Minutes of the Emergency Board Meeting of July 16, 1996

Jul 17 05:09 UTC 1996

Minutes of the Emergency Meeting of the Cyberspace Communications 
Board of Directors, held Tuesday July 16, 1996 in the Dining Commons
of the Michigan Union (basement).

The meeting was called to order by Scott Helmke at 7:38 PM

Directors present:
Scott Helmke (scott), President
Mark Conger (aruba), Treasurer
Steve Weiss (srw), Secretary
Misti Anslin (mta)
Steve Gibbard (scg)
Valerie Mates (popcorn)
Rob Henderson (robh)

All others present:
David Cahill (dpc)
Jan Wolter (janc)
STeve Andre' (steve)
Morgaene (morgaene)
Marcus Watts (mdw)
John Remmers (remmers)
Mary Remmers (chelsea)
Rob Argy (ajax)
Rick Berk (rickyb)

There was no written agenda.  The meeting was called primarily because 
the Building Appeals Board was to have determined the fate of the appeal 
of the decision of the Building Department not to permit Grex to continue 
to occupy the dungeon.

-------- Appeals Board --------

The first item was a recounting of the decision made by the City of Ann Arbor
Building Department Board of Appeals. Valerie Mates reported that they 
decided that they need to do further research before they can come to a
decision in our case. Our case was tabled until next month's meeting of the 
appeals board.

-------- Morgaene's Comments --------

Morgaene asked to make a statement because she had to leave early.

Morgaene stated that a lot of the regular Grex users would like to help out 
in some way. Even though many are students and don't have a lot of money,
she felt that there was the possibility that they could be called on to chip
in to help defray the cost of the move.

Morgaene also stated that she likes the new telnet queue logic, because it
means that she no longer gets shut out completely by the "no ports in use"
message. 

-------- Load, M-Net  --------

There was some ensuing discussion about how badly overloaded Grex is at the
moment and that this is in part due to the fact that M-Net remains down for 
an extended period, recovering from its recent difficulties. Dave Cahill
explained that M-Net could be expected to remain down for about 3 more days.

--------  Sites --------

The next topic of discussion was the various possible sites for Grex to 
relocate to. There were some visits made today to two of them, and so the 
following reports were filed:

-------- Red Cross Site --------

The American Red Cross of Washtenaw County (ARCWC) invited us to come out and
look at the space that they can make available to us in their basement. 
A contingent of board and staff members consisting of Steve Weiss, 
Valerie Mates, Marcus Watts, and STeve Andre' visited the site this morning. 
It is located on Packard Road, near Buhr Park.

The space is small, probably just a little smaller than 100sq ft. , and very
comparable to our current site, except that it is nearly square. It would 
permit sufficient electrical power, although wiring may be required. It would 
be able to have access for the phone lines. There would be adequate 
ventilation. The Red Cross contact is John "Nord" Nordlinger, who seemed
to the four Grexers to have a very nice attitude about our presence. He
was very positive about it.

He took us through a larger room on our way to this area. In this other room
was an impressive array of cast-off computer equipment. When he asked us if
we could somehow help him dispose of this equipment, and we indicated that
we had experience in that particular area, he seemed very pleased with that
answer. 

This space would be in exchange for consulting help and computer services that
we would not find it a burden to provide. There would be no rent to stay here.
That is its strongest advantage. One disadvantage is that this site is the only
 one that we are currently considering that would not allow us to retain 
761-3000. It would not be any different as far as local versus long-distance 
service to any part of the county, however.

No discussion was made with the Red Cross about committing the space for a 
period of time, although we did agree that if we were going to accept this 
offer we would write up an agreement between our organizations.

Steve Weiss is the contact person for this site.

-------- West Huron Site --------

This site is in a commercial building at 416 W. Huron. The site is about 
130 sq. ft. STeve Andre' visited this site today. He reported this 
information.

It is near the phone network interface box. It is an air conditioned 
building, but there is also a vent for this particular area because of the 
special needs of a previous tenant.

The rent is $60/month. We would also pay for our electrical usage, probably
the same way we do now, by reimbursing the landlord based on our 
measurements.

There is parking and bathroom facilities, and a reasonable number of keys
can be made up.

This landlord is leasing on a month-to-month basis. We could probably get 
that increased to a 90 day notice. There was a lot of discussion of the 
risks of such an arrangement. Since it costs Grex over $500 to move its 
phones, we cannot afford to move very often and would like to have a longer 
term commitment. There was disagreement on this subject.

STeve Andre' is the contact person for this site.

-------- Other Sites --------

There are two other sites we are considering. One is commercial space in 
an office building owned by Cottage Inn on Plymouth Road. This space is 150
sq. ft. The price has not been set, although we may have to pay as much as 
$100 per month for this space. The landlord would write a longer lease.

There is also an ISP we are discussing CO-locating with. These details are
not yet resolved, and we are not free to reveal them. If we can come to
an agreement, this is potentially the most interesting looking site of all,
as it affords us the opportunity to enhance our services to our users.

Valerie Mates is the contact person for the ISP.

-------- Mark Conger's Comments --------

Mark Conger made the point that wherever we go we should make sure it is 
legal so we do not have to go through these zoning board and building board 
problems again.

Mark also presented this picture of our income and expenses. These numbers 
are average monthly figures for the calendar year 1995.

Average Monthly Income (all sources): $644
Local dial-up phone costs:           -$269
Average monthly power costs:          -$83

Net available for other expenses, include rent, internet charges,
hardware and staff discretionary spending:   $292/month

This is a rosier picture than he had realized. This is at least partly due 
to the fact that the Sun-4 upgrade had been quite expensive.

-------- Adjournment --------

The meeting was adjourned at 9:05 PM. The next regularly scheduled board
meeting is next week, on Monday, July 22 at 7:30 PM in the Michigan Union.

response 2 of 42:

Jul 17 08:20 UTC 1996

<< and it's a place that aruba could wear his button ... shameless
capitalistic pig plug ... <g> >>
  
ummm, the above information is relieving, if not refreshing - thankxx. 
  
we now have breathing room- good move to appeal the tyrant's "decision."

response 4 of 42:

Jul 17 14:04 UTC 1996

(I trust the Red Cross space has high ceilings?)

response 6 of 42:

Jul 18 10:54 UTC 1996

This item now linked to the move conf.

response 8 of 42:

Jul 18 20:43 UTC 1996

To let those who are trying to keep up on it look in *one* place, while also
keeping the rest of us informed as well.

response 10 of 42:

Jul 19 07:47 UTC 1996

Every other topic we've had to discuss has fitted into an item or two
in coop. The move discussion can too - and does. The real danger is that
another item will be created here and not linked to coop. Many users
are even less likely to read move than to read coop. I suggest that move be
closed down, and we go back to reading about move plans in coop, as is
normal.

response 12 of 42:

Jul 19 13:31 UTC 1996

Here here.  I am not through agora yet, and don't want to even comtemplate
the amount of time it'll take me to get through coop, but I still want to
follow the move.

response 14 of 42:

Jul 19 18:47 UTC 1996

So, may we have a new conference for every new topic in coop, for those
that want to follow that topic, and not all the others? What kind of "part
time" participants do we have? I shall have to remember that the new
policy is to have separate cfs for every important new issue - then we can
all be specialists. 

I think this is a very bad precedent, and should be abandoned right now.

response 16 of 42:

Jul 19 20:00 UTC 1996

   Right, its an unusual case, and therefore reasonable to have
it seperately available.  I'm not usually in favor of this.

response 18 of 42:

Jul 20 03:21 UTC 1996

I don't read Coop, 'cause I'm not a member, but I'm still very interested 
in reading about the move.  Grex is my favorite BBS, and I like to know 
what's happening with this.

response 20 of 42:

Jul 20 11:32 UTC 1996

Gull, you and all other people interested in Grex's policy should read coop.
It is open to all.

I don't read move. There had better not be any items about the move that are
not appearing in coop. Coop is the only conference authorized to talk about
this stuff.

There is no harm to a Move conference as long as it is only links to coop.

When it contains its own items, there is harm, in that people reading it may
think that it is in some way "official".

Grex buiness is conducted in coop. Not move, Not Agora.

That said, I am not the slightest bit worried, as I expect all relevant 
items will get linked to coop, but I do wish people would learn to create 
them in coop.

response 22 of 42:

Jul 20 16:23 UTC 1996

What Rob just said.  I see no reason that policy can't be discussed elsewhere.
OTOH, it's appropriate to have ONE place set aside for that purpose.

response 24 of 42:

Jul 20 17:35 UTC 1996

I agree... This linking-tripe is getting way outta' hand.. Bad enough you 
can't properly "forget" an item, but then to drag in stuff from assorted 
conferences?

Perhaps instead of all the linking, the FW can point folks to the right 
conf and place a NOTE in the right place?