Other mail programs for Grex?

Sep 26 13:03 UTC 1996

   Does anyone know of mail programs for non-experts, besides
Elm and Pine that would run on Grex?

   Recently, I've had a couple of conversations with people who
have been confused about both elmn and pine, and wished their
schools mail program was available here.  When I asked what it
was, they couldn't tell me--they didn't know much about computers
other than hitting certain buttons and getting some expected
reaction.

   But I've heard this comment maybe three times now, and if I
got it right, they aren't using a POP client but something
thats character oriented.  Hence my question: are we missing
out by not offerning some other mail programs?  I didn't think
so but now I wonder.  Probably the people were using something
like a front end for something like mail (thats what it sounded
like with one person), but ya never know.

   I'd really like to see a mail program that offered both
the efficiency of /bin/mail and the ease of use of elm.

   Anyway, if you know of anything, or suspect it, let us know
here.

response 2 of 66:

Sep 26 17:01 UTC 1996

Well, there's the one I use: mh. For functionality, it's hard
to beat. Strictly command-line-oriented in its "pure" form,
though. But the menu-oriented among us can use mh-e, an
interface to mh that works through GNU emacs and looks vaguely
like elm. Those with X Window access can use the xmh or exmh
interfaces (but not on Grex).

Except for elm, pine, mh, and mail, I don't know of any other
Unix mail programs either.

response 4 of 66:

Sep 26 21:08 UTC 1996

My sister's computer system uses a mailer called "magpie".  No idea if it's
easy to use or not.

response 6 of 66:

Sep 28 01:09 UTC 1996

Hint:  The learning curve used to be one of the things that made
M-Net a community.  Everyone had something in common.  Don't be
*too* accomodating.

response 8 of 66:

Sep 28 02:30 UTC 1996

No, I'm quite serious.  It's the commonalities that make a community.
If everyone has had to cross some metaphorical mountains in order to
become part of it, it means something.

response 10 of 66:

Sep 28 16:01 UTC 1996

Configure it and use "Q" instead of "q" to quit.

response 12 of 66:

Sep 29 17:34 UTC 1996

I am committed to breaking down barriers to enter the community.
I am not proud that we offer these barriers. 

response 14 of 66:

Sep 30 15:16 UTC 1996

Well, perhaps we should go back to paper tapes and pucnh cards with all those
little rectangular holes? I see no particular religious legitimization to
command line interfaces. I might be more used to one or another, and therefore
more comforatble with that on a personal basis, but that is not a reason to
impose it on new users. The GUI interface, in my opinion, has several inherent
advantages, especially if you are trying to increase public access. If you
want to have a "club", then that is another story.

response 16 of 66:

Sep 30 21:25 UTC 1996

This is relevant?

response 18 of 66:

Oct 2 03:24 UTC 1996

Re #14:  There is also the impact of the "user-friendly" features on
the scarce system resources, such as Internet link bandwidth.  This
should be considered before adding them, IMHO.

response 20 of 66:

Oct 2 16:43 UTC 1996

/re #18 - good point russ, but consider the real goal of grex. "Agora" and
"Grex" are not translated as concepts and powers limited to a few, but are
(or should be IMHO) inclusive.  Or, I may not understand.  I just don't think
someone should be required to learn a difficult (relatively) command line
interface to communication in order to participate and provide value.
MIcrosoft did not grow by enhancing the ALT key combinations of Wordstar.
Using advanced Windows-based spreadsheets is (to me) infinitely more
satisfying than Visicalc, even though I remember it and Multiplan fondly.
These are examples, hopfully, in explanation of my earlier inadequate post.
Bandwidth can be had if the need, demand, conviction, and sense of purpose
are there.  Unless, as I said, a club is the goal. Of course you cannot
provide unlimited pipes to everyone without an unlimited amount of resources,
and that will not happen. But growth and increase in social value is certainly
possible -- if it desireable.

response 22 of 66:

Oct 2 17:20 UTC 1996

I don't think growth is desirable for its own sake, but you will notice a
lot of cheering every time capacity or speed are increased, though these
immediately lead to growth. Coming "down to a choice" is just deciding to
plan, which one can start at any time. Up until now, there has been no
planning on Grex - it just expands as resources (human and $$) permit. One
cause of this that I observe is the almost universal response that more
capacity and speed are unlimited "goods". I think I see a lot of evidence
that this is incorrect. The system is now no faster than it was before
several upgrades in hardware, although a lot more people are using it, and
yet most of those lot more people are not conference participants (and it
would be hell if they were). So, where are things going? 

response 24 of 66:

Oct 3 16:06 UTC 1996

Which is a momentary pleasure (in that sense, I "cheer" when the link goes
down and I can get in by modem 8^}).