Transgender issues

Jun 28 21:19 UTC 1999

This item is for discussing transgender issues.  Not just for people who feel
they were born into the wrong sex body, but for all of us.  Are there ways
in which you feel you fit better into the opposite mold?  Do you have
interests or talents that are not expected of your sex (taxi driving for
women, artistic talent for men, or whatever)?  Do you have a personality that
you could better express if you were the opposite sex?  Do you ever wish
people would treat you as the opposite sex gets treated?  If you had a choice
of which sex body to be reborn into, would it be the same one you have now?
Do you sometimes feel that you have to act a certain way because it is
expected of you due to your chromosomes, but would rather not?  I am
particularly interested in whether bisexual people act much differently
depending on which sex they are with?  Would a bi woman act more 'manly' when
with a woman? 

response 2 of 54:

Jun 29 21:37 UTC 1999

We have an interesting society that is continually trying to change and 
reinvent itself.  It is easier than ever before to challenge the gender 
roles placed on us by the established rules of that society-- some roles 
that are very strong and firmly entrenched.  Yet some say we in the U.S. 
lead the world in feminist causes.  We're probably the only nation as 
well that started a men's movement that questioned modern roles of man.

It is probably the most difficult for those who are transgendered/
transsexual since they have made a change, or are in the process of 
making a change to their biological bodies to better fit their inner 
selves.  The transitional process is probably the hardest, since our 
society doesn't have a traditional role for them.

Transgendered people are also hit hard by violence, or "hate crimes."  
Most assailants are heterosexual men, if I remember right.

I think Sindi is raising some good issues: perhaps someday our society 
will come to the point where social roles will be decided individually 
rather than by consensus, and gender distinction will be de-emphasized.  
Or perhaps the opposite will happen..

response 4 of 54:

Jun 30 21:36 UTC 1999

resp:3  Well, of course, I would bet it's because it is sooo expensive 
and the surgery is practiced mostly in Sweden.  I doubt that many have 
the resources to cover it; for insurance to foot the bill, they must 
have a psychiatrist explain that a sex change would be in the best 
interest of mental health for the person.  Even the hormones are 
outrageously expensive, and hormonal therapy has to be given first.

I only saw one transgendered person in my hometown.  I guessed the 
person was taking hormones, since the person gradually developed some 
curves and breasts (transgendered biological male).  I'd seen this 
person on the bus sometimes, and my homophobic assistant manager at the 
Sbarro's Italian Eatery I worked at pointed out that the person worked 
at the optical store nearby the mall food court we were located in.  
This is why I say I think transgendered people are suffering more stigma 
than the glb folk; it's harder to blend in.

response 6 of 54:

Jul 1 21:04 UTC 1999

It *does* make you wonder.  The label transgender would certainly 
include the first-- a rebellion towards gender roles, while transsexual 
would more definitely suggest the latter.

response 8 of 54:

Jul 2 13:52 UTC 1999

I was hoping that people would use this item to help reassure omni that he
is not a freak, but rather part of a continuum.  Nobody is completely typical
of either sex, except possibly briefly, as the rules keep changing when
different behaviors go in and out of fashion.  On some sort of silly written
test about sex-appropriate behavior and interests, jdeigert and I both came
out in the middle.  He likes babies and cooking, I find carpentry and
electronics interesting (but am not all that good at them).  Omni likes
cooking and sewing and airplanes and car repair, and is a sweet nonagressive
person who expresses himself very well, which in the still-pioneer-mentality
USA is associated more with women than men.  If omni had been born a woman,
I would not be surprised if he also felt out of place in some ways.  Is there
anyone in this conference who thinks they are 100% one sex in behavior and
attitudes and interests?  Who would prefer to wear only clothing typical of
one sex?  Have close friends only of one sex?

response 10 of 54:

Jul 3 05:03 UTC 1999

   I saw a story on 20/20 about a woman who used to be a man that raced cars
for a living. He is currently trying to get back to where he was when he raced
as a man. He told of wearing girls clothes to bed, and in later years wearing
panties under his male clothes when he raced. This was really resonant,
because I did and am doing the same thing. I don't want to go any farther
right now.
   Would I be happier as a woman? It's hard to say, so I cannot answer that.
I really cannot tell anyone about this because no one expects something like
this come out of my mouth. I mean, no one in my family wants to listen, so
I don't expect them to be tolerant and accepting of this. 
   No one wants to be labeled a freak. We try to get through life with as
little pain as we can, but sometimes there is pain no matter what we do. I
don't want to be called a fag, or a drag-queen just because I happen to wear
panties and bras. My mother doesn't really understand what transgenderism is.
My sister thinks I shouldn't be wearing lingerie at all, and I don't care what
my brother in law thinks, but I suspect that he is as TG unfriendly as my
sister is. I've been thinking about telling my cousin, but I'm not sure how
understanding she'd really be, but it is worth a shot.

response 12 of 54:

Jul 4 05:55 UTC 1999

  None that I can think of. I mean, I'm not a really social person, and in
the circles that I travel in, most people are very, very conservative. I'm
afraid that I am alone in this for now, except for the people here in this
conference.

response 14 of 54:

Jul 4 17:51 UTC 1999

From what I have read, a sizable percentage of married hetero men are also
interested in wearing women's underwear.  One explanation is that it lets them
express the feminine aspects of their personality.  Often the wives do not
mind and actually enjoy helping them shop for lingerie.

I recall my brother once trying on a wig (long blond, of course).  We have
a photo of him.  Also tried on a dress.  I ran across my mother's diary in
which she noted that she and my father were shocked and thought he should be
sent to a psychiatrist.  (This was also the suggested cure for bedwetting).
My brother never has been romantically interested in men, he just thought it
was interesting to try on women's clothing.  Seems to be a great deal of
social pressure preventing men from doing so.  I was also punished when i
complained about having to wear a dress on a non-school day by being forced
to wear it all weekend.  Somehow my parents seem to have thought that if I
was forced to dress a certain way I would start liking it.  Odd.

I am presently wearing a dress, it is the coolest item of clothing that I own.
(Bathing suits are too sticky).
JIm is stuck wearing shorts and a shirt, which are warmer.  

Do any women secretly wear articles of men's clothing?  

Have any men reading this ever dressed as a woman (for Halloween, for
instance) and if so, did you feel different?

response 16 of 54:

Jul 5 13:03 UTC 1999

        Women doen't seem to have fetishism nearly as often as men;  I'm not
sure of any statistically valid surveys on the matter, and it's just a gut
feeling, but it really doesn't seem to be as common among women.  The
short-circuit just doesn't happen.

response 18 of 54:

Jul 6 11:49 UTC 1999

        I was thinking more along the lines of PVC and spandex ...

response 20 of 54:

Jul 7 01:04 UTC 1999

PVC?  You mean like pipe?

response 22 of 54:

Jul 7 20:09 UTC 1999

There's a flexible form of PVC which is not unlike rubber or vinyl in texture
and appearance.

response 24 of 54:

Jul 8 21:27 UTC 1999

swimming pools, movie stars