response 102 of 176:

Jun 15 23:11 UTC 2001

Umm, calling ``all of the ISPs'' is almost certainly not the right approach.
For example, I really don't get the impression that Earthlink is really
capable of selling service that grex would find useful.

response 104 of 176:

Jun 18 04:40 UTC 2001

   Heh.  Unfortunately, that guarantee doesn't matter much--when they're
down I believe they sometimes give out a rebate.  I know several people
who've used E business data lines, and I don't think they came exactly
close to that kind of uptime.  However, to be fair I think that most 
places have problems with uptime claims.  The net is still young.

response 106 of 176:

Aug 7 18:42 UTC 2001

http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1004-200-6801618.html?tag=nbs
 
"Covad foresees bankruptcy, restructuring"
 
...
> Covad said it does not expect a bankruptcy filing to 
> include its operating companies, which it
> expects will continue to provide service normally. 
> Covad said it had 333,000 customers in
> service on its network as of June 30. 

This sounds like it might be good news, but someone better trained in 
reading business articles would have to say for sure.

response 108 of 176:

Aug 12 01:24 UTC 2001

There may be an example or two I'm missing, but I can't think of any network
companies recently that have gone into bankruptcy and made it out alive. 
Northpoint got lots of publicity for shutting down their network.  Ricochet
(a provider of mobile wireless Internet access) more quietly shut off their
network a few days ago.  Rhythms, Covad's remaining non-RBOC competitor, sent
termination notices to all its customers a couple of days ago.  It is still
possible that somebody will buy Covad, or at least its network and subscribers
-- they should be able to do so pretty cheaply and without inheriting the debt
at this point, but it's starting to seem a lot less likely.  The companies
I've seen being bought even recently have tended to be bought for pennies on
the dollar well before they get into bankruptcy.

response 110 of 176:

Aug 12 15:01 UTC 2001

Here's the Rhythms shutdown story on Cnet:
 
http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1004-200-6838020.html

response 112 of 176:

Aug 13 04:06 UTC 2001

Unless I'm missing something, getting a "backup" connection of
sufficient capacity is liable to double our networking expenses.

response 114 of 176:

Aug 15 05:02 UTC 2001

The other approach would be to get a more stable looking replacement
connection instead of a backup.

response 116 of 176:

Aug 15 18:03 UTC 2001

As I understand it, the window for modifying or escaping the Corecomm
/ Covad contracts expired without Grex taking any action, and as a 
result Grex is contractually bound to pay for the Corecomm / Covad 
service into June? 2002.    I'd guess the chances at 50-50 that Covad's
DSL users will have lost service before then. 

Can Grex get out of the contracts based solely on a fear
that the other party is likely to default?   If we are stuck with 
ten more months of this contract, then we are thinking either of 
a backup insurance connection, or we are thinking of riding out 
the DSL shutdown if it happens.

A no-cost proposal would be to talk to CoreComm.  Grex can't be the 
only DSL customer biting its nails.

response 118 of 176:

Aug 15 19:23 UTC 2001

Let me try to summarize my paranoia for the people who don't work with 
networks.  This is probably repetitive.
 
The staff has gone to great trouble to assemble a spare parts pile
for the Sun machine.  But the network connection is just as 
critical to the Grex community as the Sun machine: 
take away the network connection, and the e-mail stops, and the 
vast majority of users are cut off.   We currently have no backup
for the Internet connection, and in the current business situation
I think the connection is in serious danger.
 
Grex's network service relies on Covad to supply the DSL connection
to the Pumpkin.  There were two other companies similar to Covad:
non-Baby Bell companies trying to sell DSL service.  These companies,
Northpoint and Rhythms, cut off their customers or 
are in the process of cutting off their customers when they failed
as businesses.  Covad itself is filing for bankruptcy reorganization.
In the current economic climate, there is no reason to expect 
Covad customers to be fare any better than Northpoint or Rhythms 
customers.

As I see it, Grex has three options:
   1) Thinking about protecting itself by getting a backup insurance 
      connection, or by getting out of a relationship with Covad, 
      before Covad fails.   This way, a Covad DSL shutdown would be 
      a non-event to Grex.  This is expensive, no doubt.
   2) Thinking about riding out a Covad DSL shutdown.  This involves 
      planning NOW: does Grex move to a location with connectivity?
      Does Grex multiplex analog phone lines?  Or....?
   3) Don't think; this networking stuff is too complicated, and maybe
      Covad will pull through. 

A comparison would be Chinet.  According to a Chicago transit web site
hosted by Chinet, Chinet was down for three weeks after Northpoint 
cut them off, before they could get a replacement T1 line installed.

response 120 of 176:

Aug 16 12:33 UTC 2001

Well, if Covad suddenly disappears we could probably re-establish a dial-up
PPP connection pretty quickly.  This would give us *some* kind of net
presence, though not anything anyone will really want to use.  It's a better
stop gap than completely disappearing off the net.

It'd be nice to have a meaningful fallback plan.  We discussed this at the
last staff meeting without coming up with anything even vague resembling a
viable plan.  I don't think we can afford to bring up a backup connection.
The best we can do is decide what connection type we should choose if Covad
goes away.  Seems like the choices are:
   - T1 - probably still out of our price range
   - Cable - has anyone checked if symmetric commercial service is available?
   - Ameritech DSL
   - ISDN - not very attractive from a cost/performance point of view
   - colocation

response 122 of 176:

Aug 16 20:41 UTC 2001

In the Covad disaster scenario, would it make sense to arrange for 
two dialup PPP connections, and use one of them to handle the e-mail 
load?  This might be easier than getting the stuff needed to multiplex
two phone calls into one connection.  Just ruminating.

response 124 of 176:

Aug 17 03:33 UTC 2001

Grex is pretty far beyond being able to run on a dial-up connection.

You don't need a provider who understands public access systems.  That's
irrelevant.  You need a provider who is willing to forward packets to
arbitrary incoming ports ("let you run your own server"), as would probably 
all the options above except apparrently your local cable company.  Likewise, 
symetric bandwidth is a red herring.  As long as the slower direction is fast 
enough, it's not a problem that the other direction is faster.

Grex probably does need a provider willing to do some handholding, although
whether the Grex staff will take advantage of the availability of said
handholding is another issue.  The current Grex staff approach to network
problems seems to be to label it as my problem, ignore any solutions I
suggest (such as making a phone call to the ISP) as too complicated, and wait
several weeks until I either make the necessary phone call (not very effective
when the ISP wants to know what the stauts lights on the router are doing),
or until the problem goes away on its own.  Since that's not a service I'm
able or willing to provide from this distance, Grex needs to find somebody
else to deal with network issues.  However, since that's a service Grex is
paying its current ISP for, and nobody is willing to take advantage of it,
I suppose another ISP willing to provide support on another sort of connection
may not be any more useful.