"What do we want for Grex?"

Oct 2 06:13 UTC 1994

In Item 10, Response 53, in the course of discussing having a POP server
on Grex, Kent Nassen asked:

"   the Big Question:  what do we want for Grex?  This is something that
has been discussed but I don't believe has ever (or probably will ever be)
well-agreed upon.  We can't even seem to get a consensus over whether the
services Grex provides (such as mail, bbs, finger) are there to contribute
to a sense of Grexian community, whether that Grexian community is tied to
a larger community (and how to tie it), etc."

The Big Question has a Big Answer. I quote from the Grex Articles of
Incorporation:

ARTICLE 2
        The purposes for which the corporation is organized are
  set forth, as follows:
        The Corporation is organized for such charitable and
  educational purposes as may qualify it for exemption from the
  federal income tax under Section 501(c)3 of the Internal
  Revenue Code of 1986, as amended (or the corresponding
  provisions of any future United States internal revenue law.)
  More specifically, such purposes include, but are not limited
  to, the advancement of public education and scientific
  endeavor through interaction with computers, and humans via
  computers, using computer conferencing. Further purposes
  include the exchange of scientific and technical information
  about the various aspects of computer science, such as
  operating systems, computer networks, and computer
  programming.

Now, this doesn't answer the question of whether we want to support a POP
server, or not, but it does address the question o "whether that Grexian
community is tied to a larger community". The answer appears to be that
it is - to the communities of public service, and scientific and
technical information, and all.

But sometimes it doesn't seem that way. I was struck by this in Item 138
in oldagora, on the subject of "I say that it would be good to ________
for the future of Grex". Almost all the responses concerned Grex's
hardware and software, but not the purposes of the organization, which are
the true future of the organization. 

I have the sense that, despite the statements in ARTICLE 2, Grex's
purposes are not widely understood and appreciated. I imagine users
looking at ARTICLE 2, and seeing only legalistic words: as though they
were one of those crazy 3-D pictures - if you defocus your eyes, you
can see dancing elephants.
 
What the words say, though, are by no means a bad set of purposes for Grex
to pursue, and that set places us directly within a "larger community". 

Despite this, there is no question that the majority of users of Grex
will not base their actions upon ARTICLE 2, and that is to be expected,
since they are the PUBLIC that Grex serves. There are, in fact, at
least three communities that constitute Grex:

1.  Those that do all the work. They are mostly members, but may not
    be. They keep the system running, handle the "business" of the
    corporation, fairwitness the conferences, and manage public
    service programs within the framework of ARTICLE 2.

2.  Those that contribute the money that keeps the organization
    functioning. These include those in the above group, plus all
    those that join Grex, for whatever reasons (some for "services,
    some to support the concept and purposes of Grex).

3.  The public, who are not concerned with Grex's inner workings
    nor for that matter explicitly with how Grex raises the funds
    to operate, but who enjoy the public services provided by Grex (and
    described in ARTICLE 2).

These (overlapping) groups have different involvements and different
expectations. It is, in fact, Group 1 that makes it work for the benefit
of Group 3, with the support of Group 2. I think many of the apparent
different perspectives that have been alluded to, arise from which
group is speaking. But actually, it would be best, if all three groups
were aware of the *central* theme of Grex - expressed in ARTICLE 2.

That answers, for me, the question "What do we want for Grex?" What is
your answer?


    

response 2 of 110:

Oct 2 23:14 UTC 1994

My answer would be that when we get Grex to be stable, then we can think
of more philosophical goals of helping the community at large. Right now,
Grex is in seriously bad shape.

        Pattie

response 4 of 110:

Oct 3 01:46 UTC 1994

Well, for a start, losing files and accounts because of a bad disk
is preety bad.  IMHO, of course.  >8)

response 6 of 110:

Oct 3 03:11 UTC 1994

 I see ISDN as a definite future possibility. I see a connection
devoted to news/mail/other. I see more people volunteering their
knowledge and capabilities to staff. 

 I see new conferences popping up nearly bi-weekly. I see people
from all over the world dropping by to see this mecca that they've
heard so much about. I see people sending thank you's to staff
every once in a while to let them know that their nearly superhuman
efforts *are* appreciated.

 I think that these are things that I'd want for Grex, and I think
they're realistic *short-term* goals.

response 8 of 110:

Oct 3 04:13 UTC 1994

kent, I agree. I think we each have to decide for ourselves what we'd like
to do for Grex before we can begin to convince other people that what we
would like to do for Grex is something that should be done for Grex. 

response 10 of 110:

Oct 3 14:16 UTC 1994

Rane,

As always, you talk in the hypothetical, while I deal in the practical.
What practical ideas or examples do you have? What projects do you have
in mind that are practical, immediate and doable?

        Pattie

response 12 of 110:

Oct 4 19:47 UTC 1994

Rane,

The project I'd like to undertake is hindered by the current problesm
Grex is having. Once those are settled, I hope to get working with the
folks at washtenaw literacy.

        Pattie

response 14 of 110:

Oct 6 00:21 UTC 1994

Regarding the staff conference:  Although there have been occasional
outbursts of policy discussion in the past, I and other stomped on
them, and they've stopped happening -- I think folks have got straight
that it's not an appropriate use of the conference.  Nowadays the
conference is used to discuss security issues and technical details of
how to keep Grex running smoothly, which was the original intent.
Board members who aren't also staff members don't even respond there
much.

Aside from that, I agree with the general sentiment Mary is expressing.
Although we can and should look for ways to do more, Grex is already
fulfilling its mission to a large extent.

response 16 of 110:

Oct 10 06:38 UTC 1994

Grex provides a mechanism - a machine - thorough which ANY pern who
has reached a particular competence level with a terminal and a modem
and a phone line can/will/does "publish" thoughts as they damn well
see fit. Some are more "fit" than others, but that is an iindividual
and independant judgement call- whooppee.
 
As part of the Computer Rehab Project, I'm about to (hold breath adn
cross fingers) receive a bunch of terminals for Grex. And there 
might be a couple modems too.
  
A while back there was a thought about installing something (like a
terminal/modem/phoneline) at some "public place" so that a larer
portion of the general public could participate.
  
I liked that idea then; I like that idea now; maybe the hardware
will become available rsn - and I mean within the next 7 days!
  
Once Grex receives the hardware we can consider some sort of "test"
location for the above idea, which was someone else's, not mine.
 
from one perspective, implementing the above would GREATLY enhance
"fulfilling its mission," imnsho.

response 18 of 110:

Oct 12 04:09 UTC 1994

        re #7, what would it mean to cite goals for "us" instead of "I"?  I
am not qualified to have goals for the two of us (or the 2000 of us);
neither is anyone else.

response 20 of 110:

Oct 12 06:31 UTC 1994

Re #18: read Article 2. It states the goals for "us", as the founding
principles of the corporation. We *are* entitled to have goals for
all of us, based on Article 2, which are also the reasons for the
existence of Grex. Others can have other goals and desires, but they
are not Grex's. (If there were enough disagreement with Article 2, it
could of course be amended, to make Grex a different kind of organization.
However, I assert that hardly better purposes and goals could be created
for *some* computer-oriented organization, so it might as well be Grex.)

response 22 of 110:

Oct 13 05:54 UTC 1994

Now what is, do more of what it says are our purposes. Conferencing is
a major interest of many, and that is "mostly" covered. Now, how about
educational and scientific programs?   Or, finding good homes for lonely
XTs? The thing is, to DO it, not just contemplate it.

response 24 of 110:

Oct 13 23:44 UTC 1994

I'd be interested in that sort of thing.