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Grex > Cars > #137: Biodiesel in Ann Arbor | |
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| Author |
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gull
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Biodiesel in Ann Arbor
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Apr 4 15:44 UTC 2005 |
I just arranged to buy a friend's 1983 Mercedes 300 turbodiesel. I'd
like to try biodiesel in it, some time. I'm curious if there's anywhere
in Ann Arbor that sells biodiesel or biodiesel blend. Something like
B20 (20% biodiesel, 80% petrodiesel) would probably be ideal.
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| 8 responses total. |
gull
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response 1 of 8:
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Apr 16 21:31 UTC 2005 |
To answer my own question, the Meijer gas stations on Carpenter road and
Lohr Road both have B20 pumps. Today I filled the Mercedes with B20 at the
Lohr Road station for $2.299/gallon, $0.10 less than they were selling
straight petrodiesel for.
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tod
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response 2 of 8:
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May 3 18:59 UTC 2005 |
What is the gas milage with that car?
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gull
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response 3 of 8:
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May 3 20:38 UTC 2005 |
I haven't had it long enough to get good average figures, yet. My first
tank consisted of about half long-distance highway driving, and half my
usual daily commute (which includes about ten miles of freeway and five
miles of surface streets.) I got 28 mpg. My second tank consisted only
of my commute, and that one was just over 26 mpg. The previous owner
drove almost exclusively on the highway, and claimed 30 mpg; based on
these numbers, I'm willing to believe he was getting close to that.
I think part of the reason the milage suffers on my commute is the car
doesn't fully warm up until about halfway through it. Diesels don't run
nearly as efficiently when cold. I also believe it's in need of a valve
adjustment. (Older Mercedes diesels use solid lifters.)
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gull
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response 4 of 8:
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Jul 18 22:11 UTC 2005 |
Biodiesel is apparently not all it's cracked up to be:
"It takes 27 percent more energy to turn soybeans into biodiesel fuel
and more than double the energy produced is needed to do the same to
sunflower plants, the study found."
(http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/ethanol_study)
Ethanol is even worse.
One question that isn't answered in the article is whether biodiesel
could do better than breaking even if a different feedstock were used.
Soybeans may not be the best plant for this, even if it's a convenient
one in the U.S.
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rcurl
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response 5 of 8:
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Jul 18 23:43 UTC 2005 |
One has to be very careful to state ALL the conditions and assumptions in
such comparisons. While growing corn for oil to convert to biodiesel may
not be energy efficient, it may be more so using used vegetable oils to
convert to biodiesel, since the oil costs only for collection and
transportation. It also matters of course, as bull points out, which oil
is used. I have not yet seen a comparison that is complete enough to fully
understand what the assumptions are.
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gull
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response 6 of 8:
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Jul 19 14:18 UTC 2005 |
Insightful commentary from a mailing list I'm on:
The precise numbers may have some controversy, but the overall
picture is pretty accurate, IF you assume factory-farmed virgin soy
oil as the feedstock.
The same group published a study that demonstrates that EACH calorie
of food we eat requires TEN calories of fossil fuel to produce!
Diesel tractors till the land, fertilizers made from natural gas are
applied, diesel engines transport the beans large distances, fossil
fuel is used to process it, the methanol used to make biodiesel comes
from petroleum, the fuel is again transported using diesel. With such
numbers, it's actually a wonder one can produce biodiesel with as
LITTLE as 27% loss!
Note that there are a LOT of better ways to make biodiesel.
Commercial biodiesel is currently an unholy product of farm price
subsidies. Rapeseed oil is the preferred choice, and I believe David
Pimentel (study author) noted a shift to positive EROEI (energy
returned over energy invested) with rapeseed's yield of about double
that of soy.
I'm planning a project for summer 2006 where I will produce rapeseed
oil, using only rapeseed oil in its production. Initial research
indicates a possible range of 7:1 to 15:1 for oil (not biodiesel)
production -- MUCH better than 1:1.27!
The study came from Cornell University's environmental research lab.
They're good people. Their goal is to make sure alternative fuels are
actually produced sustainably, instead of being yet another
"greenwashing" of big business profits, exploiting environmentally-
conscious consumers. They are also very hard on Bush's vaunted
"hydrogen economy" -- hydrogen currently comes from fossil fuel, and
consumes many times more it's energy content during production. It's
EROEI is estimate as poor as 1:3 -- using THREE times as much fuel as
is produced!
There are no easy answers. If you make your own biodiesel in your
garage out of waste oil, you're absolved. If you buy it from Archer
Daniels Midland, it's just a different Big Business picking your pocket.
:::: Being human being isn't being human. Are we human beings, or
humans, being? ::::
:::: Jan Steinman <http://www.IslandSeeds.org>
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rcurl
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response 7 of 8:
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Jul 19 14:54 UTC 2005 |
(Rapeseed oil = Canola Oil, which is a euphemism to avoid the word
"rape".)
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ball
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response 8 of 8:
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Jan 9 05:20 UTC 2006 |
I notice that a new filling station near my workplace has
E-85 pumps. I wonder what the EROEI on that is.
"Old McDonald had a farm, E.R.O.E.I."
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