response 1 of 63:

Jun 29 19:13 UTC 1994

I know Michael, aka Figment, and I met him again a few days
ago at the Magickal Life meeting.  (And where were you, Kami?  >8)
I'm really sorry to hear about this, since I used to live in
Sumpter, and my family still does.  Of course, I'm glad the
article got published before the Ypsi Press died.  >8)

response 3 of 63:

Jun 30 05:50 UTC 1994

Let's see how well I can retell it, as told second-hand by Fox and first-hand
by Windweaver:
About 2 Saturdays ago the Crafters were holding a ritual in the screen tent
outside Fig's mobile home.  A number of neighborhood boys, aged maybe 14 to
19, who have hassled Fig and his family before, were hanging around being
annoying, so someone (Thomas?) circled around behind them and either tapped 
a couple on the shoulder or just startled them by speaking and asked them to
leave.  One tripped and bruised himself a bit.  They ran off to their folks
and called the cops, claiming to have been assaulted with a sword (which the
person who spoke to them might still have been carrying- I forget).  

Well, the circle went on with the ritual, and in a little while heard sirens
but ignored them.  Next thing, the cops burst in with the usual "What'n hell's
going on here?" etc., frisked people, grabbed knives and tossed them in a
pile outside, etc.  Fig tried to point out that it was a religious ceremony,
but the cops blew them off at first.  One took the sage smudge and put it 
down on the wooden board which was serving as altar, so Figment pointed out
that that could cause a fire.  Instead, the cop doused it in the ritual 
chalice.  Well, eventually, everyone got calmed down, the situation explained,
the tools and everything presented, and so on.  The cops appologized.  
Someone suggested that next time, Figment himself call and press charges
against the kids for harrassment, so they figure out that it isn't a lark.
Well, hearing this story galvanized Fox into going down and talking to the
Ann Arbor cops before our Solstice ritual.  He got a very cordial reception
(helps to take proactive action, and to look "normal" I suppose), which made
it easier for Figment to make an appointment and go talk to the cops in his
area, so I think the net result may end up being positive.

Anyone who happens to talk to Figment or another of those folks, please feel
free to correct or ammend this account.  Thanks.

response 5 of 63:

Jan 18 18:31 UTC 1995

long since resolved.  cops suggested that next time, the Crafters press 
charges against the kids for harassment (some of them are over 18). Got
good newspaper and TV coverage out of it, and a better rapport withthe cops.
Useful over all, if scary at the time.

response 7 of 63:

Mar 7 17:50 UTC 1995

American religious xenophobia is responsible for incidents more serious than
this. this. Any who do not believe me can check the Circle Network News section
that deals with such matters.  It is not unheard-of for people to lose custodt
of children (please forgive typos) because of being pagan.

response 9 of 63:

Mar 17 19:05 UTC 1995

I agree.

response 11 of 63:

Mar 18 16:09 UTC 1995

Is the question really about where to draw a line? Seems to me the question is
which is the higher law, religious or secular? Unless you live in a place
where government dictates religion, societal law takes precedence.

response 13 of 63:

Mar 21 03:07 UTC 1995

The thing is, brighn, that christian morality *is* your rights end where
my nose begins, except that I should pick you up when you fall, and vise
versa.  Whether or not the actions suit the words, these are the morals,
and this is what our country was founded on.

response 15 of 63:

Mar 21 13:09 UTC 1995

Even if you do all of these "crimes" in a closet at home you're still
a victim.
And to be fair the founding fathers did not base the country on religion. Ther
has been a lot of debate on this but even christian scholars will admit this.
Perhaps it was based on some kernal of judeo christian philosophy, but not 
a religion, not the christian god.
IMHO!

response 17 of 63:

Mar 22 19:23 UTC 1995

I sould have to say that all those crimes have victems.  I have yet to
find a crime without a victem.

response 19 of 63:

Mar 23 21:55 UTC 1995

Out of curiousity, Dang, who is the victim of prostitution?
The hooker?  She is punished by society not as much by what she does
as by (a) having to do it because there are no other economically viable
options open to her and (b) breaking the law.  She IS a law-breaker, but
only because there are laws against it.
The john?  Not hardly.
Not only that, the hooker is the perpetrator of the crime... 
Can the perp also be the victim?

Who ist the victim of drug use?  The uiser -- again, the perp IS the
victim?  doesn't make any sense to me.

Maybe, you'll say, the victim is the little children that get run over
when somebody high on crack jumps the curb.  But the crime is reckless
driving, not drug use.  I believe all drugs should be legalized, but I
also believe that you are 100% responsible for your actions when you
are drunk/stoned/high/fucked up.  Actually, more responsible than when
sober, IMHO.

Show me the victims, Dang.

response 21 of 63:

Mar 24 18:17 UTC 1995

Yes, the victem can be the person who commits the crime.  The prostitute
and the john both lose because they are having sex in a loveless
situation, and this is emotionally damaging.  Ask the pshrinks. (One of
the few times I agree with them)  As for teh drugs, they are very, very
damaging to the users.  The users are definately victems.

response 23 of 63:

Mar 24 19:01 UTC 1995

        No kidding! I can't stand how people see a problem, look at ways
of punishing it, instead of solving it, and act like it's cool.
It's not.