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cross
Why is software of such generally low quality? Mark Unseen   Feb 17 06:53 UTC 2009

This discussion came up on the well.  I thought it might be interesting to
ask similar questions here.

Basically, the question is this: Why is software of such generally low
quality?

Thoughts?
28 responses total.
veek
response 1 of 28: Mark Unseen   Feb 17 12:39 UTC 2009

lack of interest in what they do. pay based on factors not related to
quality. no regular testing of programming theory.
cross
response 2 of 28: Mark Unseen   Feb 17 15:57 UTC 2009

Those are certainly good answers, and all true; what else?

I will submit that at least part of it is an attitude that holds software
separate from other engineering disciplines, and in many ways superior to
them.  It's an implied attitude that it's too difficult to get it right,
and that programmers should just be excused.  It's an acceptance and
defense of the status quo.
veek
response 3 of 28: Mark Unseen   Feb 18 02:22 UTC 2009

(Ooo! yes! YES! Not just that it's too difficult to get it right  - out
here both get it equally wrong)! It's revenue! Right now programming
pays WAY more than engineering! In fact out here, engineers are well.. a
guy with a B.Com will pass out, bone up on C at NIIT (some training
institute) and he is then ready to bill some aussie client millions of
dollars maintaining some software on a VAX. A engineer does the exact
same job, but he wasted 4 years learning Calculus and Algebra and knows
nothing about high-finance.

I haven't seen much acceptance or defense because everyone is happily
clueless (me included). I have this friend who is good at his work and
I've seen him code, his solution will be simple, clean and elegant and
he will do it really quick (3 hours). On the other hand I'll take
(literally 1 week), and It'll be so crappy, I'll get fed up and take it
to him. The thing is he has bitched about bad code at work and people
humor him.

The thing is, in the US, because you have lots of competent people who
have actually worked a lot on software, there is this good example that
is still visible and only then what you says holds true (managers see
the competent guys and go Oo.. that saves time and money)
veek
response 4 of 28: Mark Unseen   Feb 18 02:24 UTC 2009

so they can actually accept their fate and defend/attack the wrong
decision.. out here, no one knows better and because the money is
flowing in, they see no reason to change their shady ways
keesan
response 5 of 28: Mark Unseen   Feb 18 05:52 UTC 2009

I just talked to my brother the programmer and he did not know what a VGA port
looks like, but was able to identify the one on his laptop after I described
it.  He has been doing software for 30 years or more.  I described a midi port
as being longer than a VGA port, to start with.  He found something with three
rows of holes on the back of the laptop.   He once complained about the
doorknobs falling off the doors inside a house he and friends were renting.
I wonder if he even owns a screwdriver.
remmers
response 6 of 28: Mark Unseen   Feb 20 19:50 UTC 2009

Re the premise of resp:0 - There's wonderful software out there, and by
Sturgeon's Law, 90% of everything is crap.  Is software different from
anything else in this respect?
veek
response 7 of 28: Mark Unseen   Feb 21 10:22 UTC 2009

Umm.. well, you are assuming Sturgeon is correct in that 90% of
everything is crap.. +what if 90% of Sturgeon's Law is crap.. Anyway, I
don't think he's right about software. If it were true, I'd be
uninstalling 90% of whatever software I install and that's not been the
case.. [standard assumptions and disclaimers do apply]
cross
response 8 of 28: Mark Unseen   Feb 27 15:20 UTC 2009

resp:6 There is some wonderful software, but even the good stuff is
bittle and prone to breaking.
veek
response 9 of 28: Mark Unseen   Feb 28 12:06 UTC 2009

Memory: I got a really bad short-term memory so this is a personal
problem. I'll define a variable and then forget what it was called so
I'll have to scroll up. Or, I'll define it in one function and then
slightly alter it within the next. Might help if the company had a
standard way to define vars and then waste time syncing them.

Companies should spend time training people in-house. A lot of guys
won't know the API properly (me) or a project will start without
management bothering to test to see if people are up to scratch. eg:
let's say that there is this coding project that requires Postscript..
team leads should check to see if people know the language and then make
sure that what they studied isn't lost through disuse. The testing for
standard functions (print, FileOpen, ParamProcessing, etc) so that
programmers (noobs) don't waste time doing commonly used stuff..

Kitchen: Traffic out here is hell. If you leave by 8, there will be a
shit-load of vehicles and you will slow-down to a crawl. Companies
should start early, and allow people to leave at an out of sync time wrt
the world. Will also help if they provided a kitchen or food (breakfast,
non salty snacks).

Bed: They should allow people to lie down and work. Sitting in a chair
kills me and tires me out faster.

AC/Carpeting: Hate it! If they switch it off for the day, then you get
scrwd when you come to work early because the room will be muggy.
Ideally, I'd like clean air, bare tables and floor, no dust, open
windows.. that kind of thing.. I'd get a lot more work done if I could
lie down and think, and maybe exercise a bit right where I work.. it
makes everything more relaxed.

A lot of Jap/Chinese companies do this: Employees are part of a family
and are treated as such. Indian companies on the other hand act like
f!ing morons - we mindlessly ape the West!

When you set-up a campus, it would make a lot of sense to set-up a
township as well, so that costs can be managed better! Look at what is
happening today out here.. they'll pay you a big salary (because they
were billing the clients anything) but the roads don't work, but you pay
a lot for rental, you waste time in commuting, etc.. instead the company
should take care of your daily needs (since the govt can't - or will do
it a lot less efficiently). It all affects your bottom-line and ability
to compete (in a recession).
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