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Grex > Books > #77: The Mysterious Quote - Fall 1998 Edition | |
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| 25 new of 207 responses total. |
polygon
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response 141 of 207:
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Dec 2 17:18 UTC 1998 |
Re 139. It is not Wilkie Collins.
Re 140. I realize that there is some ambiguity there. You didn't ask,
but I'll tell: this letter was not written for publication. The writer
died twelve weeks later.
Later today, I will post an additional quote from the same writer which
*was* written for publication.
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mdw
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response 142 of 207:
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Dec 2 19:14 UTC 1998 |
Louisiana?
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polygon
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response 143 of 207:
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Dec 2 20:35 UTC 1998 |
The L. place is not Louisiana.
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mcnally
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response 144 of 207:
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Dec 3 05:49 UTC 1998 |
Lesotho? :-)
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md
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response 145 of 207:
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Dec 3 12:03 UTC 1998 |
Lumbago? (Or whatever Albert Schweitzer's place was called?)
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md
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response 146 of 207:
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Dec 3 12:16 UTC 1998 |
[But that would make it 20th century. Never mind.]
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polygon
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response 147 of 207:
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Dec 3 13:06 UTC 1998 |
The L. place is neither Lesotho nor Lumbago. I'm sorry to say that it
is more obscure than that, and that the letter references it in a
somewhat eccentric way (a second word which would normally accompany
it is omitted).
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polygon
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response 148 of 207:
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Dec 3 20:22 UTC 1998 |
Here's another excerpt:
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The advantage of a first meridian is known even to those who know least of
the science on which it depends. To doubt it would be to doubt the
advantage of Longitude which regulates every movement on the ocean, and
the divisions and subdivisions; in short the correct measurement of every
part of our globe. All nations have agreed in the propriety of establishing
a first meridian. Every Mariner at Sea, from the time he leaves port,
begins to calculate his distance by reference to some fixed meridian, and
every astronomical observer on land, in making his calculations obeys the
same rule.
Scientific men agree that it would be of advantage to science, if all
nations would adopt the same first meridian and before the discovery of
the new world, this was the case. It appears that the antient Geographers
had adapted for their first meridian a line passing through the most
distant of the Fortunate or Canary Islands, because it was the most
western land then known. It appears also, that the changes which the
antients made in their first meridians, of which there were several, were
made in consequence of the discovery of the neighboring Islands, which
were still more to the westward, and on the principle of passing it
through the most western point with which they were acquainted.
But after the discovery of America which banished the idea of the most
western limit, that of a general meridian gradually lost ground; and
latterly it has been completely abandoned. The great maritime and
commercial nations of Europe have respectively established first meridians
of their own: England, hers at Greenwich; France, hers at the observatory
Paris; and several other nations at some fixed point within their
respective limits since the period alluded to, the establishment of a
first meridian, -- for themselves, has become by the usage of nations, an
appendage, if not an attribute of sovereignty.
The United States have considered the regulation of their coin, and of
their weights and measures, attributes of sovereignty. The first has been
regulated by law, and the second has occasionally engaged their attention.
The establishment of a first meridian appears, in a like view, to be not
less deserving of it, at least until by common consent, some particular
meridian should be made a standard.
In admitting the propriety of establishing a first meridian within the
United States, it follows that it ought to be done with the *greatest*
mathematical precision. It is known that the best mode yet discovered for
establishing the meridian of a place is by observations made on the
heavenly bodies; and that to produce the greatest accuracy in the result,
such observations should be often repeated at suitable opportunities,
through a series of years by means of the best instruments. For this
purpose an observatory would be of essential utility. It is only in such
an institution, to be founded by the public, that all the necessary
implements are likely to be collected together; that systematic
observations can be made for any great length of time and that the public
cn be made secure of the result of the labors of scientific men. In favor
of such an institution, it is sufficient to remark, that every nation
which has established a first meridian within its own limits, has
established also an observatory. We know there is one at Greenwich, at
Paris, Cadiz, and elsewhere.
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polygon
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response 149 of 207:
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Dec 3 20:37 UTC 1998 |
The story so far: I have posted quotes at 130 (a private letter written in
the 19th century, 12 weeks prior to the writer's death) and 148.
The writer is acknowledged to be a dead white male.
Incorrect guesses: Trollope, Jefferson, Franklin, and Wilkie Collins.
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mjb
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response 150 of 207:
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Dec 3 22:23 UTC 1998 |
Martin Van Buren?
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polygon
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response 151 of 207:
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Dec 3 23:08 UTC 1998 |
Re 150. Not Martin Van Buren.
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davel
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response 152 of 207:
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Dec 4 02:27 UTC 1998 |
Melville?
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polygon
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response 153 of 207:
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Dec 4 05:16 UTC 1998 |
Re 152. Not Melville.
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remmers
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response 154 of 207:
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Dec 4 11:40 UTC 1998 |
I've a hunch that the author was American and the quotes are from
the early 19th century, based on factual and stylistic clues. The
interest in geography and measurement suggests Mason or Dixon, but
they did their famous surveying project (Mason-Dixon Line) in the
mid-18th century. I suppose one of them might have lived into the
19th century though, so I'll guess Mason or Dixon (I've no idea
which).
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polygon
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response 155 of 207:
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Dec 4 14:24 UTC 1998 |
Re 154. Yes, the author was American. Yes, both quotes are from the
first half of the 19th century. No, he was not either Mason or Dixon;
I would be very surprised if either one lived into the 19th century.
The writer is better known than those guys.
Incidentally, "Mason and Dixon line" as a socio-political term originated
in the overheated oratory of some Southern member of Congress in the 1850s
-- I'm sorry I don't have Safire's political dictionary handy to give the
specifics. Before that, Mason and Dixon had been forgotten for years.
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rcurl
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response 156 of 207:
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Dec 4 18:43 UTC 1998 |
The first meridian (Greenwich) was chosen by international accord in 1884.
What this author is saying about it is practically identical to what
John Ward had to say about the issue in 1714 - but then its not him.
I'll guess James Monroe, with L. being Loudoun (County), where he went,
deeply in debt and expecting reimbursement from Congress, to live with his
daughter prior to his death. His interest in the first meridian must have
devolved from his friendship with Jefferson and his interest in the
development and division of the west.
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mcnally
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response 157 of 207:
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Dec 4 23:03 UTC 1998 |
That sounds plausible. I'd be willing to bet that the writer is at
least a known political figure..
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polygon
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response 158 of 207:
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Dec 5 03:48 UTC 1998 |
Drat, I don't get to post the third quote -- a detailed eyewitness account
of a particularly turbulent stage of the French Revolution. I figured
that one would give it away, since Monroe was in Paris at the time as a
diplomatic representative of the United States.
Rane is correct that the writer is James Monroe (1758-1831), who was
President of the U.S. from 1817 to 1825, and correct that "L." stands for
Loudoun (County, in Virginia), but wrong about where Monroe went to live
with his daughter: it was in New York City, in the neighborhood now known
as the Lower East Side.
On a guided tour there a few years ago, the house where Monroe died, on
July 4, 1831, was pointed out. The letter posted in #130 was addressed by
Monroe, who was in New York, to James Madison, his predecessor as
President, and dated April 11, 1831. The "Mrs. M." in the letter refers
to Dolly Madison.
Obligatory Political Graveyard reference: Monroe was buried (or
really, entombed in an undergound vault) in Marble Cemetery, off 2nd
Avenue in New York City, but then reburied in 1858 in Hollywood
Cemetery in Richmond, Virginia. Michigan's first governor, Stevens
T. Mason, was also laid to rest in Marble Cemetery, and also removed
for reburial, in downtown Detroit in 1905. Marble Cemetery still
exists, but it's hard to see -- it has no street frontage (it's
literally in the middle of a block, surrounded by buildings) and is
not open to the public. To add to the confusion, there is another
unrelated Marble Cemetery a block away which does have some street
frontage.
The quote about the prime meridian dates from 1812, when Monroe was
Secretary of State and was asked to give a report on this subject by
Congress. I left out the parts where he emphatically declares "the
incompetency of his knowledge" on scientific subjects.
Rane is next.
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rcurl
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response 159 of 207:
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Dec 5 07:34 UTC 1998 |
While I am digging for a suitable quote (I'm currently reading _A Focus on
Peatlands and Peat Mosses_ by H. Crum, which is probably too obscure from
which to quote), I'd like to ask polygon what he has been reading by
or about Monroe, or is this a bit of research that came up with his
Political Graveyards studies?
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polygon
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response 160 of 207:
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Dec 5 13:24 UTC 1998 |
I suppose most of it came about through Political Graveyard research.
Recent email correspondence with a historian who also happens to be a
member of the Board of Trustees of Marble Cemetery has enhanced my
understanding of that cemetery's history. She originally contacted me to
correct the references to Marble Cemetery in my web site.
The tour of the Lower East Side of NYC, under the auspices of the Lower
East Side Tenement Museum, was conducted by Prof. James Shenton of
Columbia University.
Further, a biography of Monroe I picked up at a used book sale provided
the letter seen in #130. Because of my limited understanding of U.S.
political history in the first half of the 19th century, I have been going
out of my way to read up on it. The quotes about the prime meridian and
about the French Revolution were unearthed specifically for this item from
the 7-volume set of "The Writings of James Monroe", published in 1898,
which I located at the U-M library's storage facility on Greene Street.
Since Monroe's inaugural and State of the Union speeches are all on the
Web, I couldn't use those; any random phrase put to Alta Vista would
quickly turn them up.
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rcurl
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response 161 of 207:
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Dec 6 20:59 UTC 1998 |
"By about four in the afternoon we had crossed the summit of the
mountain line, said farewell to the western sunshine, and began to
go down upon the other side, skirting the edge of many ravines and
moving through the shadow of dusky woods. There arose upon all
sides the voice of falling water, not condensed and formidable as
in the gorge of the river, but scattered and sounding gaily and
musically from glen to glen. Here, too, the spirts of my driver
mended, andhe began to sing aloud in a falsetto voice, and with a
singular bluntness of musical perception, never true either to melody
or key, but wandering at will, like that of the song of birds. As the
dusk increased, I fell more and more under the spell of this artless
warbling, listening and waiting for some articulate air, and still
disappointed; and when at last I asked him what it was he sang - 'Oh,'
cried he, 'I am just singing!' Above all, I was taken with a trick he
had of unweariedly repeating the same note at little intervals; it was
not so monotonous as you would think, or, at least, not disagreeable;
and it seemed to breathe a wonderful contentment with what is, such
as we love to fancy in the attitude of trees, or the quiescence of
a pool."
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polygon
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response 162 of 207:
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Dec 7 03:34 UTC 1998 |
Jack London?
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rcurl
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response 163 of 207:
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Dec 7 05:44 UTC 1998 |
Not London, but like London, a male.
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remmers
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response 164 of 207:
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Dec 7 10:15 UTC 1998 |
Richard Haliburton?
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jep
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response 165 of 207:
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Dec 7 15:18 UTC 1998 |
Patrick McManus?
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