response 137 of 219:

Sep 2 16:06 UTC 1995

*nods*  Good rule of thumb, although some publishers are inconsistent.
Crossing Press comes to mind.  IF their women's studies division puts out 
a book on Paganism, it tends to be of  the separatist Goddess-worship 
variety, and pretty piss-poor examples of that variety.  If their 
religion/folklore division puts out a book on Paganism, it tends to be
fairly well written and edited, and more balanced.  Unfortunately, without
really looking close, it's hard to know which division put out a 
particular book (unless it's obvious from the title).

response 139 of 219:

Sep 6 13:23 UTC 1995

There is another book that I have seen, I will look up the title when I go
to borders next  <It might be the Llywellen one>

response 141 of 219:

Sep 7 13:25 UTC 1995

You might try The Complete Medicinal Herbal, by Penelope Ody.  
In addition to the usual listings of plants and their uses, it 
gives instructions on how to make most kinds of herbal 
preparations, including lists of the equipment and supplies you 
need to make each kind of preparation, and captioned color 
photographs of all the steps in each process.  Ody is a British 
herbalist who studied both in England and in China, so her book 
is an interesting mix of oriental and western herb lore.  I paid 
$30 for my copy at Grass Roots Nursery, but you might be able to 
get it cheaper.  

Grass Roots Nursery is a nice place to visit in it's own right, 
btw.  It's in New Boston.  From AA I guess you'd take I-94 east 
to I-275, then I-275 south to exit 11, then follow the signs.  

response 143 of 219:

Sep 7 15:25 UTC 1995

MD, sounds like a Grexpedition?

Jim, it was nice bumping into you last evening, however briefly.
I don't have TIME for ideas...<wry grin>  If you're not under any
time pressure about the incense thing, then I won't worry about it, but
I'll see what I can come up with for you.  I'm going up to Toronto at
the end of the month for an SCA thing, and I"ll be staying with R & T, so
I can ask for pointers then.

response 145 of 219:

Sep 15 15:26 UTC 1995

Thanks, md.  It's nice to do things with other Grexers, but time is so short
that if that particular trip isn't really spectacular, I'll wait.

response 147 of 219:

Nov 14 22:08 UTC 1996

D.J. copnway is not one of the world's best, is she.

response 149 of 219:

Nov 15 12:59 UTC 1996

I don't know if I mentioned it earlier - that's the problem with
leaving items around for two years >8) - but I laughed my head off
when I saw her "ancient Celtic method of organizing deities into
ten archetypes", which was actually none other than the Tree of
Life from Qabalism.  (ancient Jewish mysticism)  I guess she
supports that theory about the Celts being one of the lost Tribes...

response 151 of 219:

Nov 16 05:51 UTC 1996

Llewellyn?  Reputation for researched work?  When was that? <disbelieving 
laugh> Witta sux.  So does just about everything by Raymond Buckland.  So do
most of the popular "Celtoid" books.  Sigh.  Now, you folks have brought up
a lovely distinction; between historicity and "what works".  I mean, you're
right, Conway is a marvelously inspired and inspiring writer whose images
are rich, whose exercizes work.  They're about as Celtic as "Danny Boy"...
(there's a song about a guy from Ireland who comes to Boston and tries to
set himself up as a Celtic singer, but they won't have him since he doesn't
know the old Irish Rovers, English language, "lace curtain Irish" standards.)
I wish, as do most of the reconstructionist-types I know, that folks would
have the courage to say; "wow!  Look at this neat new system I just made up.
It really works.  Here are its roots, I took off from there" instead of needing
the security of a known origin, of calling it Celtic or Wiccan or Ancient or
wahtever.

response 153 of 219:

Nov 18 03:14 UTC 1996

I wasn't refering to ADF's policies or liturgy, but to those individuals, in
and out of ADF, who try and keep a balance between history and practicality in
as responsible ("authentic"???) a fashion as possible.

As to "reconstructionist Wicca", yes and no.  Something like that can be done
in two ways; by being very aware of the various threads which go into Wiccan
practice- folk magic, mythologies, cabala and masonry, British Ceremonial
Magic, etc. and even there, recognizing what is "real" and what is of recent
creation (The Charge of the Goddess is not Neolithic...<g>, Starhawk's 
"Descent of the Goddess" is not the same as the Sumerian legend, "rape"- as in
the "Rape of Persephone"- originally meant "carrying off" and was a stylized
part of the Greek marriage rite, with the problem there being that her dad 
agreed to it without consulting her mom..., etc.).  The other way of being
"historical" or "reconstructionist" with Wicca is to keep modern history and
"mythic history" clear; to know what Gardner wrote and where he seems to have
got it, who added what to the tradition, what the original intent of things
was and how that changes from tradition to tradition, to understand the
"mysteries" as taught by your tradition and any other you run across and be
aware of any changes in their transmission, and to recognize "mythic history"
as part of our process; no, there may not have been any "pacifist, egalitarian,
matriarchal, vegitarian" ancient society at the root of Wicca, but why do
people claim there was?  Where has Starhawk's creation myth made it into
Wiccan myteries and when?  Which peices of liturgy are "standards" and not
easy to change (or not appropriate to change carelessly) and which are regional
or tradition-specific? Lots of ways to be aware and accurate.  Not necessarily
a "reconstruction", but in the same vein.

response 155 of 219:

Nov 19 16:20 UTC 1996

Did you mean "I agree that paths with little foundation in historic practice
should ?not? pretend to have it."

response 157 of 219:

Nov 20 02:53 UTC 1996

OK, it's a valid position to say that new traditions, "paths with little
foundation", should not pretend to have it, but I think it's important in
understanding those traditions, and human nature in general, to understand
why they feel a need for "creative geneology" and "mythic history".  Everyone
does it...

There are materials, fragmentary and a bit hard to find, on pre-classical
Greek and Roman religion, pre-pharonic Egyptian religion, Sumeria and even Ur
and what Babylonia did when they got hold of the material, some reasonably
traceable stuff on the African traditions, a relatively pristine oral 
tradition from the Saami, and even the Norse material from Christian times
is more Norse than Christian and there's a fair bit from before that.  There
are medieval collections of Japanese tales which reflect their attempt to
collect older material, so it shows Buddhist and pre-buddhist thinking. A
number of South American Codices have begun to be translated.  I expect there
are a bunch of other materials I know nothing about.  So if folks truly
want to build a reconstructionist or even Wiccan practice with strong
cultural roots, it can be done. And I do know folks who are doing just that;
while everyone in their tradition learns the same basic liturgy and core
knowledge, each person is also strongly encouraged to study world mythologies
both widely and deeply, from as many original sources as possible, and to
find their own personal patron(s).  I've heard about rituals they've done
to Enki, the Sumerian father/river god, to Dionysus (sp?), in the Celtic
style, based on the cave paintings from France, Greek processional/Temple
rituals, etc.  It's pretty close to "reconstructionist Wicca", I suppose.

response 159 of 219:

Nov 22 03:18 UTC 1996

hey- I said "relatively".  It is.  Or was into this century.
I take it you found no disagreement with the rest of my comments, since you
had no response?