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keesan
Health Food or Healthy Food Mark Unseen   Nov 24 00:03 UTC 2001

How would you define the difference between healthy food and health food?
82 responses total.
keesan
response 1 of 82: Mark Unseen   Nov 24 00:04 UTC 2001

I ask because my Indian penpal who is working full time and going to school
half time went home for Diwali and his parents were very concerned that he
is not eating enough health foods.  He also asked me to correct his English.
Are all health foods healthy?
orinoco
response 2 of 82: Mark Unseen   Nov 24 19:40 UTC 2001

I'd use 'health food' to mean food that's marketed as if it's healthy, whether
or not it really is.  Granola, for instance, used to be sold as health food,
even though most granola isn't really that good for you.
scott
response 3 of 82: Mark Unseen   Nov 24 21:38 UTC 2001

Olive oil is often considered "healthy", but I don't think you'd want to make
it your main source of calories.  Ditto other health foods; variety is rather
important.
keesan
response 4 of 82: Mark Unseen   Nov 24 22:27 UTC 2001

So if health foods (in moderation) are healthy, are they a subset of healthy
foods?  Sometimes I get the idea that what health food stores sell is to be
eaten in addition to a bad diet to make it better on average - lots of
supplements.  Would a rutabaga (organically grown of course) be a health food?
Does a health food have to be refined, or be put together out of several
ingredients (olive oil or granola) and be expensive?
mta
response 5 of 82: Mark Unseen   Nov 27 21:45 UTC 2001

By my definition, healthy foods are fresh, unrefined, unprocessed foods that
contain a moderate balance of nutrients.  Health foods are "food as penance".
i
response 6 of 82: Mark Unseen   Nov 27 23:49 UTC 2001

I generally figure that "health food" is defined by the media - which
means i'd call char-broiled salt lard "health food" if the media was
pushing it that way.

OTOH, "healthy food" is a phrase i use for foods a savvy nutritionist
would give the thumbs-up to eat a lot of (within calorie limits).

`Eating healthy foods' does NOT imply `eating a healthy diet' any more
than `all the players are good' implies that `the symphony orchestra 
is good'.
orinoco
response 7 of 82: Mark Unseen   Nov 29 17:25 UTC 2001

Good point, good point.  I suppose that explains why granola and olive oil
and so on aren't good staple foods.  They're healthy foods, but including them
doesn't make your diet healthy.
keesan
response 8 of 82: Mark Unseen   Nov 30 18:44 UTC 2001

What makes granola a health food?  It is mostly fat and sugar.
scott
response 9 of 82: Mark Unseen   Nov 30 20:54 UTC 2001

I dunno about that; my recipe has a lot of oats in it.
keesan
response 10 of 82: Mark Unseen   Nov 30 22:23 UTC 2001

What percentage of calories comes from the oats?
scott
response 11 of 82: Mark Unseen   Dec 1 00:30 UTC 2001

I have no idea.
mta
response 12 of 82: Mark Unseen   Jun 3 20:51 UTC 2002

Part of whether a diet is considered healthy depends on what one defines as
healthy.

Adding better foods to a "bad" diet may not make it optimal, but it certainly
makes it better.
jaklumen
response 13 of 82: Mark Unseen   Jun 4 00:18 UTC 2002

The nutritional pyramid, along with the rule of thumb of eating foods 
that are less processed (convenience has done dirty as far as the US 
eating healthy), seems like a good place for me to start eating 
healthy.

I also have a religious dietary law that seems to do well for me.
orinoco
response 14 of 82: Mark Unseen   Jun 4 08:19 UTC 2002

(Really?  Do tell.)
jaklumen
response 15 of 82: Mark Unseen   Jun 5 03:56 UTC 2002

About the Word of Wisdom, you mean?
orinoco
response 16 of 82: Mark Unseen   Jun 5 13:11 UTC 2002

Er, if that's what it's called, yes.  I didn't realize there was a dietary
code in the mormon church.
jaklumen
response 17 of 82: Mark Unseen   Jun 6 10:41 UTC 2002

Doctrine and Covenants, Section 89.  Joseph Smith set it forth in 1833 
and Brigham Young established it as a commandment in 1851, expounding 
on what it entails.

It proscribes the use of wine, strong drink (interpreted as alcohol-- 
the vow of the Nazarite is an interesting comparison), tobacco, and 
hot drinks (Young explained this to be tea and coffee).  Extensions to 
caffeinated soft drinks is a bit of an error.  Bruce R. McConkie, a 
leader in recent years (Quorum of the Twelve, I believe) stated in 
_Mormon Doctrine_ that he believed such (caffeinated soft drinks) to 
be against the spirit of the law.  For quite some time afterward, many 
members took this literally until leadership made it clear otherwise.

A good rule of thumb, however, would be to avoid addictive 
substances.  Many illicit drugs are not mentioned but are eschewed 
additionally by the LDS Church.  Working in convenience retail, I'm 
quite familiar just how strongly people can become addicted to tea, 
coffee, and even caffienated soft drinks.

Verses 12 and 13 seem to be a point of stumbling for some:
"12 Yea, flesh also of beasts and of the fowls of the air, I, the 
Lord, have ordained for the use of man with thanksgiving; nevertheless 
they are to be used sparingly;
13 And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used, only in 
times of winter, or of cold, or famine."

It should be noted, of course, that refrigeration practices were 
virtually nonexistent at the time this doctrine was set forth, and 
cattle or game had to be eaten quickly, even with the methods of 
preservation that was available.  Of course, the same had to be killed 
for food in climate extremes, or they would die anyway.

Nevertheless, verse 3, which states that the Word of Wisdom is "Given 
for a principle with promise, adapted to the capacity of the weak and 
the west of all saints, who are or can be called saints," there is a 
suggestion of some flexibility on the points of do's.

The most telling point is that the Word of Wisdom is highly compatible 
with the verdict of modern nutritionism, and yet was given at a time 
when such perspectives were not held.

It seems to work well for me =)

I have a friend in his 50s who converted to the LDS faith from 
Judaism; he is of the blood.  We've had interesting discussions on 
what kosher law he still practices.  He is fine with farm-fed pork, as 
farmers here keep pigs relatively clean and trichonosis is much 
rarer.  (Pigs can't sweat, and in the dry climes of the Middle East, 
were fain laid to roll in their feces if need be.  They are impeccably 
clean if given enough access to water, and there is an example of a 
species of pig on the Pacific Islands-- introduced a while back-- that 
hunts for food in the ocean.)  One of his daughters, who is also a 
close family friend, merely scoffs and claims he is just a pork 
monkey ;)  He still avoids shellfish, which I understand is mostly 
sifters such as scallops, mussels, clams, etc.
keesan
response 18 of 82: Mark Unseen   Jun 6 12:03 UTC 2002

The part about killing animals for food in the winter may be because there
is not a whole lot to eat in the winter in cold climates other than grains
if you don't have a way to preserve vegetables.  I think northern Europeans
eat a lot more meat than southerners.  Cows can eat silage, and they can also
eat grass pretty far into the winter months when there are not many vegetables
still growing (cabbages and leeks).  Chickens are not so large that you need
to preserve them.
jaklumen
response 19 of 82: Mark Unseen   Jun 7 00:48 UTC 2002

That would make sense.
i
response 20 of 82: Mark Unseen   Jun 7 02:47 UTC 2002

So what about decaf?  Herbal tea?  Chocolate?
jaklumen
response 21 of 82: Mark Unseen   Jun 7 07:21 UTC 2002

Decaf I believe is generally discouraged.

Herbal tea is just fine.

Chocolate is fine, but I'm sure it's a bad thing in excessive 
amounts.  Being sedentary and overweight, too, isn't a really good 
observance either.
i
response 22 of 82: Mark Unseen   Jun 8 13:04 UTC 2002

Hmmm.  So caffeine's okay given the right source.  Ditto hot cocoa.
Unhealthy excess/addiction/pigging out on literally anything is not
okay.  How about ice tea?
jaklumen
response 23 of 82: Mark Unseen   Jun 8 23:50 UTC 2002

Well.. first of all, you have to understand coffee and tea (black, 
most likely, not green) have a lot of other substances not exactly 
health-conducive *besides* caffeine.

Second, they are far greater in their caffeine content than colas and 
other caffeinated soft drinks, and even more so than chocolate.  The 
caffeine content in chocolate is relatively low-- but, it's possible 
to be addicted to chocolate.

Iced tea is not okay.  Herbal versions would be.

Interestingly enough, being overweight is not going to cause problems 
as far as membership, although failure to avoid the others will.  
We've our fair share of fat folks.  But-- it is a good idea to be trim 
and active, and careful observance of the Word of Wisdom *will* make 
this easier.

The reference is available online: http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/89
mta
response 24 of 82: Mark Unseen   Jun 9 13:33 UTC 2002

re: overweight ... over whose weight?  Who gets to decide what constitutes
"overweight?  

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