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What is the sound of one item being entered.
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Apr 23 23:12 UTC 1994 |
What good koans do you know?
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| 31 responses total. |
carl
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response 1 of 31:
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Apr 24 11:57 UTC 1994 |
I'm not sure if it's a koan, but a teacher I used to have would
talk about drinking tea from an empty cup.
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remmers
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response 2 of 31:
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Apr 24 17:50 UTC 1994 |
none: Could you describe the general form of a koan, and give an example
or two? That way, in case I don't know any, I might be able to make
some up.
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vishnu
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response 3 of 31:
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Apr 26 01:20 UTC 1994 |
Well, this isn't very informative, but..
_ ..
ko*an (ko' a n') n. A riddle in the form of a paradox used in Zen
Buddhism as an aid to meditation and a means of gaining intuitive
knowledge. [Japanese : ko, public + an, matter.]
Just pretend that the two dots are above the a.
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robh
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response 4 of 31:
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Apr 27 12:42 UTC 1994 |
You know, something like "If a tree falls in the forest and no one
is there to hear it, does it make a sound?"
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randall
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response 5 of 31:
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Apr 28 01:35 UTC 1994 |
From a perfectly scientific stand point, the answer is no. Sound waves are
not actual "Sound" until they are recieve by the ear.
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mneme
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response 6 of 31:
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Apr 28 05:47 UTC 1994 |
Nah, the "tree falling in the forest" stuff is just european folk philosopy.
The most well known Koan is the old "what is the sound of one hand clapping."
In addition to "What is Zen? Zen is eating while eating, walking while
walking, and sleeping while sleeping" and "Before you study Zen, a mountain is
just a mountain. After you have studied zen for some time, a mountain is
revealed to be much more, for you becomre aware of the whole interconnection
of animals, rocks, and trees that it consists of. But once you have atained
enlighenment, a mountain is just a mountain."
Zen Koans tend to very simply explain the complexities of zen, and are
therefore rather obscure to almost anyone who hasn't atained satori (Zen
enlightenment). But they are fun.
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scheme
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response 7 of 31:
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May 8 06:17 UTC 1994 |
the sound of an item being entered is the sound of me pressing keys.
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none
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response 8 of 31:
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May 15 22:29 UTC 1994 |
My staff has transformed itself into a dragon and swallowed the world!
Where are the rivers and the mountains and the great earth?
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orinoco
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response 9 of 31:
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May 16 19:45 UTC 1994 |
Right here.
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paulalva
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response 10 of 31:
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Jun 3 03:29 UTC 1994 |
Mystics mistrust the ability of language to apprehend reality. Reality exists
before language. What is a koan? What was the answer before the question was
asked? help conf" ."
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jkrauss
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response 11 of 31:
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Jun 13 21:40 UTC 1994 |
was there an answer before it was answered. isn't it possible that
before we answer a question, there is no answer?
th{_ink about it
^
I
I
line noise
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canis
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response 12 of 31:
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Jun 14 03:59 UTC 1994 |
it is possible, but if a question has no answer then the nonexistance of the
answer is the answer it self.
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brighn
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response 13 of 31:
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Aug 1 18:30 UTC 1994 |
There is an answer before we answer a question, but perhaps not before
we ask a question. The asking of a question is the setting upon a path,
the path which is defined by the question. But just as we can walk
through a forest which has never been walked through before, we can set
out upon an intellectual path that does not exist when we set out upon it.
But we will never know that we have reached the end of the path unless
there is a goal which we have attained. Hence in order for us to know
that we have found the answer to our question, we must know how to recognize
that answer, hence it must have existed before we found it (but it may
develop in the process of our search). Likewise, as there are multiple
ways of walking through the forest that all come to the same place,
so might there be multiple paths to the same answer, and so in one sense
multiple answers within one.
"But why ask me, for I know nothing?" -- Peter Tork, "Head"
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mscan
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response 14 of 31:
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Sep 4 15:36 UTC 1994 |
There is an answer before you ask a question, just as there is the forrest
and the destination before you even recognize the path to exist. The real
question for me, is does the answer really matter? As in the search for
the answer to the simple question "Why we exist?", does the answer really
matter? If it does not matter to me, it is not important. It does not matter
to me.
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brighn
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response 15 of 31:
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Sep 4 17:01 UTC 1994 |
So it is not important.
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vladimir
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response 16 of 31:
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Sep 6 14:08 UTC 1994 |
To Joshua (Re #6): Hei mister, What do you mean by "the European
folk philosophy"? If this here conference presents the American
folk philosophy, it seems to be squalid indeed.
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brighn
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response 17 of 31:
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Sep 6 15:00 UTC 1994 |
I'm not sure American have a very coherent folk phiosophy, since the
rationalist scientist have such a strangelhold on things and want to
deny such things. (I'm missing two s's, I wonder why?)
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vladimir
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response 18 of 31:
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Sep 8 15:44 UTC 1994 |
Don't be so touchy about American things, including philosophy. You told you
have a sense of humor, didn't you? I see you have an inquisitive eye. Let's get
more aquainted with each other? How about a 'US folk philosophy vs. Eur. f.
ph.' contest, or a duel on koans and mondoes (you choose the weapon)?
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brighn
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response 19 of 31:
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Sep 8 16:09 UTC 1994 |
Oh, sorry, Valdimir, I wasn't getting snitty at you, I was getting
snitty at the American acedemics.
I'm not sure what would constitute folk philosophy, and at any rate,
I'm not sure how good a commentator I would be on it, not exactly
fitting the "mainstream" mode. But let's give it a shot: you start.
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vladimir
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response 20 of 31:
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Sep 8 16:47 UTC 1994 |
A preliminary question: what's a mainstream in your opinion?
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brighn
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response 21 of 31:
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Sep 8 19:50 UTC 1994 |
Tricky one. That's like "pornography" -- what is it?
I know I'm not in it. But then, I think most people my generation claim
not to be in the mainstream, so maybe I'm in the mainstream of
non-mainstreamers? :-) Let's see... 80% of Americans claim to be Christian;
I'm not. 30-40% of Americans attend church regularly; I do. (Hee, hee, I am
church.) Almost all Americans claim to have a political party; I don't.
Americans watch TV, in the main (90% have tvs in their homes); I have a tv, but
don't watch it. I haven't seen EITHER ET or Jurassic Park, and have no
intention to do so (although I have seen Star Wars). I like Stone Temple Pilots
but NOT Pearl Jam or Nirvana. I have a Master's degree; most Americans don't. I
have nosteady income; most Americans do. I was called on a survey which listed
ten or so "fads" and asked me if they were on the way in or the way out. I'd
never even HEARD of most of them.
So, whatever the mainstream is, I don't think I'm in it. :-)
That said, one bit of American folk philosophy (to get the ball rolling):
diseases are of two types: those that will kill you within six months,
and those that you can cure if given enough medicine.
Is that the sort of thing you're looking for?
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vladimir
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response 22 of 31:
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Sep 9 10:02 UTC 1994 |
Dear Paul! We are congenial: I also hate movies, have no political views, have
a Doctors degree but have no steady income. I am glad that we met, but let's
continue on a private channel: this place is intended for public exchange, I
guess. Perhaps this item produced little sound when being entered, but it at
least helped me me to find out an interesting man out there.
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brighn
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response 23 of 31:
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Sep 9 14:42 UTC 1994 |
Eh, I don't care if people listen in, and I doubt they do, but if you want
to move off to mail, m me. :-)
I'm glad you think I'm interesting. You sound interesting as well.
Spacibo!
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variable
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response 24 of 31:
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Sep 16 00:44 UTC 1994 |
The mainstream exists becuase there seem to be too many things
out there that people are supposed to be concernecd with. Obviously
they can't be educated on every single issue and aspect of human life,
therefore the mainstream is there so that they may indulge without
investing any intellectual energy. In the case of fashion, music,
food and art it is harmells enough, creating little more than hordes
of polyester wearing disco kings or flannel bedraped grunge
would be rebels. It becomes more dangerous when it spills over
into morality and realigion and politics, where people should be
expending mental energy instead of jumping on the band wagon.
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