aaron
response 18 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 4 21:53 UTC 1999

So this time, you put the cart before the horse. Not that I'm calling you
a horse, or anything.
dpc
response 19 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 5 15:41 UTC 1999

Er, actually I have to wait to do M-Net's monthly statements until
after the UM Credit Union statement comes because I don't know what
we will have earned in dividends (interest).  The UMCU statement
comes no earlier than the 7th of the month; it wasn't in the PO box
yesterday.  Then I do our monthly statement and post it ASAP.
        Aruba, could you please post the total Grex income for
each of the past six months in this item?  I am somewhat concerned
as well about declining income recently.  (Or tell me where to find
the income figures in your directory.)
dpc
response 20 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 5 18:12 UTC 1999

I got the income figures from old items in this conference.
Here are the total "credits" for the past six months:

April       $836.25
May          584.00
June         668.00
July         453.20
August       238.00
September    326.20

Adding these up gives $3105.65.  Monthly average is $517.61.
July, August, and September were all *below* the monthly average.
The trend is not good.
aruba
response 21 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 5 19:06 UTC 1999

Here are the figures for average monthly income into the general fund for
the year from September '98 through August '99: 

Member Dues    $456.92
Auction        $105.00
Miscellaneous  $208.88  ($71.77 without windfall income)
               -------
               $770.79  ($633.69 without windfall income)

We had two large windfalls in the period - the tax credit from Ameritech
and the donation of spare parts which resulted in most of the spare parts
fund being moved into the general fund.  I broke those out so it's clear
how we would have done without them.

Here were our average monthly operating expenses for the same period:

Phone lines         $272.32
ISDN connection      $95.74
Electricity          $66.09
Rent                 $63.30
Miscellaneous        $43.61
Bank service charges  $3.04
ICNET link            $1.67
                    -------
                    $545.77

Which means that our non-windfall income exceeded our expenses by an
average of $87.92 per month, for a total of $1055.03 on the year.  If
you're wondering just what I'm including up there and what I'm leaving
out, here's the overall balance sheet for the year.  For purposes of this
accounting, I've included the Silly Hat Fund in the General Fund.

 Amount         Description

 $2,537.18      General Fund balance on 9/1/98

   $675.00      Misc. Transfers from Spare Parts Fund
   $970.27      Ameritech Tax Refund
 $1,055.03      Operating Surplus
    $77.00      Grex Store sales
     $8.00      Sales of handbooks
    $35.32      Refund for erroneous long distance
   $(11.76)     Use Tax from '98
   $(56.00)     UPS ($119 came from UPS fund)
    $(5.80)     Temporal distortion in phone bills

 $5,284.24      General Fund balance on 8/31/99

The temporal distortion in the phone bills is caused by the fact that the
phone costs I reported were those we incurred in the period named, but
some things you pay for after the fact, like local calls and price hikes.

So I think it's fair to say that Grex had a teriffic year.  As for the
"trend" of the last 3 months, if I showed you my graph of income by month
you would see that it is very erratic.  At a glance, I see several periods
of 3 or more months in which income was slow; Jul-Sep of '95 is one,
Nov '95 - Jan '96 is another, Aug '98-Oct '98 would have been if not for
the auction.  We always bounced back.

Believe me, Dave & Don, if I thought we had a problem, I would be out
there agreeing with you.  But the data don't support anything but a robust
assessment of Grex's finances.
don
response 22 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 6 01:13 UTC 1999

I don't necessarily think there's a problem; I can't think there's a problem
when the current general fund could sustain grex for almost a year without
any income. I'm simply noting a trend; just feel really, really lucky that
I wasn't here back during grex's financial crunch(es).
krj
response 23 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 6 04:12 UTC 1999

The number I would worry about is the slight sag in the membership numbers.
janc
response 24 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 6 05:09 UTC 1999

So far as I know, Grex hasn't had a financial crunch since the days of
its infancy, in 1991 and 1992.  Certainly for as long as I've been
around, we have always had the three month cussion that it was generally
agreed that we needed.

I agree with Ken.  It concerns me that we haven't seen any growth in
memberships for a long time, and now seem to be seeing a slight decline.
rcurl
response 25 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 6 07:18 UTC 1999

There is talk now and then about seeking memberships somewhat more
ardently, but nothing much ever seems to come of it. How about 
appointing a membership committee with the goal of doubling the 
membership in a year?
mary
response 26 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 6 11:02 UTC 1999

I think we just got our first volunteer!  Maybe even the Chair? ;-)
danr
response 27 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 6 12:33 UTC 1999

Getting someone to do it is always the problem.  I point this out because I
volunteered to work on getting more memberships some time ago and think I was
even appointed membership chairperson (or some such title) at a board meeting a
year or so ago.  Obviously, I haven't been working at it very hard.

Like any organization--non-profit or for-profit--Grex has to keep its PR
machine humming. You'd think that with all the resources of the Internet at our
disposal, we'd be able to attract more users.

Whatever happened to our ad on Arborweb?  Did they finally take it down? How
about the classified ad we had in the Food Co-op newsletter?  Maybe we should
put up some posters around campus and downtown again.  Any other ideas?
omni
response 28 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 6 14:38 UTC 1999

  I used to be the membership chair. I established the membership conference.
I also was removed from being membership chair due to incompetence.

 heh, at least I'm honest about my incompetence. More than can be said for
Clinton.
rcurl
response 29 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 6 15:58 UTC 1999

Clinton was membership chair? 

I decline, on grounds of already having too many volunteer obligations.
However such things as membership development are precisely the obligation
of the board. Until they can find a volunteer to do the job properly,
they should do it themselves. For starters, how about having the TV
ad on community television say how to *join*, not just how to log in?
All Grex publicity could be aimed at seeking members, not just users. 
"Support your local on-line conferencing system - GREX - by becoming a member
now", etc.
mcnally
response 30 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 6 17:12 UTC 1999

  re #29:  Yes, and he was so bad at the job that nobody even knew 
  he held the position..
mary
response 31 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 6 20:12 UTC 1999

The Board is not obligated to pick up jobs like this.  If 
volunteers can't be found then the job doesn't get done.
Insisting the Board do it all is a great way to make certain
the only people who run for the Board are unemployable slugs
who live for television and Grex.

Nice try though. ;-)
danr
response 32 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 6 22:39 UTC 1999

Ultimately, the board is responsible for everything, including membership
development.  Unless, of course, the board decides to simply disband.  They can
decide not to do anything if they feel there are other priorities, but if a
lack of members is seriously threatening Grex's existence, they should take
some action.
i
response 33 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 6 23:47 UTC 1999

I see no serious threat to grex's existence, nor any purpose in twisting
the boards' arms on the subject of increasing membership.
mdw
response 34 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 7 02:45 UTC 1999

Ultimately, the board is responsible for nothing.  The *membership* at
large is responsible.  Let's not blame the board for this, or try to
volunteer them into this task.
rcurl
response 35 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 7 04:25 UTC 1999

The board is *legally* responsible for the proper management of the
corporation - it is called fiduciary responsibility. The members have
*no* specific responsibilities except to elect the board. 

Your hypothesis has been disproven, Marcus, by the failure of member
volunteers to generate a functional membership program. 
mdw
response 36 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 7 06:22 UTC 1999

Not so.  The membership *elects* the board -- and indeed, the board
consists of nothing more than select members of the membership at large
who have volunteered time they might spend doing other things instead.
If the board fails to fulfill its duties, in the absence of fraud or
other gross violations (which I'm sure you will agree is not the issue
here), the fault lies with the voters in not selecting more responsible
board members.  The board *does* have certain extra legal
responsibilities -- but they are *NOT* responsible for the ultimate
success or failure of grex, **WE**, as a colective whole, are.  If
**WE** here cannot come up with a working functional membership program,
and grex dies because of that, it will *NOT* be the fault of the board
and, for instance, it will not be possible to sue the board for failure
to do their legal duty (they've fulfilled their legal responsibilities
already, by reporting financial reports, such as this, and discussing
long-term membership trends).  It will be, plain and simple, *OUR*
collective fault, and it would be just plain rude to blame the board for
our collective failure.  It's also just plain pointless; the board would
probably be more than willing to listen to anyone who sounded like they
had a viable plan to increase membership and the interest to follow
through on that plan.  There's absolutely no necessity for that person
to be a board member.  Finding a skapegoat is an ancient biblical
tradition.  It is not, however, a good way to solve real problems.  So
let's get out of the "it's their fault" mode, and talk about real
solutions instead, and what *we*, individually or together, are willing
to do to make those solutions happen.

Here is a possible outline for how to solve the problem:
 I. identify why we're not getting more members:
        A. why are we losing old members?
                -- boredom?  "grex is doing fine without me"?
                "waiting for the credit card thing to be set up"?
                -- can we survey ex-members and find out?
        B. why aren't we getting new members?
                -- poor indians?  "I already pay my ISP"?  "starving student"?
                "grex is too slow"?  "i can't run my IRC client here"?
                -- can we do research to refine these theories?
                -- can we identify a subset of new users who
                have the resources and potential to contribute?
 II. take steps to raise more money and recruit new members
        A. identify past sources of extra money, and milk them.
                -- another auction?  renovate the grex store?
                goto more local swap meets?
        B. make it easier to become a member
                -- throw a monthly party, like a picofest.
                -- organize a travelling "grexmobile" that travels
                from state to state and meets grexers.
                -- think of other ways to make grex more immediate
                and "local" to communities of grex users in other places.
                (sub-membership volunteers?)
danr
response 37 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 7 12:26 UTC 1999

re #36:  Ideally, the membership as a whole is responsible.  In practice, it
hardly ever works that way.  Just as you would not expect the membership as a
whole to run down to the Pumpkin to reboot the computer should it crash, you
can't expect the membership as a whole to take some action on membership
levels.  If the number of members is a problem--and I'm NOT saying it's a
critical problem--it is up to the board to raise this issue and to initiate
action to correct it.

Having said that, mdw does have some good ideas as to how to increase
membership.  I still think the idea of personally contacting non-members who
use Grex a lot, whether it be party, conferencing, or simply for email, might
be even more effective.
aruba
response 38 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 7 14:12 UTC 1999

Thanks, Marcus, for taking the discussion away from finger pointing and
toward brainstorming.  I think I could come up with some statistics showing
how many "long term" members we usually have, and how many "short termers",
and we could find out if there's been a significant drop in either one.

I did do a graph of our membership over time, and since July '94 we have
basically stayed between 80 and 100 members, with two dips below 80 (in late
'94 and early '95) and a couple of trips above 100 (in mid '95 and early '97).
We've been down around 80 for the couple of months.  I reported 79 in this
report, but the final numbers for the last two months will go up, because 
there are a few people who I expect to pay late.

I think if an analysis shows that we've been losing long-term members, writing
to them and askling for reasons is a good idea - I'm willing to do that.

I think Dan's idea of writong to long-time conference users who aren't
members and asking them to think about it is a good one too.  (A long time
ago we agreed that we should set up a system whereby users passing their
3-month, 6-month, etc. anniversaries on Grex would get mail inviting them
to become members.  Valerie and Jan volunteered to work on that, but that
was pre-Arlo.) 
rcurl
response 39 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 7 18:00 UTC 1999

Well...a little finger pointing can do some good, too. It helps getting
people interested and involved. 

One thing missing from Marcus' list in #36 is the goal of obtaining
memberships in order to support the purposes and goals of Grex. That is,
to seek support for Grex on the basis of community spirit to support a
community resource. This is, admittedly, somewhat intangible, so we tend
to emphasize "services" and "benefits", but after all, most of the current
members don't join because of extra benefits offered by membership. This
is where leadership is needed to develop and express membership programs
based upon the charitable purposes of the organization. 

don
response 40 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 7 19:16 UTC 1999

<set CONTRIBUTION-TO-DISCUSSION=off>
Arlo? What's that?
flem
response 41 of 90: Mark Unseen   Oct 7 20:17 UTC 1999

A, uh, special project, of sorts.   :)

re resp:35  It could be argued that volunteers have, in fact, created a 
functional membership program -- the one in place now.  The conjecture 
that it will not continue to be functional in the future is still a 
matter of opinion.  

I think one reason why more regular users don't become members is 
because of a lack of a sense of urgency.  There doesn't seem to be any 
overwhelming reason to become a member *now*, as opposed to, oh, say, 
next time I'm paying my bills and I happen to think of it.  I know I've 
been meaning to get around to sending in a check for at least three 
years, but it has never quite happened, for one reason or another.  And 
yet Grex continues to exist, without significant financial difficulty 
and with qualified leadership.  

I'll try to find that checkbook one of these days!  :)
 0-17   17-41   42-66   67-90       
Response Not Possible: You are Not Logged In
 

- Backtalk version 1.3.30 - Copyright 1996-2006, Jan Wolter and Steve Weiss